How Microsoft can salvage Windows 8 before it's too late

This is a tough challenge, given that Windows 8 is only a few months away from release. There's not a lot that Microsoft can do in this time. However, given that the Redmond giant has already gone on the record to say that the UI that we see in the Windows 8 Release Preview is not what will be in the final release, it's safe to say that things are in a certain state of flux.

As I've said on numerous occasions, the biggest problem with Windows 8 is the way that the dumbed-down Metro UI has been unceremoniously bolted onto the mature and well-refined "Classic" user interface. While there's no doubt that the existing UI is flawed, bolting on a UI designed for touch devices is not the answer.

OK, you asked me to keep this concise, so here it is. Here's how I think Microsoft should tweak Windows 8 before it's released:

Read more at:
How Microsoft can salvage Windows 8 before it's too late | ZDNet

 

[rich4421972]

Windows 8 already includes the option to boot directly to the desktop (i.e. no lock screen, no password). It's in the group policy Editor (gpedit.msc) and user account control (netplwiz.msc). It is not really helpful to complain about the settings of the Metro desktop without even having attempted to learn or modify settings.

 

[Dave76]

I'm no fan of Metro - to me it's the biggest obstacle to Windows 8. I am getting used to it (as if I have much choice if I continue to use Windows 8) but I think I'll hold on to my Windows 7. I'm usually one who likes running the latest and greatest but this one's going to be the exception.

If you like Metro and you think it's cool, that's fine. If you're like me and you don't, welcome to a pretty big club. Differences in opinion or perspective do not mean we can't behave like adults.

FWIW, I might be in the minority but I liked Vista and I even told a friend that he should not be in any hurry to upgrade his Vista PC to Windows 7 as long as Vista works well for him.

I agree that everyone has their own opinion and has the right to make their own choice, we don't have to agree on them.
And this:

Differences in opinion or perspective do not mean we can't behave like adults.

I also like Vista, still have it on my laptop (Vista, Win7, Win8), if it's working well no need to upgrade.

One thing is certain, every possible opinion on every possible aspect of the Win8 debate has been expressed, in every possible way.

Isn't it time to put away the duelling swords and simply wait till the RTM hits the market? And let the sales barometer do the talking?
...

In terms of this thread, the most meaningful statement for me was from the ZDNet blog by Adrian Kingsley-Hughes referred to by Brink in the initial post:

However, given that the Redmond giant has already gone on the record to say that the UI that we see in the Windows 8 Release Preview is not what will be in the final release, it's safe to say that things are in a certain state of flux.

What's the point of everyone getting their feathers all ruffled up until we know what the final reality is?

Very well stated.

 

[Mustang]

Windows 8 already includes the option to boot directly to the desktop (i.e. no lock screen, no password). It's in the group policy Editor (gpedit.msc) and user account control (netplwiz.msc). It is not really helpful to complain about the settings of the Metro desktop without even having attempted to learn or modify settings.

I was not complaining, just stating my preference. I prefer a system that boots straight to desktop from the get go, without having to use group policy Editor, User Account Control, or 3rd party software.

 

[Brink]

Windows 8 already includes the option to boot directly to the desktop (i.e. no lock screen, no password). It's in the group policy Editor (gpedit.msc) and user account control (netplwiz.msc). It is not really helpful to complain about the settings of the Metro desktop without even having attempted to learn or modify settings.

I was not complaining, just stating my preference. I prefer a system that boots straight to desktop from the get go, without having to use groupd policy Editor, User Account Control, or 3rd party software.

Mustang,

You might see if this may work you to boot directly to the desktop in Windows 8 without the use of 3rd party software or any other adjusted setting.

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials/7449-desktop-boot-directly-windows-8-a.html

 

[Mustang]

Mustang,

You might see if this may work you to boot directly to the desktop in Windows 8 without the use of 3rd party software or any other adjusted setting.

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials/7449-desktop-boot-directly-windows-8-a.html

Thank you for that information Brink. I normally don't use a password, and Win8 boots straight into Metro. But I will implement one so I can do what you have suggested.

Someone else suggested putting the "Desktop" tile from Metro in the Startup option, and it automatically boots straight to desktop without having to do anything but start the PC. But it didn't tell how to do this?

 

[Brink]

You're welcome Mustang.

You could still do it without having to use a password. You would still move the Desktop tile to the upper left corner, but then can just press Enter as soon as the Start screen comes up to go to the desktop without having to click on it.

 

[Mustang]

You're welcome Mustang.

You could still do it without having to use a password. You would still move the Desktop tile to the upper left corner, but then can just press Enter as soon as the Start screen comes up to go to the desktop without having to click on it.

Thank you very much for that info. That answers my question. :thumb:

 

[Brink]

Anytime.

 

[robinb9]

my beef is there are so many tricks you can do but the average user and even the business will not know how to do it. Like putting a third party start menu on, booting directly to the desktop, etc as we all have seen in here. Unless you are an advanced user one will have no clue how to use Windows 8 which will become very frustrating. The consumer user will be lost unless he uses the computer only for surfing the internet or checking email or looking at pictures. The business user will be totally lost and the owner of a business will have to hire an IT person to teach their employees how to use it which can become quite costly.

Microsoft in my opinion should have at least put in the Start Menu in the Desktop App to give the user the use of both worlds. Or given us the option to pick a "Classic Mode" that would switch it looking like Windows 7 and if you really wanted the Metro look you have that option. This way again you have "both worlds"

I will give you an example on how horrible it is now. I give free seminars to businesses and non profit organizations on "How to Keep your computer Safe and Backing up your computer". I also have Windows 8 in Virtual to show them what it looks like. I did NO changes, (all my tweeks are on my desktop test machine in my office)- this is a laptop running windows 7 Pro and VMWare Virtual. I do this for 15 people as well as I have done it for 1000.

I have done 4 so far this month. 2 were the consumer side - 2 were the business side.

On the consumer side when i showed them Windows 8- all of them had opened mouths and gasped. I would say about a third of them liked the Metro look. those who liked it were in the age group from 18-35. Those who did not were over 35

On the business side between both seminars I had 300 business users. When they saw Windows 8 (now again i showed it to them without any tweeks) the gasps were higher. I would say about 25 might consider using it, the rest NO.
The first thing they said was "where is the start menu?" Almost all of them when i asked told me they would have to higher someone to teach their employees how to use it. Some that were there were advanced users and asked me if there is anyplace they could go to get more into. I gave them this forum to come to.

I did a poll and asked how many would consider purchasing or upgrading to Windows 8
First seminar had 125 people. 20 raised there hands
2nd seminar had 175 people- 10 raised their hands

on the consumer side- 1st one I had 50
2nd one- 75
combined about 30 people (again all in the age range of 18-35) said they would consider upgrading

So you see it is not cut and dry here. the majority would not upgrade especially on the business side

For me, I have no choice but to upgrade my laptop once the preview version expires because i need the ability to show it at my semniars. My other 9 machines run Windows 7 Pro and they will NOT be upgraded

Again for me, I will make lots of money from Windows 8 because my clients who need to upgrade will need to hire me to "Tweek" it to make it look siminar to Windows 7 and to teach them how to use it, but personally I do not like having such a huge change rammed down my throat to get into the "Tablet market" I have an Ipad, I do not want one on my desktop or laptop, I like the Windows 7 look.
robin

 

[Soundtweaker]

Those tests are pretty much useless because those people didn't see the startup tutorials that shows up first win8 boots. There will be specific tutorials based on what device win8 is installed on also.

 

[rich4421972]

I don't usually use the mouse at all in Metro because everything is accessible throught key combinations. A direct boot into desktop or Metro is handled in the Group settings dialog of the Control panel (Which is usually hidden under the "All Applications" window)

 

[robinb9]

Those tests are pretty much useless because those people didn't see the startup tutorials that shows up first win8 boots. There will be specific tutorials based on what device win8 is installed on also.

you are not getting the point, the normal user will not sit there and read a tutorial to get into an OS they just want it to get there, and I showed them the OS as it started up.
People just want it to boot up and Go, not many have the time to read how to do things especially in a work envireoment.
robin

 

[rich4421972]

This is very true. The less time spent in repair and configuration means more time for business: Employers who teach their employees or technicians to hack their systems may end up with a network with many security problems.

I do, however, think the issue is moot (for businesses) because most enterprises will be running Windows Server 2012 which doesn't have Metro. Many businesses may not even be able to afford (my college still runs Windows XP workstations with Novell NetWare. The principle is valuable and something every business should know about.

I think it is nice that there are hacks out there, but unless they are available in one place, they are impractical and will not . I don't know any user who would think o regedit as an easy way to get things done. Then again, these options need to be presented at installation and not in a lengthy tutorial.

 

[Soundtweaker]

It wont be as hard as you think. Most people already know how to navigate around a smartphone UI so Win8 isnt much different.

 

[Coke Robot]

I wouldn't think that if people know how to use ios or android, they will understand the metro design. As I see it, the two platforms are Desktop-lite interfaces whereas metro is something else.

 

[Stratos]

Actually, Windows 7 was vista 2.0!

Actually, it wasn't. It was and is Windows 7. Vista 2.0 really does not exist. It was a metaphor for a failure by design.

Windows 8 is a forced blending of incompatible elements such that both the touch and mouse/keyboard interface is broken and incomplete. It is especially so for the people who actually use their computers to do work rather than simply consume content produced by others. If all you want to do one thing at at time and run apps, tweet, email or brows the web, Metro is sort of OK. However, if you want to be productive, use more than one window at a time, and produce complex content then you must constantly fight having to go through the butt. ugly, totally useless, and unnecessary Metro screen.

It would have been trivially easy for Microsoft to have done it right. One way would have been to have a touch centric OS and a mouse/keyboard centric OS (ie. Windows 7). The other way would be to provide the user with a choice of touch or mouse/keyboard centric operation. As it is, the people they are relying on to provide content are constantly having to switch contexts between two incompatible universes to get much of anything done. Each context switch will result in a significant fraction of an hour of lost productivity because of focus being broken. Staying in "the zone" is very important.

I have 70 applications that I must use to service the various tasks I must perform to develop content: software, websites, documentation and the like as well as remote technical support and system and software diagnostics. Try pinning that many icons on the task bar and the task bar would be useless. Then there are many more applications that I must use infrequently. You see, I have real work to accomplish and I need to do it MY WAY and not the way some brain dead manager at Microsoft insists I must do it. Personally, I couldn't care less about what Microsoft managers want. They can go suck rocks for all I care.

I understand that Microsoft doesn't give a damn about the people who must do real work. They are interested only in finding a way to build a new cash cow by having a totally captive audience brainlessly buying apps from THEIR app store. They also want have a way to push paid for advertizing out to that "customer" base and they think Metro is it. That is their choice. They are so focused on creating that cash cow that it is clear that they haven't thought about where all those apps will come from. They are building a cash cow that won't give cash without the apps.

I don't have to like it but I must somehow find a way to live with it or stop working and stop being productive. For now, that means shunning Windows 8 and staying with Windows 7 for as long as possible.

Agreed. We recently completed a 3 month closed test within our company to see where Win8 CP stands (I know the latest version was RP but we wanted to test something for a little more than a few weeks).

I as well as the other staff on the IT team will be recommending to remain on Win7 for our hundreds of machines, we simply see no benefit and in fact measured reduced productivity with Win8, even after users were satisfactorily used to the new OS. Our users are already faced with the challenge of increasing workloads and less time to complete them. MS needs to do a lot better than merely offer, for example IE10 as a leveraging point to get us to move to Win8.

 

[Mike Lonewolf]

Stratos, I don't believe the current iteration of Windows 8 would work in a business environment. I would LOVE to see what the professional version of Windows 8 will look like. I believe this version is for computer enthusiast, and not the corporate user(s). The cost involved in JUST the re-training of employees would be astronomical. BUT! Seeing as how Microsoft is also a business (Corporation) I am MORE than sure they will have an edition for businesses. Various different online sources have always stated that the biggest buyer of Microsoft Windows is the enthusiast. (Home-User)

 

[HippsieGypsie]

It wont be as hard as you think. Most people already know how to navigate around a smartphone UI so Win8 isnt much different.

'Atta boy, Soundtweaker, hold to your guns! A lot of speculation going on lately on this forum without sound forensic business proof. Forensic meaning to examine closely with a professional methodology and with professional tools.

@ robin69

Although I respect what you do professionally, I think that is not very good scientifically sound survey, although I believe your results may not be that far off. I'm sure M$ and others they hire to do independents have executed a ton of surveys. M$ is a successful multi $billion business. I think they might know a little about what they're doing and which specific market to target and with what software to shoot that market with.

@ rich4421972

I agree with the Server 20I2 statement assuming it will work. I'm not familiar with server. I think 8 currently in no way is ready for enterprise nor is enterprise ready for 8. They will either run with server, stick with 7, or upgrade to either one if they haven't done so. I think they will support 7 and server for quite some time until 8, if ever, is ready. 8 may just turn out to be a general-public OS and that is all. Enterprise may never use it, for it may not be what M$ will target them with. They may produce an enterprise version as MikeLonewolf has stated.

@ some on this forum, especially some Pros

Most people aren't as stupid and slow as you may think, especially the younger. We live in a pretty-much literate world today. We're no longer in the dark ages. They will read the help files, seek personal help, or whatever it takes to learn something, what I believe, is drastically new, an OS named Windows 8. I suggest to come off your high horses and walk some ground down here. At least for a while.

 

[EchoX860]

As of this moment in time there's nothing that makes me want to switch. I despise Metro, don't care for the new Ribbon Explorer interface, I'm perfectly comfortable using 7.

 

[HippsieGypsie]

As of this moment in time there's nothing that makes me want to switch. I despise Metro, don't care for the new Ribbon Explorer interface, I'm perfectly comfortable using 7.

Thank you, EchoX860. Short, to the point, honest, and respectful on how one thinks and/or feels about 8.