Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Windows 8.1 Update 1 leaked

  1. #191


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragon Drop View Post
    .... Similarly, when you use Task Manager to close File Explorer, you couldn't reopen it if the Desktop environment were terminated, because Task Manager would be gone from memory too....

    The only things that can be truly closed -- that is, terminated --
    are the Desktop apps. File Explorer is one of those, but the Desktop environment is not.
    @dragon drop

    I appreciate your thoughtfulness and time taken to post,
    but I have to end my participation in this conversation.
    I do not wish to give the appearance of being unfriendly,
    but I cannot explain any further without crossing the line
    and this is not the right place for this topic anyway.

    Using a Windows NT kernel (Server), you can run task manager with no GUI installed at all, just the command prompt. In fact, you can run the entire OS without a desktop environment. The desktop environment can be installed or uninstalled (Windows Server - not 8). The desktop is a metaphor. The task manager runs independent of the desktop environment. There are dozens of executable programs that are part of Windows that are based on Win32 and do not need the desktop environment.
    It is not appropriate to continue this discussion in this thread.
    Have a nice day. Take care.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #192


    Posts : 308
    64-bit Windows 8


    I don't want to be unfriendly either. You're right, but so am I. Yes, you can un–install the Desktop environment, and then you have no OS in your computer. And you don't need any, because you can run an OS from a server instead. But if you DO have a Windows OS installed -- in YOUR computer -- then you have a Desktop environment installed.

    Before Windows can do anything (if it's running on YOUR computer) all that stuff in the Windows and Program Data folders has to be available on a drive. "All that stuff" IS the Desktop environment. You can display it, or not display it. You can open File Explorer, or not open it. But, whether displayed or not, "all that stuff" is there, and you're USING it every time you do ANYTHING with a computer running Windows. Even if you just boot to the Start Screen, run one Metro app, and power off, you were USING (though not displaying) the Desktop environment by running the Metro app. All that can appear on your screen without "that stuff" is the BIOS messages, or the things you do from the BIOS menus. No screen that's a part of the Windows system can appear -- not the Start Screen, not the Sign-On Screen, not even the Lock Screen -- until your computer reads "all that stuff" from your drive -- and "that stuff" IS the Desktop environment.

    Unless, of course, you run an OS remotely from another location (i.e. on a server) in which case you're still using "all that stuff" but it's in someone else's computer instead of yours. That doesn't mean you've "closed" your Desktop environment; it just means you don't have one. Or, if you have Windows but you boot from a server on one occasion, then of course YOUR Desktop environment isn't open, because you NEVER opened it -- you just booted from the server INSTEAD.

    But if you boot Windows from a drive in YOUR computer, your Desktop environment (whether displayed or not) is then installed, open, and running. And, no matter what you do, it WILL remain open and running until you either (1) reboot from a remote location, or (2) reboot a system other than Windows, or (3) turn the power off.

    So, yes, if you close File Explorer and then use Task Manager (which is also a part of your Desktop environment) to get a remote command prompt and load a remote OS, your Desktop environment is THEN terminated. But it isn't terminated because you closed File Explorer; it's terminated because the remote OS is now running INSTEAD. Or, if you aren't even booting from the remote computer but just connecting to it and exchanging data, then you haven't even terminated your own OS; you aren't using it at the moment, but it's still active in memory and therefore, in effect, open.

    But it may be that what I'm saying amounts to the same thing that you meant by saying that "Win32 cannot be closed." If so, then we're both right. And anyway your main point was that the Windows Desktop is not a very secure environment. I'm not disagreeing with that.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #193


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    I'm starting to think Microsoft should have labeled both Windows and Windows Phone 8 updates as 8.5 versus 8.1. It would make more logic that way...

    The "additions" to Update 1 are just meh to me. I'll probably go check things out for myself here soon, but I see little to interest me; maybe if the Start Screen allowed for better play of tile arrangement versus having to haggle with the auto grid arrangement. With Windows Phone, you can plop a baby tile literally anywhere you feel like with no judgment. This needs to be in Update 1, it gets too tedious to arrange tiles just right.

    Also, WinRT needs a bigger boost going forward. I'm so sick of dealing with issues that stem from the inherent nature of Win32 coding, I could vomit.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #194


    South Coast NSW, Australia
    Posts : 615
    Windows 8.1 'Ultimate' RTM 64 bit (Pro/WMC).


    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    I'm starting to think Microsoft should have labeled both Windows and Windows Phone 8 updates as 8.5 versus 8.1. It would make more logic that way...

    The "additions" to Update 1 are just meh to me. I'll probably go check things out for myself here soon, but I see little to interest me; maybe if the Start Screen allowed for better play of tile arrangement versus having to haggle with the auto grid arrangement. With Windows Phone, you can plop a baby tile literally anywhere you feel like with no judgment. This needs to be in Update 1, it gets too tedious to arrange tiles just right.

    Also, WinRT needs a bigger boost going forward. I'm so sick of dealing with issues that stem from the inherent nature of Win32 coding, I could vomit.
    If you use Win 8.1 the 'right' way, that's irrelevant.

    Ignore the Start screen completely, set Windows to go to All Apps, select 'By Category' then go to the All Apps folder and delete all the excess icons.

    PRESTO!. You have a bloody brilliant Start Menu, and need never even SEE the much-maligned Start Screen.

    ADDENDUM: Windows Phone 8 is rubbish! Lovely phone OS, and the Metro interface works like a dream, but so restricted as to be useless to me (and yes, I can see 'real' Windows heading the same way). My six-week-old Nokia Lumia is up for sale, and I'm going back to Android. It's NOT a 'no apps' issue, but the closed nature of the OS.


    EDIT: Just discovered that the WP8.1 update will be addressing most of my issues with the phone (except a decent file manager) so I'll keep it for now.

    Wenda.
    Last edited by Wenda; 17 Feb 2014 at 16:12.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #195


    Off thread topic, but:

    "Ignore the Start screen completely, set Windows to go to All Apps, select 'By Category' then go to the All Apps folder and delete all the excess icons."

    Thought provoking!
    I did it the other way around. I imported the icons I needed to my start screen, leaving the others as, you could say, a sub-directory of not so important shortcuts. No need to delete anything then, unless you want to clean up a bit (I did!).
    One key to the start menu, should I be on the legacy desktop, another click to the "sub directory".
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #196


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    Off thread topic, but:

    "Ignore the Start screen completely, set Windows to go to All Apps, select 'By Category' then go to the All Apps folder and delete all the excess icons."

    Thought provoking!
    I did it the other way around. I imported the icons I needed to my start screen, leaving the others as, you could say, a sub-directory of not so important shortcuts. No need to delete anything then, unless you want to clean up a bit (I did!).
    One key to the start menu, should I be on the legacy desktop, another click to the "sub directory".
    That's pretty well what I did. The stuff I use everyday like Outlook and IE are pinned to my taskbar. I boot to desktop. Other stuff I use frequently is on the Start Screen main page. The rest is in All Apps. Apps I know I will never use I uninstalled. Also pinned a couple of shortcuts for custom Icons here and there.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #197


    Posts : 60
    Windows 8.1 Pro with Media Center
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #198


    Microsoft is reportedly set to finalize the update by February 23rd
    Strange they chose that date... a Sunday?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #199


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    lol, that's my birthday. It's a shame patch Tuesday wasn't the first Tuesday in the month. It would have made some interesting headlines come April. I wonder if they did that on purpose just to avoid that scenario?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #200


    LOL yeah...Also wonder had the 1st fallen on a Wednesday if the //Build conference would have been rescheduled around it as well...

    EDIT: ... I see registration is on the 1st - either way it will be an interesting conference - looking forward to the Win9 pre-beta news...
    Last edited by Superfly; 19 Feb 2014 at 08:18.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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