I'm going to challenge all you Win8 haters...

[Gustavius99]

Win8RP is just gorgeous. I have Win7 64 bit also installed, I go back and forth and old Win7 is really looking prehistoric now compared to the Win8 series. I really hope Microsoft doesn't drop Aero after RP, some of us like the eye candy, it makes our work a little more pleasant. Personally, I love the glass effects. I might keep RP until it expires if they make the final retail version all 2D and flat with no Aero.

 

[area 66]

....... I had a thought: why do I have to use the Desktop?


Give that a try. Do not even go into the Desktop. ......

is this a joke ?

 

[SIW2]

It is from somebody who doesn't need to do anything complex on their pc.

The metro ui is not for that.

That is the reason win8 is a hybrid.

MS are aware of the extreme limitations of Metro UI, even though a few posters are not.

Unfortunately, MS have decided to offer their Frankenstein hybrid not just to tablet users - but to everyone.

They don't have anything aimed at the hundreds of millions of their customers who want a full main ui, not Metro plus a stripped down desktop.

 

[Vince53]

One of the reasons why desktop sales are declining is that they last longer.

 

[Pauly]

Obviously massive limitations but it works

The family seem to like it while i dont really use it too busy doing "proper computer stuff" ;-)

 

[whs]

One of the reasons why desktop sales are declining is that they last longer.

That's a good point. In addition most people who do simple straight forward things are happy with the OS they have as long as it does not give them any trouble.

Last year we were on vacation in France renting from a host family. They had a Win 2000 system available for our use. My wife who does mostely AOL mail and visits her crafting buddies blogs did not even notice the difference. She normally runs on Vista and Windows7 systems, but for her type of work it could be just any system that operates properly.

And those are the kind of users that can care less about all this new stuff. There is absolutely no incentive for them to spend money on a new OS. I have a brand new (still in the wrappers) Windows7 system on my desk that I wanted to install on one of her Vista laptops because the laptop has a SSD and I wanted the Trim. But she did not let me. Her argument was simple - the thing works, why change.

 

[poppa bear]

Last year we were on vacation .... Her argument was simple - the thing works, why change.

And that says it all! If it ain't broke, don't fix it! ... unless you can improve it! Which hasn't happened in Metro! :thumb:

Win7 Start Menu, which has peaked in functionality, is universally acclaimed as the most efficient way to access data. The Start Menu Orb is the size of a dime and has EVERYTHING at your fingertip .... with as many programs open as you like. It even over-rode Microsoft updates being actively installed on XP via IE6 to allow programs to run on the UI, such as My Computer, etc.

As I said in another post, M$ actually has given us the choice of the same operating system in two formats!

Windows 7 Desktop, and ...

Windows 8 Tablet cum Touch Phone!

 

[jimbo45]

One of the reasons why desktop sales are declining is that they last longer.

C'mon guy
once a market matures of course sales decline.
But do you REALLY think the number of people who use a "Workstation" type of PC --this includes laptops BTW is actually diminishing.

How many people who use the "dreaded Ipad" don't have a computer as well (whether an Apple or PC is irrelevant to this discussion).

"Case closed m'lud -- Next case please."

cheers
jimbo

 

[Mystere]

And that says it all! If it ain't broke, don't fix it! ... unless you can improve it! Which hasn't happened in Metro! :thumb:

Here's the thing. What you don't realize is that Metro has a specific purpose. With Windows 8, Microsoft will be releasing the first major non-x86 version of windows in many many years. The ARM tablets will run Windows 8, but will not be able to run any legacy apps. Metro apps run in a virtual machine, and can be run on any processor architecture without modification.

This is just the first step on a road MS is trying to go on towards processor neutral architectures.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
This type of architecture has been around for Donkeys Years. -- Have you ever worked on a SAP system -- the ABAP main language is a sort of "Meta" language which can run on pretty well any architecture you need it to run on. The ABAP coders etc do their stuff and this code will have no problem in running on whatever backend computer system the SAP system runs from.

If MS wants to go down a similar route "Good for them " but it's not always so simple -- I've seen some of these SAP bozos getting paid as much as 1200 EUR a day -- a bit beyond what a home computer user would pony up to MS to fix a problem. !!

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Coke Robot]

The metro UI for now has certain limitations for certain people, but it does have a Desktop and has a new way to get around. But even then, if the start menu was that great, it would had seen more use. The reason why it was taken out was the because of the Windows 7 taskbar that eliminated half of the start menu's use. As for metro app use, that's why there's a dedicated Windows RT version. See, a lot of problems wouldn't be in argument if certain people realize that there is a Desktop there and it functions just as fine as 7's.

 

[Mystere]

I have no idea what your point is. I did not suggest that a virtual machine is anything new. I'm saying that Microsoft is positioning windows to be platform agnostic, and Metro is the first step on that path.

 

[Colonel Travis]

if the start menu was that great, it would had seen more use. The reason why it was taken out was the because of the Windows 7 taskbar that eliminated half of the start menu's use.

Nah, that wasn't the reason. Thurrott says:

Microsoft has been furiously ripping out legacy code in Windows 8 that would have enabled third parties to bring back the Start button, Start Menu, and other software bits that could have made this new OS look and work like its predecessor.

The reason it was taken out is because MS said to take it out. If they really cared about their users (or were even indifferent) they would have left it in. But they're apparently working overtime to make sure no one can put it back. That's a big slap in the face to a lot of people. If it's been so useless, why has there been so much howling about it being removed?

You look at 8 with such a narrow perspective, which is - why doesn't everyone use it like I use it? This line of thinking is weird because at the same time you keep saying that not everyone is a power user, so why can't you see how great 8 is for us non-power users? It cuts both ways, Cokey, that's all.

See, a lot of problems wouldn't be in argument if certain people realize that there is a Desktop there and it functions just as fine as 7's.

Yeah, we know. What's behind the principle complaints about 8 - the Metro part or the desktop part?

 

[crawfish]

The reason it was taken out is because MS said to take it out. If they really cared about their users (or were even indifferent) they would have left it in. But they're apparently working overtime to make sure no one can put it back. That's a big slap in the face to a lot of people. If it's been so useless, why has there been so much howling about it being removed?

By removing the Start Menu, Microsoft is also screwing people like me, who recognized in 1995 that the Start Menu sucks because it's hard to navigate and goes away when you choose something from it, forcing you to to do the navigation all over again. So I never used the Start Menu as the primary program launcher, and you'd think I wouldn't miss it. However, I do miss it, because I drag icons from it to my real program launcher, which used to be jetToolbar until Windows 7 introduced its very excellent taskbar, whose virtues I've extolled ad nauseum in earlier posts. I wanted to populate the taskbar with some icons in my Windows 8 VM just for testing, and I had to go looking in Explorer and the hidden AppData folders, where the Start menu folders (per user and all users) continue to live. Microsoft really has taken their Customer Contempt Policy to an entirely new level in Windows HE, which feels like someone throwing darts at me or something when I try to use it. And that's not even getting into all the Metro horror, which I've also written a lot about in earlier posts. The amount of fail in Windows HE really is hard to comprehend.

 

[Coke Robot]

if the start menu was that great, it would had seen more use. The reason why it was taken out was the because of the Windows 7 taskbar that eliminated half of the start menu's use.

Nah, that wasn't the reason. Thurrott says:

Microsoft has been furiously ripping out legacy code in Windows 8 that would have enabled third parties to bring back the Start button, Start Menu, and other software bits that could have made this new OS look and work like its predecessor.

The reason it was taken out is because MS said to take it out. If they really cared about their users (or were even indifferent) they would have left it in. But they're apparently working overtime to make sure no one can put it back. That's a big slap in the face to a lot of people. If it's been so useless, why has there been so much howling about it being removed?

You look at 8 with such a narrow perspective, which is - why doesn't everyone use it like I use it? This line of thinking is weird because at the same time you keep saying that not everyone is a power user, so why can't you see how great 8 is for us non-power users? It cuts both ways, Cokey, that's all.

See, a lot of problems wouldn't be in argument if certain people realize that there is a Desktop there and it functions just as fine as 7's.

Yeah, we know. What's behind the principle complaints about 8 - the Metro part or the desktop part?

Microsoft is probably making sure the start menu can't be brought back because it would a slap to the face for them for users to do that. If that happened, I guess it would cause confusion in the consumer market that the start menu works on some people's systems if you do something. It would bring a lot of flack on their behalf. Not only that, a lot of work has gone into the Start Screen and to just turn it off would a real defeat. Sure, no start menu is a slap to the face for some, but the Start Screen is just a new navigational tool. It can act like the start menu, with library locations and Control Panel and other items you can customize if you need it.

But setting that aside, I got back to my main argument. Everyday people don't use or care for the start menu. To me, if the company of the product has data proving such, that has more resonance than a forum member on a site where demographically a lot of tech heads which use desktops. It's like saying the guy at the local mechanic shop knows more about your car's engine than the company that designed, engineered, and built it.

I get that it goes both ways, but I align myself closer to a power user than a common user. I like to tinker with new things and see how it works, and get the most out of something new. I've used 8 since the Developer Preview days and literally the first week of using it, I got the Start Screen configured to have items that the start menu had. The Consumer Preview allowed me to pin all seven of my Library locations, unlike the start menu. I've learned how to work it based on how I used to work with 7. So yeah, I find it a little incomprehensible when people say Windows 8 isn't for desktops when I've been using it on a desktop and it works better than the last OS which was 7. Remember Windows 7? Remember how people decried as vista 2.0 or a better working vista and said it will still be plagued and complained that the taskbar sucked because it was too big and didn't work how it did in vista? You don't hear that anymore because people have LEARNED how to use the polished UI to continue to work as they did in vista but easier. It's the same thing with 8, yes, the changes are a lot more significant than 7's, but in time, I bet many people will learn how to use and accept it and like it. Just like what happened with Office 2007's Ribbon UI, just like in xp's luna theme, and just like in Windows 95 where the last major overhaul of Windows was.

 

[legacy7955]

Microsoft is probably making sure the start menu can't be brought back because it would a slap to the face for them for users to do that.

That makes perfect sense, punish the customer for THEIR lack of perception of what the cutomers actually wanted? LOL
FAIL!

Everyday people don't use or care for the start menu..

I know PLENTY of "everyday" people that in fact DO use the start menu.

The consultants were wrong.

 

[HippsieGypsie]

Dual boot 7 ultimate and 8 RP - A lot of good comments and terrific thread on getting insights. I believe 8 is best of both worlds although it's taking time for me to learn. Metro to me is nothing but a big Start Menu where I believe one can organize it to ones taste and productivity. I can even save Metro IE favorites in the "Big Start Menu". Then I can switch to the desktop like I did in any other OS. MS is in the software business. It sells software, especially OSs. It has to keep up with hardware, especially touch. We all heard in the news that 8 was going to be designed for a lot of different applications and devices. So far as Metro apps, give it time. People are writing them as we forum. Time will tell.

 

[elbeasto]

I ran it for less than a day, the full screen interface was just too annoying.

I didn't know what was open and what wasn't & the fact that there doesn't even seem to be an option to use a traditional desktop is unfair as it's forcing you to adapt when there's absolutely no need to.

If MS insist on pushing this interface, they must include an option for a start menu or most serious PC users will keep using Win7.

If you're on a tablet or only emailing/browsing then okay, I suppose you could live with Metro but what about the rest? I imagine the rest would come to a pretty large percentage of the windows market no?

 

[CB]

Just little thought here to the OP.

Why challenge.
Creating, constructing, and innovating OS is definitely a matter science and technology work. Developer (MS) can use as much advanced tech as possible. They might squeeze all sophisticated things into it. But when it comes into consumer, it turns into needs, privileges, and preferences. When we say we don't like metro, we have every reason why. Others don't have right saying we are stupid or old fashioned guys that worth to be challenged. Every single thing that make our work done faster is appreciated, and, accepted. We work with hundreds interconnected machines in office network, how Metro UI would handle that? Or I haven't learned much I think.

If in the future metro UI can do what desktop does. I will just say welcome aboard.

Kevin

 

[Coke Robot]

Win8RP is just gorgeous. I have Win7 64 bit also installed, I go back and forth and old Win7 is really looking prehistoric now compared to the Win8 series. I really hope Microsoft doesn't drop Aero after RP, some of us like the eye candy, it makes our work a little more pleasant. Personally, I love the glass effects. I might keep RP until it expires if they make the final retail version all 2D and flat with no Aero.

I find it's interesting that before vista and during vista, eye candy wasn't considered something of a reason to upgrade to a new OS. Now it is...