Is 8 and 8.1 creating OS illiterate smartphone users?

[whs]

I know people who say with Pride, "I don't even know how to turn a computer on."

From the mountain country of the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.

A lot of people here like that.

Then again there are those who took the time to learn.
Lots of them too.

The trend is, more are taking the time to learn.

Some are just intimidated by the technology.

I have observed that many times too - poeple are proud to be dumb. Especially those that have no skills at all. They hang onto life by their fingernails.

 

[gator2013]

I have observed that many times too - people are proud to be dumb. Especially those that have no skills at all. They hang onto life by their fingernails.

I often wonder how some people even survive.

Maybe they are not so dumb after all.

Why do for yourself that with which you can get someone else to do for you?

I think many have that prevailing attitude. Possibly learned behavior, even generational to an extent but I don't you can pigeon hole any particular age group.

And what do you do with this recent question?

How do I find and open Programs?

"The only thing I can find is right clicking the start button and clicking programs, but all this does is bring up the uninstall screen, which has no option for simply opening programs. I need a start button like on Seven. Windows 8.1 is what I have "

 

[HippsieGypsie]

I have observed that many times too - people are proud to be dumb. Especially those that have no skills at all. They hang onto life by their fingernails.

I often wonder how some people even survive.

Maybe they are not so dumb after all.

Why do for yourself that with which you can get someone else to do for you?

I think many have that prevailing attitude. Possibly learned behavior, even generational to an extent but I don't you can pigeon hole any particular age group.

And what do you do with this recent question?

How do I find and open Programs?

"The only thing I can find is right clicking the start button and clicking programs, but all this does is bring up the uninstall screen, which has no option for simply opening programs. I need a start button like on Seven. Windows 8.1 is what I have "

You saw that too?

You lead him/her to use Classic Shell where they'll never learn anything new to be able to decide for themselves of course. All this on a Windows 8/8.1 support forum. Geez.

Here's his/her response:

Thanks. You saved me. Why would Microsoft make an OS that is so hard to figure out.

I'd like to write more, but I can't do to rules.

 

[gator2013]

And a lot of these same people will be using Registry Cleaners and will be right back here

 

[caperjack]

How do I find and open Programs?

"The only thing I can find is right clicking the start button and clicking programs, but all this does is bring up the uninstall screen, which has no option for simply opening programs. I need a start button like on Seven. Windows 8.1 is what I have "

my answer to that question was to left click not right click .they were going to program and features .
what surprised me most with that was that most users rarely right click the mouse ,they always left click everything

 

[whs]

How do I find and open Programs?

"The only thing I can find is right clicking the start button and clicking programs, but all this does is bring up the uninstall screen, which has no option for simply opening programs. I need a start button like on Seven. Windows 8.1 is what I have "

my answer to that question was to left click not right click .they were going to program and features .
what surprised me most with that was that most users rarely right click the mouse ,they always left click everything

Hmm, I don't remember posting that. Does not sound like me.

 

[broe23]

I know people who say with Pride, "I don't even know how to turn a computer on."

From the mountain country of the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.

A lot of people here like that.

Then again there are those who took the time to learn.
Lots of them too.

The trend is, more are taking the time to learn.

Some are just intimidated by the technology.

I have observed that many times too - people are proud to be dumb. Especially those that have no skills at all. They hang onto life by their fingernails.

I do not think that they are too proud to be dumb. I think that a lot is that the OS's have moved too fast for a lot of users to keep up. I cannot count the number of people that ask if they should go with Android, iOS or W8 Phone OS phones. Most opt for Android or iOS. Especially since you can use Chrome across multiple platforms to sync information.

I was not in the loop from 1988-1989. Then again from 1994-2000. A lot had to do with not having the funds to get a computer. The other was that I never had the time to even sit down at a computer to do stuff, after working 12-14 hours at work.

 

[whs]

This is strange. I have both Android and W8Phone. I find the W8Phone a LOT easier than Android. It is probably because there are a lot less options. But that is good if you don't want to graduate in phone operating systems.

My W8P was set up in a couple of days and with very little help. Setting up my Android took weeks and I was constant guest on the Android forum (which btw is very good).

 

[jakeryan]

I know people who say with Pride, "I don't even know how to turn a computer on."

From the mountain country of the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.

A lot of people here like that.

Then again there are those who took the time to learn.
Lots of them too.

The trend is, more are taking the time to learn.

Some are just intimidated by the technology.

I have observed that many times too - poeple are proud to be dumb. Especially those that have no skills at all. They hang onto life by their fingernails.

Or they are outdoor type people and have this thing called real life? Come on, it's funny that nerds are the most opinionated, negative people and the biggest jerks these days who think they'll all that. Excuse me, but nerds are the snottiest people around. And I was a nerd that cared about PCs all through high school and college, so it's not like I'm some jock feeling butt hurt. Some people have better things on their mind than computers and tech -- kids, pets, connecting to people, empathy. I'd trade everything I know about computers for companionship and friends.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
I don't know who said it but this quote is relevant I think to the topic.

"The price of education is HIGH but the price of ignorance is ASTRONOMICAL".

It always amazes me whenever I'm in the UK how much money I can save some of my colleagues by SIMPLE things like switching Energy suppliers / Broadband suppliers / Banks / Credit Card providers etc with a simple mouse click. People usually seem to be PROUD of admitting they can't do or hate SIMPLE ARITHMETIC.

Most people haven't got a clue between the difference of an Interest rate of 13.5% and 39.5% on their cards --they usually say --OK I'm paying back 250 GBP a month which is affordable without realizing the Interest difference -- same with those ATROCIOUS "Payday Loan" companies in the UK - Interest rates here of around 3,000- 4,000% (yes no TYPO). The excuse is "I only want 500 GBP for a few days --which then rolls over and rapidly the Loan becomes several THOUSAND GBP. !!! I think those companies were booted out of the USA - good thing too --although if people were a bit smarter those companies wouldn't be in business either.

(We have Credit Unions for this type of stuff but that model doesn't exist everywhere unfortunately).

Maybe that's why the entire World is in such a mess !!! - people are PROUD to be poorly educated.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[broe23]

This is strange. I have both Android and W8Phone. I find the W8Phone a LOT easier than Android. It is probably because there are a lot less options. But that is good if you don't want to graduate in phone operating systems.

My W8P was set up in a couple of days and with very little help. Setting up my Android took weeks and I was constant guest on the Android forum (which btw is very good).

I find that the W8Phone is harder. Android it is just go into Settings, then to WiFi. You can also use voice guidance to ask for it.

The forums though are there for searching for info, since web searches a lot of time, duplicate info. I do a lot of browsing forums for info when I get stuck. Especially with Linux, since I have not used it regularly for a long time. I have been finding myself searching for items that I either get stuck on, or like when I first installed it back on my laptop after I had changed the Wifi card.

I had to install a second piece of software (Ubuntu Backports), along with Samba, to get it to play nice on my LAN. Now I do pick up the phone a lot, to call my brother, due to he has been a regular Linux user for over ten years. We both help each other out on Windows stuff we come across also.

I would like to see more people asking questions in a format, that we can be more helpful, then just 144 characters, or a short 50 word question.

The problem with 8.x, along with Server 2k12 making users illiterate. It has to do with that little thing called Metro. You also on the other hand, users that have been used to using the Desktop for since Window 9x. Now MS is dumping what looks like a POS Interface onto their computers. Which if you do not do some research on. It is hard to convert.

Think of it like taking a driver that has driven a vehicle with an automatic transmission all of their life, and now you are sticking them into a vehicle with a Manual Transmission. Very large learning curve now, isn't it.

This is why we are all here as a round table. The more knowledge in one place. The more help users get. Now when the user refuses to be forth coming, or just posts and runs, it makes it hard to fix their problem.

 

[whs]

Right Jimbo. Those are excellent points. And that's what I was talking about - not PC knowledge specifically but general education.

I have a cousin who says that rising gas prices do not concern him - he always takes gas for $20 and that is always the same.

 

[caperjack]

Right Jimbo. Those are excellent points. And that's what I was talking about - not PC knowledge specifically but general education.

I have a cousin who says that rising gas prices do not concern him - he always takes gas for $20 and that is always the same.

yeah,gas prices ,ours are regulated every week ,over night Thursdays ,the pumps are busy today[well maybe not ,we are into the second day of a major spring snow storm/high winds ] ,just in case it goes up . and I have some friends that say ,prices going up doesn't matter to them because they have to buy gas anyway

 

[HippsieGypsie]

This is strange. I have both Android and W8Phone. I find the W8Phone a LOT easier than Android. It is probably because there are a lot less options. But that is good if you don't want to graduate in phone operating systems.

My W8P was set up in a couple of days and with very little help. Setting up my Android took weeks and I was constant guest on the Android forum (which btw is very good).

I find that the W8Phone is harder. Android it is just go into Settings, then to WiFi. You can also use voice guidance to ask for it.

To set a precedence, here’s a little history about myself so far as cell phones go. http://www.eightforums.com/chillout-room/40357-thoughts-windows-phone-8-a-2.html#post346883 As you can see, I was using Android for approximately 3 years before buying the Lumia 1520 just before year’s end. Please keep in mind that I’m coming off an older Droid X2 to a state-of-the-art Lumia, so I’m not sure what’s been added to Android, nor do I know what was on older WPs.

I go under the belief that one subject is no more difficult to learn than another if one reads up on it enough and/or follows instructions. Also, I think there has to be a certain amount of enthusiasm for the subject involved to hold one’s attention.

Perhaps you had an older Windows Phone (if any at all), but my Lumia does all that you stated in your first sentence (whatever point you were trying to make there). It has stored WiFi hotspots just as Android does. It will automatically connect to open networks. It gives a notification that it has executed it. When pushing and holding the Windows key, Speech command comes up to perform quite a number of things, including opening Settings.

Use Speech on my phone | Windows Phone How-to (United States)

The forums though are there for searching for info, since web searches a lot of time, duplicate info. I do a lot of browsing forums for info when I get stuck. Especially with Linux, since I have not used it regularly for a long time. I have been finding myself searching for items that I either get stuck on, or like when I first installed it back on my laptop after I had changed the Wifi card.

I had to install a second piece of software (Ubuntu Backports), along with Samba, to get it to play nice on my LAN. Now I do pick up the phone a lot, to call my brother, due to he has been a regular Linux user for over ten years. We both help each other out on Windows stuff we come across also.

I would like to see more people asking questions in a format, that we can be more helpful, then just 144 characters, or a short 50 word question.

No clue as to why you went into this dissertation. It has nothing to do with whs’s subject matter you quoted. But to add > This forum system seems to be successful to me. Why change it if it works?

The problem with 8.x, along with Server 2k12 making users illiterate. It has to do with that little thing called Metro. You also on the other hand, users that have been used to using the Desktop for since Window 9x. Now MS is dumping what looks like a POS Interface onto their computers. Which if you do not do some research on. It is hard to convert.

Ok. Now you want to divert back to the thread subject. Good, good. How is “that little thing called Metro” making users “illiterate”? It’s just a UI similar to any UI. MS super-sized the “Start Menu” to human finger scale for touch, created/added live tiles which convey information, and now boot to it. All left to personal arrangement and organization. Much better system IMO. Nothing too difficult to learn whatsoever. We’re not learning astrophysics here.

Think of it like taking a driver that has driven a vehicle with an automatic transmission all of their life, and now you are sticking them into a vehicle with a Manual Transmission. Very large learning curve now, isn't it.

No. Not at all.

This is why we are all here as a round table. The more knowledge in one place. The more help users get. Now when the user refuses to be forth coming, or just posts and runs, it makes it hard to fix their problem.

I have to ask at this point > How much experience do you have at running and using 8 and/or 8.1? You list Xubuntu as your OS in your system specs.

 

[adamf]

Appears to me with many recent posts that new 8/8.1 users are kind of Windows illiterate. Is it because of the smartphone/tile/android generation?

No. Just this I'm afraid - common to most cultures Good old days - RationalWiki

 

[jimbo45]

Right Jimbo. Those are excellent points. And that's what I was talking about - not PC knowledge specifically but general education.

I have a cousin who says that rising gas prices do not concern him - he always takes gas for $20 and that is always the same.

Hi there.

I'm currently in the UK -- and listening to a debate as to whether the UK should stay or leave the EU -- while this is a total matter for UK citizens it's totally amazing the amount of inaccurate information and deliberate obfuscation that goes out over the air -- there's NO WAY any average person in the UK could make a reasonably intelligent decision over this topic -- same with "Control / Freeze over Gas (Energy not auto fuel for US readers) and electricity prices -- the left leaning politicians say they'll impose a price freeze but are totally oblivious to the fact that the UK needs to IMPORT gas -- so if other countries are paying more who will sell to the UK -- Gazprom might be Russian but it's just as commercial as any western company and certainly sells to the highest bidder. Meanwhile any suggestion of looking for or exploting local resources such as Fracking ( NW England has literally mega TERA Cu metres of useable gas reserves - more than sufficient for the next 70 - 100 years even at current technology levels) gets the "Rent a crowd" out protesting on the streets.

BBC News - 'Fracking': The potential for shale gas in the north west

Most people haven't any inkling of what to do next - and should people try and ignore the market or "Real Politik" then they probably deserve what will happen to them -- the whole public education system here in the UK is utterly appalling except for a few privileged people who can probably leave should the worst happen.

Most W.European countries (such as Belgium, Germany, France, Holland, Denmark etc) have vastly superior education system - but even here there's still a huge amount of basic ignorance.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[adamf]

they have to buy gas anyway

Yep, I do.

 

[broe23]

HippsieGypsie, I have over two years using 8. I have over 36 years with working with computers. As for the whole Android/iOS vs. Windows 8 phones. Try again. I have used the latest Windows 8 phone, due to the user could not figure out how to use it. Three of us that have IT Degrees, all agreed that the Windows 8 platform should never have been released out to the wild. That it should have stayed in the lab.

You can disagree with what I wrote, and make all the assumptions you want. The subject was about 8.x creating illiterate smartphone users. My point is that the problem is that it is not the OS making users illiterate, it is their mindset. You just proved my point about some end users not using the resources available, before making a post about something

To let you know. For the Android & iOS platforms. They do not bury stuff under multiple levels, unlike Microsoft has done with all versions of the Windows 8 OS. It should not have to take more then 3 steps to get to something. As it is with Windows 8.x.

I list Xubuntu in my System Spec's, because that is what I use on my personal laptop. I have Windows 7 in a VM on it, and Windows 8 is in a image on my NAS, if I need it to look at something, which I do not. Since anything I need to know about 8, can be found in a simple search on a Search engine. When you do a search on something about 8. You end up getting stuff back about 7. That is how bad it has become with the fact that Microsoft has killed their holy grail that was supposed to bring them back to life.

If you are lucky to get something back about 8. You get five forums talking about the same subject. As for users, there are two types. Windows users and Real Computer users that use Linux.

 

[broe23]

Appears to me with many recent posts that new 8/8.1 users are kind of Windows illiterate. Is it because of the smartphone/tile/android generation?

No. Just this I'm afraid - common to most cultures Good old days - RationalWiki

The good ole days, were when we did not have to deal with the garbage coming out of the likes of Microsoft.

 

[whs]

HG, quick question: How do you make those screenshots on your W8P. With mine it says to push the Home and Power-on buttons at the same time. That always only gets me a screenshot of the home screen. What am I missing - maybe my 521 is a bit retarded ??