No way will PC's die and be replaced by tablets

[CountMike]

CountMike, all valid points. But most will trade loss of overclocking capability if they can travel easily with their laptop. I like being able to move the laptop around the house, and take outside and sit on the porch.

I'm not much of an upgrader, I just end up replacing the whole thing. Then I give the old one to my kids or somebody in need.

Yeah, for shear portability laptops are good thing and would be a shame for them to loose that by trying to be as powerful as desktops. It's better to have battery that lasts longer but to be good enough to do a job required, anything else can wait till I get home. Same goes for tablets, small enough not to be a bother to carry but to do what they are supposed to. Smart phones as capable as they become, are of no use if battery does not last long enough to make an urgent phone call because they used too much power to do jobs assigned to tablets and become useless to do their base job.

 

[whs]

I once made a comparison converting a 1.9GB video from .mov to .mp4. I used a laptop and a desktop - both had i7 CPUs, 8GB of RAM and Windows 7 and both cost appr. $1150 (the desktop + the monitor). I also used the same program - Freemake.

The conversion on the laptop took nearly 3 times the time compared to the desktop. And that figures - although they were both i7s, the mobile i7 is a lot less powerful than the desktop i7. Desktop CPUs could not be cooled enough in a laptop and the same goes for GPUs.

I don't think you can build top laptops that perform like top desktops - matter of physics. And for video or 3D graphics work and games, you just need raw muscle.

 

[caperjack]

I once made a comparison converting a 1.9GB video from .mov to .mp4. I used a laptop and a desktop - both had i7 CPUs, 8GB of RAM and Windows 7 and both cost appr. $1150 (the desktop + the monitor). I also used the same program - Freemake.

The conversion on the laptop took nearly 3 times the time compared to the desktop. And that figures - although they were both i7s, the mobile i7 is a lot less powerful than the desktop i7. Desktop CPUs could not be cooled enough in a laptop and the same goes for GPUs.

I don't think you can build top laptops that perform like top desktops - matter of physics. And for video or 3D graphics work and games, you just need raw muscle.

cant remember any of the specs just the price,recently a local was selling a gaming laptop on kijiji ,add stated gaming laptop ,asking 2200.00cdn, paid 4000.00cdn ,so really ,really good one are made

 

[CountMike]

I once made a comparison converting a 1.9GB video from .mov to .mp4. I used a laptop and a desktop - both had i7 CPUs, 8GB of RAM and Windows 7 and both cost appr. $1150 (the desktop + the monitor). I also used the same program - Freemake.

The conversion on the laptop took nearly 3 times the time compared to the desktop. And that figures - although they were both i7s, the mobile i7 is a lot less powerful than the desktop i7. Desktop CPUs could not be cooled enough in a laptop and the same goes for GPUs.

I don't think you can build top laptops that perform like top desktops - matter of physics. And for video or 3D graphics work and games, you just need raw muscle.

cant remember any of the specs just the price,recently a local was selling a gaming laptop on kijiji ,add stated gaming laptop ,asking 2200.00cdn, paid 4000.00cdn ,so really ,really good one are made

Holly laptop Batman, what a desktop machine I can make for 4000 bucks !!! That laptop would look like calculator !!!

 

[whs]

Sure, there are fine laptops out there - for a lot of money. But they can never compete with high end desktops because of the physical limitations in the confined spaces - heat being the biggest problem.

And another problem is the size of the screen. My comfort zone starts at 22". On a small screen, I can touch a few icons or tiles (even on my 4" W8P screen), but I cannot 'make' anything. It's only for consumption.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there

I agree with @whs -- any sort of video editing - you need sheer raw muscle - fast I/O and a lot of FAST RAM - you need probably at least an 8 core processor (or better a multi cpu system) to get any decent speed with transcoding for output at anything like passable video quality --people watch on HUGE screens these days where the flaws of "bog standard" DVD's played on a non upscaling DVD player look obvious --and with 4K video coming soon at sensible prices this will really tax any domestic machine now.

Apart from the CPU you need a decent Mobo with a proper bus width, multiple bus paths for Memory (RAM) address channels and decent I/O channel paths -- a laptop even with an i7 in it just won't cut it. For 3D work too you'll probably need a separate powerful GPU -- and these just have too many heat problems to even THINK of putting them in laptops.

I have only really been using my old desktop recently because the laptops I have are just too slow for some of the video work I'm messing about with. Before that the old desktop (Quad 3,2 Ghz processor / 16GB RAM Sata drives etc) was just gathering dust -- it's STILL TOO SLOW !!! so I'm going simply to turn it into a simple file server and media streamer.

For the first time in YEARS I'm actually looking to buy (or even make) a decent desktop type of machine -- I'll be looking at something where I can put MORE than ONE CPU in it --try that in a laptop !!!.

Obviously for travelling mobile computing needs are different - but with more High quality video being delivered away from physical media I think we are a LONG way from seeing the death knell of the "Desktop PC" --of course it won't ever be as popular as a few years ago -- the whole landscape has changed - but to say they will soon become extinct is a bit like telling the inhabitants of Greater Los Angeles that Cars will be replaced by bicycles.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[JHough]

$1150 Desktop faster than laptop. What about $380 laptop?

I once made a comparison converting a 1.9GB video from .mov to .mp4. I used a laptop and a desktop - both had i7 CPUs, 8GB of RAM and Windows 7 and both cost appr. $1150 (the desktop + the monitor). I also used the same program - Freemake.

The conversion on the laptop took nearly 3 times the time compared to the desktop. And that figures - although they were both i7s, the mobile i7 is a lot less powerful than the desktop i7. Desktop CPUs could not be cooled enough in a laptop and the same goes for GPUs.

I don't think you can build top laptops that perform like top desktops - matter of physics. And for video or 3D graphics work and games, you just need raw muscle.

Thank you whs for confirming my suspicion that at greater than $500 the desktop is more powerful than the laptop.

The point of my previous post was that putting together a desktop for $380, which is more powerful than my laptop may be difficult, when the monitor, cables, mouse, and keyboard are added in. Adding a short term battery backup would make it more of a challenge.

Would anyone care to put together a desktop for $380 or less which is more powerful than my laptop?

 

[whs]

$380 is not enough for a desktop if you factor in the monitor which is around $100 by itself. Battery backup is another $60 to$80 item. So you only have $200 for the actual box, the mouse and the keyboard.

But for people that have all the outboard gear already, it might be possible.

But I am talking about high end systems over $1000. And there the desktop shines.

 

[strollin]

I don't think anyone here is arguing that a desktop isn't more powerful but that the "average" user doesn't need all that power and that a tablet or laptop provides more than enough power for them.

Pretty much anyone that reads this forum on a regular basis would not qualify as an "average" user, we are in the minority. By the same token, those that need the power of a desktop are in the minority.

 

[broe23]

You are correct strollin. If we are all mature enough. These Round Table Discussions will stay mature and not turn into a holy war. I would rather openly discuss stuff like this with others. All due to it not only helps those that do this stuff for an employer as a IT department head. But it can also help those that are looking for something that may help them on a paper for computer class.

If we didn't discuss this stuff. It would never give us a break from troubleshooting others problems. I just spent 3 1/2 days working on a Dell Inspiron N7010 Laptop that had issues. Bad hard drive and overheating. Took going through four different tools to finally find the right one to pull the data.

Best thing is that it was experience gained by going to forums such as this. Is how I have learned what to look for, or where to look for the right software tools.

 

[Wynona]

CountMike, all valid points. But most will trade loss of overclocking capability if they can travel easily with their laptop. I like being able to move the laptop around the house, and take outside and sit on the porch.

And that's why I have both laptops, desktops and tablets Parks. Add to the mix a portable hard drive or three, and I'm all set to go traveling. When I'm going to be closer to home, I'll take one of my tablets with me. And, yes, I know that not everyone can afford some of each but I've been lucky. I do tend to keep stuff longer since I'm retired, though.

I'm not much of an upgrader, I just end up replacing the whole thing. Then I give the old one to my kids or somebody in need.

I'm lucky in that most of my desktops (except the current HP) were built long ago and upgraded as needed. A mobo here, RAM, there, video card another time, etc. I've retired several beta systems over the years and have had no problem finding someone of the senior persuasion who would like to upgrade. Yep, my castoffs are an upgrade for some!

 

[pparks1]

CountMike, all valid points. But most will trade loss of overclocking capability if they can travel easily with their laptop. I like being able to move the laptop around the house, and take outside and sit on the porch.

And that's why I have both laptops, desktops and tablets Parks. Add to the mix a portable hard drive or three, and I'm all set to go traveling. When I'm going to be closer to home, I'll take one of my tablets with me. And, yes, I know that not everyone can afford some of each but I've been lucky. I do tend to keep stuff longer since I'm retired, though.

I'm not much of an upgrader, I just end up replacing the whole thing. Then I give the old one to my kids or somebody in need.

I'm lucky in that most of my desktops (except the current HP) were built long ago and upgraded as needed. A mobo here, RAM, there, video card another time, etc. I've retired several beta systems over the years and have had no problem finding someone of the senior persuasion who would like to upgrade. Yep, my castoffs are an upgrade for some!

Yep, I have all those too. I just don't use my desktop at home hardly anymore. Mostly my MacBook pro now, or my Windows 8 work laptop. Have an original surface pro at work with type cover, but don't use that either. Wife had windows 8 touchscreen laptop, but mostly uses her iPad Air. Wife and I both have Samsung galaxy s3s. We have an Asus transformer droid tablet which mostly the kids use, and my daughter uses my wife's old iPhone.

 

[JHough]

My apologies, if I touched off a holy war. After putting together the cheapest laptop with a quad core processor, 4GB, Windows 8.1 and a touch screen, my guess was that building an equivalent desktop for the $380 price would be a challenge. After checking out 1 site, $485 was the cheapest desktop, which I could make. I was curious if anyone could make one cheaper. Discovering that any laptop would be cheaper than an equivalent desktop was a surprise to me.

Thank you for all of the feedback.

 

[whs]

Quite a collection Patrick. How come you have no Linux systems.

 

[Wynona]

My apologies, if I touched off a holy war. After putting together the cheapest laptop with a quad core processor, 4GB, Windows 8.1 and a touch screen, my guess was that building an equivalent desktop for the $380 price would be a challenge. After checking out 1 site, $485 was the cheapest desktop, which I could make. I was curious if anyone could make one cheaper. Discovering that any laptop would be cheaper than an equivalent desktop was a surprise to me.

Thank you for all of the feedback.

You didn't touch off a holy war, J Hough; it seems I did by saying I much prefer the comfort of my desktop to a laptop. And don't even mention that I consider a tablet the last 'puter I'd turn on. However, it seems I only ticked off one person. Too bad . . .

My philosophy is to each his own, and I don't make any attempt to change anyone's mind about which type of system he/she prefers to use. I say to figure out how much money you have and then go for the best product you can find that will fit your needs.

As to the cheapest way to go when building a desktop, rather than a new build, I rebuild. For the most part, the monitor, case, power supply, keyboard, mouse, hard drives, and sometimes even the video card can remain the same while installing a new motherboard, RAM, etc.

 

[pparks1]

Quite a collection Patrick. How come you have no Linux systems.

Well, I support a ton of Linux VM's at work. My work laptop runs Windows 8, as I need to be able to run the Office suite and manage our active directory environment and everything in it, so for my work laptop, it's basically gotta be Windows. But it does have a myriad of Linux VM's on it, mostly CentOS and none with GUI's.

My home desktop, is also my gaming machine. Thus, it runs Windows. It's still on 7 becuase #1), I seem to rarely ever use it and #2) couldn't see paying money to upgrade it to 8 since it won't really benefit me in any way.

My new laptop is a MacBook Pro. Wanted to learn something new. Wanted something that slept and woke from sleep nearly instantly. And wanted something most compatible with some side volunteer work that I do mixing audio. The MacBook was the perfect fit there.

My wife and my kids both have Windows 8 touchscreen laptops. Both machines came with Windows pre-loaded and I had no overwhelming need to change that.

I do have 2 other desktop Linux systems at home, but they haven't been used in quite some time either. I guess it's mostly because I do so much with Linux at work that when I come home these days I don't want to do the same things. I'm more or less perfectly content just browsing some forums, reading emails and posting on facebook these days. Too many other activities with my kids, and outside interests, volunteer work, running, biking, etc.

 

[whs]

Thanks for the tour. Soumds like the pizza baker who does not want to eat pizza for dinner, LOL.

 

[Tepid]

I did not read the whole thread and will state...

I have always said that Tablets will NOT replace Desktops.
Those consumers that are doing so are in the minority, and many will eventually get a Desktop again, if they got rid of theirs.
Or, they will get a nicer Laptop with a Docking station and a 21in screen.

There is no substitute for a 21in+ screen for computing, even doing consuming stuff like FB&T
These, in most cases will, if they are tech savvy enough, hook to their TV for streaming. (Is what I do)

However, for travel, I have a 17in Inspiron 1764 that use to go everywhere with me.
Now it stays home and I take my Surface Pro.

I take the same laptop case with all my cables (HDMI, RCA etc) for when staying in Hotels to hook up to the tv there, if possible.
If not,, the screen on the Surface Pro is adequate enough for watching movies.

The future will continue to see people with Desktop or more Powerful Docked Laptop in the home, and a Tablet and Smart Phone for travel.

You will also see BYOD doing the same.
Tablets for travel and docked laptop (maybe a bit of travel with it as well where needed) at home.

This will be more the norm than anything going forward.

And again,, I keep saying it, but Unified Apps are going to play a big part in that.
In most cases,, Buy Once and run on everything, or pay a fee for other devices.
(Phone, Tablet, Laptop, Dekstop, xBox, etc.) all running the same code, with optimized for device GUI.
Same Data, same options, same everything.

P.S. Check my specs of my desktop, I doubt there is a Laptop or tablet that can touch it.

 

[whs]

There is one important design point for tablets - they do not have active cooling. That reduces their choices for CPUs and GPUs enormously.

My T100 tablet has a quad core Atom processor that uses 2 Watts. The new high end AMD 8-core processors use 220 Watts. No way will such a processor ever live without active cooling. Even air cooling is not enough - you need liquid cooling.

High end PSUs are the same problem. They make a lot of heat. So until they come up with high end processors (4 GHz or more) that run a 2 Watts or something like that, there is no threat for high end desktops. But they can compete with desktops that run on modest Celeron processors.

 

[Rickkins]

Holly laptop Batman, what a desktop machine I can make for 4000 bucks !!! That laptop would look like calculator !!!

Is it even possible to spend $4000. building a desktop...??