It's probably true that for average consumers mobile devices will be hot sell. If you are rich enough you'd rather buy something that you'll use on the go or once in a while. People that are consuming media will not need a full blown desktop or a laptop even. I personally work on a laptop and a desktop. I would not be able to use a tablet to do any work, nor would I be designing on a phone. But for the average person or average market it works. They obviously are targeting that market. Who wouldn't want to make that cash? If you are rich enough and work with a desktop you might have them all. I remembering seeing this guy with a laptop and he had a tablet and he probably didn't need both. But Microsoft needs to gain market-share there since it's being taken over by apple and a bit by google. If they don't move in advancement in that direction they will lose to those two companies. I don't think they'd want that. That being said they still should have not made it more difficult to use on the desktop. But they needed their metro stuff since they are already late to the party.
This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.
- Thread starter HPDeskjet
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Who really uses desktops? Are you serious man? There are not just millions but billions of desktops still being built and used, WAY more than tablets IMO. Nothing, and I mean nothing will be replacing the desktop PC platform anytime soon. Period, end of discussion.
The death of the desktop has been greatly exaggerated.
I use my tablet (iPad) for reading books, playing some games and some casual web browsing and/or research. It's a gorgeous machine and I really enjoy using it. However ... the moment I need to compose an e-mail longer than a few lines, write code, manage my website or do anything where I create content then off to my desktop (or laptop) running Win7 I go. I wouldn't presume to even try to develop software or do serious content creation on the iPad. A touch-centric interface is very nice and pleasant to use while I'm in content receive mode but the moment I need to do anything "serious" it's back to the keyboard. It's going to be that way for the duration.
The tablet "revolution" is changing the ratio of device use, certainly, but making the desktop go away it is not.
Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't have the vaguest idea of the penetration of the desktop system into the market.
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That would have been "Intelligent Thinking" as far as having some foresight as to how 8 would work out on the desktop environment. But MS strayed off the beaten path to go out on a limb trashing any form of traditional desktop option to slam Metro in your face!
And certainly not everyone is hand held only! You can text on your cell phone these days but would you want that for your desktop?
1. The only big flop Microsoft really had in modern Windows was ME.
2. Vista flopped, not because of MS, but because of OEM's sold crap machines and called them good when they knew they wernt
and Third Party Vendors not having drivers ready till mid summer (nearly 6 months after release)
There was nothing wrong over all with Vista running on the proper hardware, but people went cheap and the OEM's let them order Vista with only 512M of ram, They knew better than to do that, but they just wanted the sale. That was not the fault of Vista or MS. Quit Comparing Vista to ME,, cause it wasn't.
How do I know this, cause I sold PC's around that time, people wanted cheap hardware and skimpped on ram.
They wanted a $199 special that would run like a $1000 machine. Sorry, you won't get away with a Chevet engine in a Corvette.
Everyone hated XP till SP2 came out (and even then, a lot of people weren't budging from 98SE or W2K), then everyone loved it and the swore they would never change, Now 7 is out and everyone is saying it again, "I won't be moving from 7, why I gotta do that, blah blah waaa waa."
Same story different decade, some things will never change.
Could we take this as far back as Windows 3 and 3.11? Or yes, I think we can.
2. Vista flopped, not because of MS, but because of OEM's sold crap machines and called them good when they knew they wernt
and Third Party Vendors not having drivers ready till mid summer (nearly 6 months after release)
There was nothing wrong over all with Vista running on the proper hardware, but people went cheap and the OEM's let them order Vista with only 512M of ram, They knew better than to do that, but they just wanted the sale. That was not the fault of Vista or MS. Quit Comparing Vista to ME,, cause it wasn't.
How do I know this, cause I sold PC's around that time, people wanted cheap hardware and skimpped on ram.
They wanted a $199 special that would run like a $1000 machine. Sorry, you won't get away with a Chevet engine in a Corvette.
Everyone hated XP till SP2 came out (and even then, a lot of people weren't budging from 98SE or W2K), then everyone loved it and the swore they would never change, Now 7 is out and everyone is saying it again, "I won't be moving from 7, why I gotta do that, blah blah waaa waa."
Same story different decade, some things will never change.
Could we take this as far back as Windows 3 and 3.11? Or yes, I think we can.
PaulGo
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I used Vista 64. The biggest problem I found was the lack of 64 bit drivers and some bugs in the OS. Some of these bugs got resolved in the service packs but Microsoft rushed the release of Vista. Windows 7 was really Vista as Vista should have been released. I have really tried to like and use Windows 8, but for a desktop use I find in a major step backwards in usability.
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I remember people raving about XP before SP2 was even out calling NTFS the secure way to go but opting to run FireFox over the security hole laden IE 6! Can't blame them for opting to get out of IE 6 however.
I never ran ME skipping over from 98SE to XP SP1 originally until Vista was out. But even before the previous version's release I found XP ran far better with 2gb of ram installed! What does that say about OEMs cutting corners when preinstalling the then newer larger Windows? CHEAPO! Rippoff! You paid the extra to get an old machine running half way decent even with XP!
Vista wasn't a flop as far as design since MS was delayed until working things out with it! You have that correct. It was far more stable then XP ever thought of being until finally SP3 was out with all of the some 1,000+ neglected fixes it needed. Many simply labeled it as the crap OS and stuck with either 98 or 2000 as long as they could.
Here I ran the XP/Vista dual boot until the 7 RC was out and knew then that 7 was the solution for what was needed here. MS had learned from the previous two versions on how to make an OS work! Too bad 8 isn't another example of MS learning from 7's sucess as far as the user interface when it comes back to the desktop user and not the Tablet PC. MS seems to have abandoned the concept of a productive workstation and is now in the experimental stage.
I never ran ME skipping over from 98SE to XP SP1 originally until Vista was out. But even before the previous version's release I found XP ran far better with 2gb of ram installed! What does that say about OEMs cutting corners when preinstalling the then newer larger Windows? CHEAPO! Rippoff! You paid the extra to get an old machine running half way decent even with XP!
Vista wasn't a flop as far as design since MS was delayed until working things out with it! You have that correct. It was far more stable then XP ever thought of being until finally SP3 was out with all of the some 1,000+ neglected fixes it needed. Many simply labeled it as the crap OS and stuck with either 98 or 2000 as long as they could.
Here I ran the XP/Vista dual boot until the 7 RC was out and knew then that 7 was the solution for what was needed here. MS had learned from the previous two versions on how to make an OS work! Too bad 8 isn't another example of MS learning from 7's sucess as far as the user interface when it comes back to the desktop user and not the Tablet PC. MS seems to have abandoned the concept of a productive workstation and is now in the experimental stage.
You have to realize though, This was the beginning of the real concerted push towards 64-bit, 64bit was still only used by a very minority of users.
I won't say there weren't any problems with Vista, there were. But they were minor/minimal and worked out with SP's as all new win os's are, always. Again, I go back to win3 and 3.11 then ,,, 95 is to 98SE as Vista was to 7. This is nothing new. And the arguments are identical in every release. You can even say, as XP was to XP SP3.
The only real problem with 8 is the Tile UI, I will give people that, it's not very accommodating for a desktop/laptop system. but it is not impossible to use the OS, it's like people are saying they have to lift 500 pounds up a hill to get a cup of water, Really? come on, it's not that bad. Other than that, it's a pretty solid OS. Boots faster, runs smoother and is more secure than 7.
I mean, people are going off the deep end, as they have every other time.
I still remember all the people (me included) saying, "screw Xp, I'll switch to linux." yet none of them did for long, if at all.
I do agree with that. This is an experimental stage for MS.
And let me add that, I am already advising certain people to take a look at 8 (from a tech stand point) and not listen to the bad press 8 is getting. Really look at it and then decide. Because it really isn't as bad as people are saying.
I do however, recommend certain average users stick with 7 till the next OS and skip this one.
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There's no dispute on the core elements like I was saying before having seen improvements. There are compatibility issues gamers as well as desktop app users will run into however. Despite the roar of how much better gaming is on 8 by some blog writers there's a reality check that comes in as well.
The move by MS to replace the useless Windows Defender and rename the much now seen improved version of the Security Essentials actually able to detect malwares for a change was a smart move finally seen by MS. Too bad it was only thought of for 8 and not for 7.
The boot time as with any newer version was tweaked to see it load faster to the Lock screen, Start screen, or desktop while the background processes still take time to load up in the background! It still takes as long as it does with 7 to see everything up fully! The shutdown time was another registry value change from the 20,000 value on the WaitToKillServices for XP and Vista, 12,000 for 7, and now brought down to 5,000 for 8.
A tweak here and a tweak there while the main gui and layout to find the Control Panel for instance is jumping all over the place for some options in one right click menu in the Start screen corner to bringing out the Crawler Settings and Apps bar to locate others! They have the average user going around in circles!
That brings everything right back to the need for bringing in the 3rd party solutions like the Classic Shell, LiberKey for CP items as well as some other options, RocketDock will certainly have a place on 8! For the average desktop user don't count on 9, 10, 11.... and whatever to follow as being back to the usual again! MS apparently has other aims at what they think a desktop gui should be like.
The move by MS to replace the useless Windows Defender and rename the much now seen improved version of the Security Essentials actually able to detect malwares for a change was a smart move finally seen by MS. Too bad it was only thought of for 8 and not for 7.
The boot time as with any newer version was tweaked to see it load faster to the Lock screen, Start screen, or desktop while the background processes still take time to load up in the background! It still takes as long as it does with 7 to see everything up fully! The shutdown time was another registry value change from the 20,000 value on the WaitToKillServices for XP and Vista, 12,000 for 7, and now brought down to 5,000 for 8.
A tweak here and a tweak there while the main gui and layout to find the Control Panel for instance is jumping all over the place for some options in one right click menu in the Start screen corner to bringing out the Crawler Settings and Apps bar to locate others! They have the average user going around in circles!
That brings everything right back to the need for bringing in the 3rd party solutions like the Classic Shell, LiberKey for CP items as well as some other options, RocketDock will certainly have a place on 8! For the average desktop user don't count on 9, 10, 11.... and whatever to follow as being back to the usual again! MS apparently has other aims at what they think a desktop gui should be like.
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I have to agree! Besides the gui change where you can still opt for a list of 3rd party OS tools compatibility issues and the apparent lack of driver support being available as seen for 7 will force many to skip this one over.
The two main problems Vista ran into was simply lack of driver support from the start and why MS stressed OEMs to have drivers ready for 7 as well as the understated minimum system requirements MS originally had for the previous version. That allowed the OEMs to skimp heavily on their specs for new machines with Vista preinstalled.
The two main problems Vista ran into was simply lack of driver support from the start and why MS stressed OEMs to have drivers ready for 7 as well as the understated minimum system requirements MS originally had for the previous version. That allowed the OEMs to skimp heavily on their specs for new machines with Vista preinstalled.
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How about tens of millions of office workers?
And not to mention educational facilites, defence/police forces, government offices, serious desktop users ... and the list goes on.
I consider every OS that I have tried from W98 thru to 7, (with the exception of Millenium which I skipped), to be an improvement on the previous one. OK Vista took a bit longer to get the bugs sorted out, but still better than XP.
Can't say the same of 8. It has radically departed from the general structure of all past versions. And I have no doubt it will cause mayhem to the average joe.
Smartfone/tablet users will be OK. However the skills involved in using these devices does not carry over carte blanche into a desktop PC.
I have a Sony Android Smartfone, and there is no comparison between that and desktop. In fact I think of it as a hybrid computer/phone and not really that good at either. Try typing a word doco on a tiny screen. And the web sites need to be magnified 300 - 400% to make them readable, with 3 or 4 scrolls to read a line. You can't print a hard copy receipt for bank transactions. And so it goes on.
Can't say the same of 8. It has radically departed from the general structure of all past versions. And I have no doubt it will cause mayhem to the average joe.
Smartfone/tablet users will be OK. However the skills involved in using these devices does not carry over carte blanche into a desktop PC.
I have a Sony Android Smartfone, and there is no comparison between that and desktop. In fact I think of it as a hybrid computer/phone and not really that good at either. Try typing a word doco on a tiny screen. And the web sites need to be magnified 300 - 400% to make them readable, with 3 or 4 scrolls to read a line. You can't print a hard copy receipt for bank transactions. And so it goes on.
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No matter how many times marketing agencies, and companies CLAIM something utterly absurd, it is very difficult to completely discount the many voices of intelligent, reasoned, critically thinking, independent consumers with money to spend. Thank you, Mustang!
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Tepid what about the iOpener? The so-called future of computing eh? The all in one web appliance.
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Wasn't that ironic the one retail chain store that actually carried netbooks locally here went bankrupt! You don't see them in Walmarts which are all over the place while Target or Best Buy likely will.
Netbooks or other tiny screen hand helds are conveniences to sell. Ask yourself however if you would want to try running a full screen pc game on a what? Some type of smart phone? It doesn't work! On a netbook even you would hardly see more then puzzle games for the obvious reasons of hardware limitations.
You still need the large screen and horse power on the hood for cpu and graphics. Now you come to the main desktop apps like MS Office and have the other elements of a typical workstation while you can get away with running a laptop. There's no confusion as to the vast differences between all that and your Android or IPad!
As for Web TV that initially brought what you now would see replaced by XFinity or other ISP online entertainment. The difference now is being able to log in and watch while on the go with your laptop or simply logging in on someone else's pc rather then being glued to the tv set in your living room with a controller box option.
The main difference however besides that is that Web TV produces it own series while newer services by ISPs pipe regular aired as well as cable shows out on the web. Web television - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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I bought my Dell Inspiron 17R specifically for that reason: to sit it out. I wanted to get as high-performance a machine as I could afford, nail Win7 onto it and keep it for a long time. I have no idea how well Win8 will do but after playing with the thing for close to a year I realized that it just isn't viable. Let's see what the landscape looks like in 5 or 6 years, eh?
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