This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.
- Thread starter HPDeskjet
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Well they way they went about introducing the torn up desktop with Tablet gui replacement no wonder they are hearing about it! ME or Media Edition was the first deployment of features included in Windows rather then options to find on the installation disk like the 9x add and remove components. But Fat had it's day!
With Vista the big mistake wasn't so much the larger OS which MS learned from to see 7 introduce the MinWin kernel but the removal of support for Fat only to be returned with 7. And you wonder 7's backward compatibility surpassed Vista's?! With 8 however a good deal of backward compatibilty is now being replaced by Metro Apps while that may also see a name change!
With Vista the big mistake wasn't so much the larger OS which MS learned from to see 7 introduce the MinWin kernel but the removal of support for Fat only to be returned with 7. And you wonder 7's backward compatibility surpassed Vista's?! With 8 however a good deal of backward compatibilty is now being replaced by Metro Apps while that may also see a name change!
PaulGo
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Windows 8 review: Yes, it's that bad
A desktop OS for tablets and a tablet OS for desktops, Windows 8 is guaranteed to disappoint nearly everyone
By Woody Leonhard | InfoWorld
...From the user's standpoint, Windows 8 is a failure -- an awkward mishmash that pulls the user in two directions at once. Users attracted to the new touch-friendly Metro GUI will dislike the old touch-hostile desktop underneath. By the same token, users who rely on the traditional Windows desktop will dislike having to navigate Metro to find settings and apps they intuitively locate in Windows 7. Microsoft has moved the cheese.
Full article at:
Windows 8 review: Yes, it's that bad | Microsoft Windows - InfoWorld
A desktop OS for tablets and a tablet OS for desktops, Windows 8 is guaranteed to disappoint nearly everyone
By Woody Leonhard | InfoWorld
...From the user's standpoint, Windows 8 is a failure -- an awkward mishmash that pulls the user in two directions at once. Users attracted to the new touch-friendly Metro GUI will dislike the old touch-hostile desktop underneath. By the same token, users who rely on the traditional Windows desktop will dislike having to navigate Metro to find settings and apps they intuitively locate in Windows 7. Microsoft has moved the cheese.
Full article at:
Windows 8 review: Yes, it's that bad | Microsoft Windows - InfoWorld
Rubbish! Comments from an old codger with tunnel vision.
I have seen horrible reviews from expert movie critics
that cannot fathom a popular success.
XP Professional is still widely used in offices around the globe.
Windows 7 could still remain in use well beyond 2020.
I do not really believe users
will want to stay with 7 many, many years into the future.
By 2020, we will probably have seen an evolution of platforms
designed for business and the next generations of youth.
Windows 9, 10, 11, 12 etc...
I think I will expire first...
Windows 8 will not be a failure,
8 is not guaranteed to disappoint nearly everyone.
It will be another controversial business
decision and money making enterprise.
One cannot succeed in business without risk.
If you don't like it,
don't buy it.
Do you know how to use a clutch,
or do you prefer automatics?
Do you like to cook or microwave?
Do you want fries with that?
I have seen horrible reviews from expert movie critics
that cannot fathom a popular success.
XP Professional is still widely used in offices around the globe.
Windows 7 could still remain in use well beyond 2020.
I do not really believe users
will want to stay with 7 many, many years into the future.
By 2020, we will probably have seen an evolution of platforms
designed for business and the next generations of youth.
Windows 9, 10, 11, 12 etc...
I think I will expire first...
Windows 8 will not be a failure,
8 is not guaranteed to disappoint nearly everyone.
It will be another controversial business
decision and money making enterprise.
One cannot succeed in business without risk.
If you don't like it,
don't buy it.
Do you know how to use a clutch,
or do you prefer automatics?
Do you like to cook or microwave?
Do you want fries with that?
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- 993
KewL!!! Fries, gimme a large order, easy on the salt <g>
Meaning you or him?
Opinions are worth the converse of how many there are! Time and the consumer will tell the tale.
The rest is just blowing smoke.
I cannot predict the future,
but my view is wide open,
and will be glad to try a new product.
(and have been for months)
It is unthinkable to imagine OEM's
that will sell millions of new systems with 8 installed,
to be a failure for Microsoft.
If the poll is 50/50 in this forum,
even that is a success for Microsoft.
If it's just smoke,
then we can call the fire department.
but my view is wide open,
and will be glad to try a new product.
(and have been for months)
It is unthinkable to imagine OEM's
that will sell millions of new systems with 8 installed,
to be a failure for Microsoft.
If the poll is 50/50 in this forum,
even that is a success for Microsoft.
If it's just smoke,
then we can call the fire department.
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- 261
no mdmd, no, it won't be a success
mdmd, just about everyone who's tried it is complaining. I'm not against change but forcing (it's not optionable) the Metro start screen on Desktop PCs and normal laptops is moronic to say the least. It's a very big mistake from MS not to make Metro like a normal Windows app: resizeable and minimizable to the task bar. And why removing the Start Menu, this is insane beyond cosmos' limits. The worse is that whether it's a success or not is not relevant for Microsoft. If it was they wouldn't do this period. It's not relevant because their main sales are EOM distros, not sales of installation discs. (personaly I don't know a single person who has bought a install discs separately from his/her computer - all non-Mac laptops are already pre-installed with Windows) They don't care if you don't buy or don't upgrade to it. Their main business is in the EOM distribution. And poeple will be forced to use it because most of the poeple don't have a clue about the different OSes they could choose. They buy a laptop, turn it on and that's all. Personaly if I buy a laptop and see Metro spilling over the screen, I return the machine to the store on the same day and ask them to install a valid OS or to refund my money. But most poeple will say, yeah ok, now it's like this. Amd Microsoft will pretend it's a success, even if the entire population hates it. No, seriousely I think Microsoft is going to face near riot rejection of Metro. In a few weeks they will start being flooded with complains and poeple asking where they can download Start8. For the professional users and businesses w8 in its current build is already a crying no-no. They will have to make Metro optionable at the very minimum or the company will go kaput.
mdmd, just about everyone who's tried it is complaining. I'm not against change but forcing (it's not optionable) the Metro start screen on Desktop PCs and normal laptops is moronic to say the least. It's a very big mistake from MS not to make Metro like a normal Windows app: resizeable and minimizable to the task bar. And why removing the Start Menu, this is insane beyond cosmos' limits. The worse is that whether it's a success or not is not relevant for Microsoft. If it was they wouldn't do this period. It's not relevant because their main sales are EOM distros, not sales of installation discs. (personaly I don't know a single person who has bought a install discs separately from his/her computer - all non-Mac laptops are already pre-installed with Windows) They don't care if you don't buy or don't upgrade to it. Their main business is in the EOM distribution. And poeple will be forced to use it because most of the poeple don't have a clue about the different OSes they could choose. They buy a laptop, turn it on and that's all. Personaly if I buy a laptop and see Metro spilling over the screen, I return the machine to the store on the same day and ask them to install a valid OS or to refund my money. But most poeple will say, yeah ok, now it's like this. Amd Microsoft will pretend it's a success, even if the entire population hates it. No, seriousely I think Microsoft is going to face near riot rejection of Metro. In a few weeks they will start being flooded with complains and poeple asking where they can download Start8. For the professional users and businesses w8 in its current build is already a crying no-no. They will have to make Metro optionable at the very minimum or the company will go kaput.
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I kind of doubt the 8 will be an Edsel.
Even if it is,
It has a few followers.
....Like the Chevy Volt,
SmartCar or Leaf...
Duds or fizzle out,
all I know,
as a pea brain is,
...I like it, and so do many others.
If you do not,
then do not use it.
That's it...unless you must.
Then one must get out your toolbox,
lift up the hood, and fix it.
Like you said,
time will tell.
Let's see what happens by New Years 2013...
Anyway, I am getting out of this thread,
cannot be successful here.
Have a nice day!
Even if it is,
It has a few followers.
....Like the Chevy Volt,
SmartCar or Leaf...
Duds or fizzle out,
all I know,
as a pea brain is,
...I like it, and so do many others.
If you do not,
then do not use it.
That's it...unless you must.
Then one must get out your toolbox,
lift up the hood, and fix it.
Like you said,
time will tell.
Let's see what happens by New Years 2013...
Anyway, I am getting out of this thread,
cannot be successful here.
Have a nice day!
From a marketing point of view I'd call that an abysmal failure.
Why call the fire department when there's no fire ... only smoke blowing out of ....
Diary of first use (~60 minutes)
* Just installed on my quad core Dell tower
* Install was painless
* Help screen showing that I should move mouse to corner is helpful
* No other help - guess I'm on my own from this point forward
* Tile interface is OK I guess, not the items I would want
* Pulled the menu up by navigating to top right corner, clicked on Start to get to the START menu, just stayed at the tiles
* Navigated to Settings, initial setting for PC is sparse, added administrative tiles, wow, no hierarchy (containers), everything is flat, all the programs show up as tiles, desktop will get cluttered if there is no hierarchy or menu system
* Ah found help and opened it, it started the new IE, they put the navigation bar at the bottom, how cute, figured out the right click shows navigation bar and open tabs? not sure what to call them, worthless help content, going to go back to the home screen
* If I move the mouse into the lower left and click I get back to the home screen
* Not sure how to close out IE, still running in the background I guess
* Clicked on Resource Monitor, all right a familiar screen, looks like the old Windows but no START menu, see IE running but have no idea how to close it
* Alt tab cycles through programs, glad they kept that
* How in the heck do you close a full screen program?
* Guess I'll search Bing
* Oh I see, I don't have to close programs anymore, they won't take up any resources, yah right, I guess this is the way the OS/X works, though Apple does provide a menu option for closing a program, OK found that CTRL SHIFT ESC brings up a Task Manger that can close apps, OK, that works
* The IE Browser isn't bad, kind of like the full screen approach, seems very fast
* Discovered Windows button brings up home screen
* Went to Sky Drive app, works well, think I'll install Office
* Downloading 2013 preview from MSDN
* While downloading started to figure out the navigation, upper left and then pull down shows all open Windows (not sure what to call them), so it is fairly easy to navigate
* While installation was taking place hit IE icon from a Desktop Window, opened a separate IE that isn't full screen, just like Windows 7, strange, guess I have 2 IE browsers running now
* OK install finished. Put tiles on home screen for starting applications. I don't see a way of creating a container for tiles. You can group them but can't create a container. I think this is a mistake on Microsoft's part. I need some hierarchy for all the programs I typically install
* Started the new Word, oh my gosh, was prompted with a UA request, popped over to the desktop, please no, no
* New Office similar to 2010 but more tilesh (is that a word?)
* Upper left navigation doesn't work with new Word, that's interesting, should be a O/S thing not an app thing, is broken from all screens now, buggy
* Browser still running but can't navigate to it using Alt Tab or upper left, see it running, if I click on tile from home screen comes back, buggy
* Going to install my favorite open source text editor Notepad ++
* New apps run in the first open desktop window I guess, opened where Word was running
* Tile was created on home screen, runs fine, OK I guess, still wish I could create a container for tiles
* Going to quit for now (no applaude necessary, this was as painful for me as it has been for you)
Impressions
* The UI and navigation is not intuitive but can be learned in reasonable timeframe with patience and PC knowledge
* As can be seen from the diary not sure how I would ever walk anyone through the system on the phone
* Tiles are ugly and I don't like the fact you can't create hierarchy / containers for tiles
* I like the new IE full screen mode
* Navigation is doable but confusing and looks to be buggy, fix packs coming I'm sure
* I see no reason to upgrade if I'm using a keyboard and mouse
* Microsoft could have done much better, doesn't compare to OS/X Mountain Lion which I love
* Just installed on my quad core Dell tower
* Install was painless
* Help screen showing that I should move mouse to corner is helpful
* No other help - guess I'm on my own from this point forward
* Tile interface is OK I guess, not the items I would want
* Pulled the menu up by navigating to top right corner, clicked on Start to get to the START menu, just stayed at the tiles
* Navigated to Settings, initial setting for PC is sparse, added administrative tiles, wow, no hierarchy (containers), everything is flat, all the programs show up as tiles, desktop will get cluttered if there is no hierarchy or menu system
* Ah found help and opened it, it started the new IE, they put the navigation bar at the bottom, how cute, figured out the right click shows navigation bar and open tabs? not sure what to call them, worthless help content, going to go back to the home screen
* If I move the mouse into the lower left and click I get back to the home screen
* Not sure how to close out IE, still running in the background I guess
* Clicked on Resource Monitor, all right a familiar screen, looks like the old Windows but no START menu, see IE running but have no idea how to close it
* Alt tab cycles through programs, glad they kept that
* How in the heck do you close a full screen program?
* Guess I'll search Bing
* Oh I see, I don't have to close programs anymore, they won't take up any resources, yah right, I guess this is the way the OS/X works, though Apple does provide a menu option for closing a program, OK found that CTRL SHIFT ESC brings up a Task Manger that can close apps, OK, that works
* The IE Browser isn't bad, kind of like the full screen approach, seems very fast
* Discovered Windows button brings up home screen
* Went to Sky Drive app, works well, think I'll install Office
* Downloading 2013 preview from MSDN
* While downloading started to figure out the navigation, upper left and then pull down shows all open Windows (not sure what to call them), so it is fairly easy to navigate
* While installation was taking place hit IE icon from a Desktop Window, opened a separate IE that isn't full screen, just like Windows 7, strange, guess I have 2 IE browsers running now
* OK install finished. Put tiles on home screen for starting applications. I don't see a way of creating a container for tiles. You can group them but can't create a container. I think this is a mistake on Microsoft's part. I need some hierarchy for all the programs I typically install
* Started the new Word, oh my gosh, was prompted with a UA request, popped over to the desktop, please no, no
* New Office similar to 2010 but more tilesh (is that a word?)
* Upper left navigation doesn't work with new Word, that's interesting, should be a O/S thing not an app thing, is broken from all screens now, buggy
* Browser still running but can't navigate to it using Alt Tab or upper left, see it running, if I click on tile from home screen comes back, buggy
* Going to install my favorite open source text editor Notepad ++
* New apps run in the first open desktop window I guess, opened where Word was running
* Tile was created on home screen, runs fine, OK I guess, still wish I could create a container for tiles
* Going to quit for now (no applaude necessary, this was as painful for me as it has been for you)
Impressions
* The UI and navigation is not intuitive but can be learned in reasonable timeframe with patience and PC knowledge
* As can be seen from the diary not sure how I would ever walk anyone through the system on the phone
* Tiles are ugly and I don't like the fact you can't create hierarchy / containers for tiles
* I like the new IE full screen mode
* Navigation is doable but confusing and looks to be buggy, fix packs coming I'm sure
* I see no reason to upgrade if I'm using a keyboard and mouse
* Microsoft could have done much better, doesn't compare to OS/X Mountain Lion which I love
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- 738
At least we hope they do?! Nothing is written in stone on any MS decision to bring the Start orb and programs menu back. Unfortunately it's "Reality Check" time as far as MS not usually bringing anything back they decide to dump!
7 was a rarity seeing Fat support brought back due to MS being forced to by the flash drive and external hard drive market where Fat and exFat are commonly seen. Likewise 7 will likely go down as the last desktop version with a desktop gui!
The major MS folly with 8 was not seeing two main setup options to start with for those with and for those without touchscreen rather then jamming Metro in everyone's faces. That takes away from any adbancements made in security and hardware detection and set up as well as the next version also not being so dual boot friendly.
Rather then booting into 7 when selected the system simply ends up seeing a full restart before 7 loaded. That was another item that heard complaints on as well as the one smart option MS added in would be the PC Refresh for seeing a full clean install put back on faster then manually wiping a problem install and then booting live from disk or flash drive.
Improve the core but trash the desktop is the most evident complaint heard. Until 7 is replaced by another mindstorm success story you can be sure most will be keeping 7 on for some time to come!
7 was a rarity seeing Fat support brought back due to MS being forced to by the flash drive and external hard drive market where Fat and exFat are commonly seen. Likewise 7 will likely go down as the last desktop version with a desktop gui!
The major MS folly with 8 was not seeing two main setup options to start with for those with and for those without touchscreen rather then jamming Metro in everyone's faces. That takes away from any adbancements made in security and hardware detection and set up as well as the next version also not being so dual boot friendly.
Rather then booting into 7 when selected the system simply ends up seeing a full restart before 7 loaded. That was another item that heard complaints on as well as the one smart option MS added in would be the PC Refresh for seeing a full clean install put back on faster then manually wiping a problem install and then booting live from disk or flash drive.
Improve the core but trash the desktop is the most evident complaint heard. Until 7 is replaced by another mindstorm success story you can be sure most will be keeping 7 on for some time to come!
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- 299
I doubt it is split here, if it is it's only because MS paid viral marketing shills are padding the numbers. My guestimate is that only 25% of forum users actually like Windows 8 as it is, it could possibly be less, and that if accurate is a serious death blow to MS.
I personally despise it because MS is so arrogant that they REFUSE to allow the customer to chose their default UI from boot.
No default boot to desktop, no sale.
Kat
Banned
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- 142
Well, I've only just got the 64-bit RP to run semi-useably as a standalone OS (upgrade over Win 7 Home Premium).
The first thing that struck me was how bloody BLAND it looks, compared to the CP.
Second thing was that it still won't talk to my openGL games.
But I've had it up for a couple of hours now, and it hasn't fallen over or locked up yet.
Unlike my first attempt to install it, now THAT was a disaster.
NOTHING worked, and it'd lock up within minutes.
But without a BSOD, so I had no idea what the problem was. I suspect graphics.
The first thing that struck me was how bloody BLAND it looks, compared to the CP.
Second thing was that it still won't talk to my openGL games.
But I've had it up for a couple of hours now, and it hasn't fallen over or locked up yet.
Unlike my first attempt to install it, now THAT was a disaster.
NOTHING worked, and it'd lock up within minutes.
But without a BSOD, so I had no idea what the problem was. I suspect graphics.
The Future of Windows
Microsoft to developers: Metro is your future | ZDNet
Evolving the Start menu - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
Reflecting on your comments on the Start screen - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
Ballmer orders the death of the start button - No one uses it | TechEye
http://www.winsupersite.com/blog/supersite-blog-39/windows8/winrt-replacing-win32-140605
WinRT - the new Windows
Microsoft defends its murder of the Start menu in Windows 8 | ExtremeTech
Microsoft to developers: Metro is your future | ZDNet
Evolving the Start menu - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
Reflecting on your comments on the Start screen - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
Ballmer orders the death of the start button - No one uses it | TechEye
http://www.winsupersite.com/blog/supersite-blog-39/windows8/winrt-replacing-win32-140605
WinRT - the new Windows
Microsoft defends its murder of the Start menu in Windows 8 | ExtremeTech
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"Up" button
They did bring back the "Up" button in Windows Explorer.
Agreed.
They did bring back the "Up" button in Windows Explorer.
Agreed.
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- 261
mdmd Reflecting on your comments on the Start screen - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs This blog post is so full of crap it made me sick. They are totaly wrong. 100%. Why weren't they just saying "ok, we heard you, we'll bring the normal UI back". That would have been excellent response. Instead they try to justify this monumental mistake with ery stupid and untrue assumptions such as the Start Menu is inefficient or "our telemetry is showing that...". Well my personal telemetry is showing that W8's Start sreen has been massiely rejected already and more importantly by myself because I'm the user of my computer. And I'm very angry at their hypocrisy:"Believe us we are listening" or "this is normal reaction to change" and "this is not the best way to start a dialog". Well, we told them what we had to say. Now they will see what's a NORMAL reaction to something crappy.
PaulGo
Member
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- 92
So instead of offering users a choice Microsoft is saying we know what's best for you, and please disregard all the nice things we said about the usability of the previous versions of Windows, because we found out we were wrong. Unfortunately I feel they are wrong about the usability of Windows 8. It would have been so easy for them to offer consumers a choice and allow users to decide what's best for their needs, but big brother Microsoft knows what's best for us. The bottom line is they are so worried they have lost the market in smartphones and tablets they have made a decision to screw desktop users to have a uniform interface which was designed to touch devices.
I don't see Win8 as being anything but a disappointment (in my case). Sure I downloaded it and played around but it really wasn't for me - it was that simple. Everything seemed to work okay as it does with my Win7 set up but that was about it. Didn't notice the speed improvements but then that depends upon individual hardware.
So I see Win8 for what it is - primarily aimed at the phone/tablet market and not desktop/laptop users. MS should have offered a choice at install time but then that would have defeated their recently acquired Apple envy for paid for downloaded apps and MS cloud computing.
It's no big deal. If you like Win8 then go for it. If not stay with Win7. Whether Win8 will be a success we will just have to wait and see but I doubt if there will be any reversal by MS this time round offering a classic UI with a SP1 although I hope I'm wrong on that one. Maybe Win9.......
So I see Win8 for what it is - primarily aimed at the phone/tablet market and not desktop/laptop users. MS should have offered a choice at install time but then that would have defeated their recently acquired Apple envy for paid for downloaded apps and MS cloud computing.
It's no big deal. If you like Win8 then go for it. If not stay with Win7. Whether Win8 will be a success we will just have to wait and see but I doubt if there will be any reversal by MS this time round offering a classic UI with a SP1 although I hope I'm wrong on that one. Maybe Win9.......
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