Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Windows 8 swells to 2.7% of OS market

  1. #81


    Posts : 1,353
    Windows 8 Pro/Windows 8 Pro/Windows 7 64 Bit64Bit/Windows XP


    I don't think it really matters what we all think, Microsoft had to make a business decision to stay relevant. Maybe they've pissed a lot of people off, but lets face it, they've been doing that with every incremental change.

    The world is changing, even Wenda has gone out and bought a 7" tablet, Microsoft couldn't possibly ignore this market, and lets face it, it was Bill Gates who really started the ball rolling with tablets, it just didn't roll too far.

    Windows 7 was never going to cut it on small screens, and it was way too cluttered, to go on less powerful tablets. Why can't people just accept this as an attempt to stay relevant and look into the future and see that they had no other choice.

    Stick with Windows 7 if you must, but don't begrudge a company it's future.

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  2. #82


    Posts : 1,353
    Windows 8 Pro/Windows 8 Pro/Windows 7 64 Bit64Bit/Windows XP


    Quote Originally Posted by whs View Post
    I don't dislike 8 because I find it "hard" to use, I find it annoying and frustrating to use. Very different issue
    Patrick, that is exactly my point too. I have used Win8 for over a year now - so it is not a lack of experience. I even made a whole series of tutorials on it. But the darn thing is just not comfortable to use. You always stumble over this hybrid interface which makes you do additional detours.

    Now the enthusiasts would say that you can apply tweaks A, B and C and it will look like Windows 7. Well, in that case, I can stay just as well on Windows 7 which runs mighty fast and is very secure on my systems. If they want me to move to another OS version, it has to be right 'out of the box' - especially since they want my money for it.
    Have you ever stopped to consider you're right out of the box might not be the same as everyone else's right out of the box. What you're saying is that Microsoft can't make a move without your permission, which is what quote a few people on this forum are saying.

    Even with Linux people have their different tastes and flavours, do you expect MS to make 100 different forks to keep everyone happy. Ms has to make a decision about their future, not about a handful of people who can't accept change.

    Why can't you accept this as a first attempt and lets see how it all pans out. I think MS might have got the message by now, but I don't think you can recode everything in a couple of days.

    I personally find it exciting to be at the cutting edge of tech and to see change, I get bored with the same old rubbish. I think this is one of the most exciting times in tech for a very long time and I hope Microsoft becomes part of the change.
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  3. #83


    Posts : 1,353
    Windows 8 Pro/Windows 8 Pro/Windows 7 64 Bit64Bit/Windows XP


    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lazure View Post
    All this talk of moving away from desktops. There are things that really can only be done properly on a desktop. For instance, gamers who enjoy a 20" or higher 1080p+ screen with 3D and top notch gpu performance and a real keyboard/mouse to interface with the games properly and comfortably. A tablet or mobile device could never replicate this. Even when they manage to fit a GTX 690 inside a tiny tablet, a gamer still won't wanna play such games by touching on a 10" screen.

    Don't get me wrong, I didn't say the desktop and laptop was dead. But you would have to be blind to NOT notice that sales are dwindling big time. You will always have gamers, you will always have hardcore enthusiast users who stay on a desktop/laptop, you will continue to have business desktop users who have a need for a full fledged PC. But these aren't the majority of users. The largest % of desktop users are moving to smartphones, tablets, etc...and they are finding less and less of a need to actually use their computers. In fact, many of them probably didn't have a need for a desktop/laptop anyway...that was just the form factor they had available to pick from. If you don't think that % of the market is huge, ask yourself why MS is scrambling and rebuilding a new touch centric interface for their OS, and coming hot and heavy with the Surface, the Windows Phone 8, etc.


    Quote Originally Posted by whs View Post
    I think that is the point. I have a tablet for on the go. It is easier to carry than a laptop and has some additional functions that I use - e.g. Navigation. But I would never give up my PCs and live only on the tablet. Just imagine trying to do any serious video editing on the itty bitty screen, not to speak about the muscle the machine needs to do that conveniently.

    I have a bunch of friends who do the same. But nobody would give up their 22" screens and the power of a desktop.
    Well, we are the enthusiasts. I run dual monitors and find no value whatsoever in Metro apps as they consume too much of the screen and cannot be resized. We will be here for quite some time.


    Are you insinuating that if I just gave Windows 8 a better attempt, I would without a doubt fall in love with it?


    I don't dislike 8 because I find it "hard" to use, I find it annoying and frustrating to use. Very different issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    Anyway Munin let your story be an inspiration to others, Windows 8 is not the end of the world.
    But for many of us, it's hardly an improvement in any way on Windows 7. Unless you value a fast startup more than anything else.


    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    I know, I've tried the el cheapo Office substitutes, but after a while you see the problems that you come across and it's back to Office.
    Well, many of these issues wouldn't be issues if the main players had followed standards for documents and such. But they didn't. They stonewalled us into their own file formats and created a de facto standard that now causes us to either pay for the main player or struggle with the third parties.

    I find that I exchange very few documents with MS Office uses, so the Open Offices and Google docs of the world are just fine and dandy for me. I've no need to spend a single cent on MS office for home use. I can use that money for other things.
    Talking about Office, for the last few days I've been trying to collate all my travel experiences, photos and maps, a mammoth task. A couple of weeks ago I signed up to Office 365 with Onenote, I've used OneNote before and always liked it. But man when you dig deeper into that programme it is unsurpassable as far as I can see.

    I can put anything into it and organise it in such a way that everything is easy to find and it still doesn't look cluttered. I've tried numerous Journal type programmes over the years but this is the best by far.
    I'd gladly pay $100 just for OneNote on its own.

    But then of course there's Access another programme which is pretty brilliant, I'd be a bit rusty on there now, but I will delve back in and play around to see what I can come up with.
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  4. #84


    Germany/Florida
    Posts : 4,514
    Vista and Win7


    BillWindows, I am glad you are all excited. Technology change must be all new to you. I don't know where you are coming from. I have been an Operating System developer and architect for 35 years and know they could have done better.

    There is nothing wrong with Windows 8 on tablets and phones. But why could they not keep the known UI for the desktop. That would have been very easy. The improvements under the covers could have very well be applied to the Windows 7 base.

    I have dealt with about 50 different operating systems in my life (most on large host systems). Windows 8 is one of the least attractive on a PC. Just the fact that many people have to use some OEM program to make the UI bearable does not speak for the system - and that is different to configuring the system with it's built-in options. This is part of 'out of the box'.
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  5. #85


    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    I don't think it really matters what we all think, Microsoft had to make a business decision to stay relevant. Maybe they've pissed a lot of people off, but lets face it, they've been doing that with every incremental change.
    I remember people raving about how great Windows 7 was.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    Why can't people just accept this as an attempt to stay relevant and look into the future and see that they had no other choice.
    Because I don't feel this was necessary to stay relevant. They could easily introduce Windows Phone 8, and Surface RT and Surface Pro and give the desktop users a choice as to what they preferred...either the new tablet style interface or the "classic" desktop style. I don't use anything "tablet-esque" on my desktop, I don't use a touchscreen, I don't want to use a touchscreen. They alienated a bunch of users by removing choice and making themselves more like Apple by locking it down and making it their way or no way. To that, I say "no thanks, not really interested".

    I don't begrudge them their future, but I won't just sit back and accept Windows 8 for what it is. It's a pretty lame ass attempt to try to kludge two totally separate ideas together and it went together like Chocolate ice cream and onions. I'm hoping somebody else comes along and provides something a lot better and gets MS moving. We need competition now more than ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    Have you ever stopped to consider you're right out of the box might not be the same as everyone else's right out of the box. What you're saying is that Microsoft can't make a move without your permission, which is what quote a few people on this forum are saying.
    I think we all consider that, but I don't think those of us who dislike Windows 8 are alone. I seriously think if you ask 100 people whether or not MS got this one right, more people are likely to say No.


    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    Why can't you accept this as a first attempt and lets see how it all pans out. I think MS might have got the message by now, but I don't think you can recode everything in a couple of days.
    I think that MANY of us are just waiting to see how things pan out. I didn't upgrade any machines myself, but I haven't sworn off Windows. I haven't given up on them. But I'm not too whipped up about this release and I feel it completely justified to let them know. Otherwise, it might not get better.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    I personally find it exciting to be at the cutting edge of tech and to see change, I get bored with the same old rubbish. I think this is one of the most exciting times in tech for a very long time and I hope Microsoft becomes part of the change.
    I love technology too, and I like to see what's cutting edge. But I will decide whether or not I want to use it or like it.

    Microsoft is in a tough position because they have the most established user base in the world. And these users are accustomed to doing tasks in a particular way. This release is a very radical change from this typical style, and for many, it's ahead of the curve. Many, including myself, are not whipped up at all about these smallish "apps" taking over on our desktops. I want full fledged, full power applications. Not facebook phone apps on my PC. I've been using computers for a long time with a keyboard and a mouse and I'm not excited about the prospects of using a touch display. It just doesn't suit me, the world isn't ready for it yet, I'm not efficient with it, and it's just flat out annoying for me. I hate cleaning off the fingerprints, I hate changing planes with my hands. The only thing that I honestly like is it's easier for demonstrating something for somebody.

    As I have always maintained, I think the biggest issue here is lack of choice. It's something that it seems we have always had more of in the past, and it seems to slowly be going away. This doesn't excite many of us.
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  6. #86


    Posts : 1,353
    Windows 8 Pro/Windows 8 Pro/Windows 7 64 Bit64Bit/Windows XP


    . There is nothing wrong with Windows 8 on tablets and phones. But why could they not keep the known UI for the desktop. That would have been very easy. The improvements under the covers could have very well be applied to the Windows 7 base.
    Have you ever noticed that when a President makes a decision, everyone has different ideas, Microsoft made a decision. If you're a developer you must realise its a lot easier to code for one OS than numerous, and as far as I know that is what Microsoft is aiming at.

    I've been using computers for a long time with a keyboard and a mouse and I'm not excited about the prospects of using a touch display. It just doesn't suit me, the world isn't ready for it yet, I'm not efficient with it, and it's just flat out annoying for me. I hate cleaning off the fingerprints, I hate changing planes with my hands. The only thing that I honestly like is it's easier for demonstrating something for somebody.
    You might not be excited about using touch but the rest of the world is, and I'd say that was what prompted MS to come up with Windows 8.
    Like it or not, it's going to be around till at least Windows Blue.
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  7. #87


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    The opposite is true


    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    What would happen if MS were to close down tomorrow, I know what would happen, the world would be in turmoil.
    If MS disappeared tomorrow, it would have little effect (except on the employees, BOD, shareholders and the stock brokers).

    Everyone would continue to use what they already have.
    There would be a lot of "hand wringing" over what to buy next though (Apple or Linux).

    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by BillWindows View Post
    I know this is a bit melodramatic, but to me it almost seems that that's what people want.
    I don't think many dissenters want MS to shut down and go away. But I think many who are unhappy with Windows 8 would have been quite a bit happier with some customization choices. I know for a fact that I would. I realize MS has a reason to force it upon us...but that doesn't mean that I have to personally like that choice any better.
    The opposite is true (as long as you ignore the "Death to MS" Apple and Linux fanboys).
    Many people are bitching, because in their opinion, this thing is a disaster and if MS continues down this path they will cease to be relevant.

    Despite the claims of pundits (and even people on this forum) Tablets are basically useless in a lot of situations.
    The exceptions are:
    • Executives (what do they do anyway? Other people actually do their "work")
    • Your job requires you to use a clipboard/scanner (e.g. simple monitoring, stock control, etc.)
    • Your job requires you to view videos, Facebook, Twitter, blogs etc.


    Unless voice recognition (or thought control) become useful, preparing any sort of complex (or large) file is easier on a desktop.
    Currently the only way Tablets can do that sort of work, is to add accessories that turn them into underpowered desktops.

    Tablets are a fad, which is already starting to die out (just like Netbooks).
    Full size Apple iPad sales collapse as iPad mini takes over - Tablets - News - HEXUS.net

    The trend seems to be, Smart Phones are getting larger and Tablets are getting smaller.
    By the time MS gets its act together, Tablets will have merged with Smart Phones.

    Quote Originally Posted by DMGrier View Post
    I think Microsoft is looking into the future, I can walk into any store and any kid under the age of twelve is more then capable of using a mouse especially kids over 4-5 but I see everyone of them using a touch screen feature.
    How many of them have to write 50 page Word documents, or create Excel spreadsheets containing 100s of formulae and 1000s of cells?

    Quote Originally Posted by whs View Post
    And I am also moving to Linux Mint Mate. That is a good alternative. The installation and handling of Linux Mint Mate - Tutorial - Windows 7 Support Forums
    Linux Mint (MATE) is nice.
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  8. #88


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    I haven't met one person, in the flesh, who has had the least interest in Windows 8. When I show them Windows 8 on my tablet, I get a resounding 'meh'. However, lots of people are interested in touch devices, like iPads, iPhones, Android tablets and phones. But, hey! These people are clearly the odd ones out.
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  9. #89


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by SIW2 View Post
    The sensible thing would be to use their existing customers to expand into the portable devices. Make those 2bn or whatever it is happy. Make them want to to - not just upgrade their pc - but also have that warm fuzzy feeling about MS and buy the windows portables as well.
    Agreed.

    The sane strategy would be to makes sure that MS software continues to remain irreplaceable to business.
    Any portable devices have to be able to automatically integrate into the existing MS infrastructure (creating a "Private Cloud").

    Let's be realistic.
    Most people use Windows on their home PCs because that is what they have to use at work.
    The exception to that rule is Gamers, who use Windows, because games run on Windows.
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  10. #90


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    I haven't met one person, in the flesh, who has had the least interest in Windows 8. When I show them Windows 8 on my tablet, I get a resounding 'meh'. However, lots of people are interested in touch devices, like iPads, iPhones, Android tablets and phones. But, hey! These people are clearly the odd ones out.
    I've had a few interested in my office. But they are the same ones who see a new cell phone and say, I gotta have that, now which phone is that again? One is dating a guy who is an Apple fan, and she has more bought a MacBook pro, and an iphone and doesn't really now how to use either one of them. And we got a iPad mini at work and she wants it real bad, because, "it's cute".
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Windows 8 swells to 2.7% of OS market
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