Why would I want Windows 8

[ADRz]

The mere fact that we have to ask the question in this forum as to why we would want Windows 8 is an indictment of this development program.

I guess you are right. It expresses a certain unexcitement. That was different in the early Win7 days. But maybe they surprise us with the Beta.

Everybody is pretending that they are "excited" about a tablet version of Windows (which is what it is) but nobody really is. Win8 in tablets would be irrelevant to most. It stands little or no chance against the ecosystems of iOS and Android (which includes both Google and Amazon). Do consumers need another ecosystem to buy music or movies? I think not. Microsoft would find it very difficult to match the offerings of iTumes and Amazon. These tablets are fast becoming irrelevant. In the meantime, MS is busy screwing the desktop. Good work!!!

 

[revel911]

The mere fact that we have to ask the question in this forum as to why we would want Windows 8 is an indictment of this development program.

I guess you are right. It expresses a certain unexcitement. That was different in the early Win7 days. But maybe they surprise us with the Beta.

Everybody is pretending that they are "excited" about a tablet version of Windows (which is what it is) but nobody really is. Win8 in tablets would be irrelevant to most. It stands little or no chance against the ecosystems of iOS and Android (which includes both Google and Amazon). Do consumers need another ecosystem to buy music or movies? I think not. Microsoft would find it very difficult to match the offerings of iTumes and Amazon. These tablets are fast becoming irrelevant. In the meantime, MS is busy screwing the desktop. Good work!!!

I disagree totally, as someone who uses his tablet daily for work and for pleasure, I am excited to have a platform in which to sink my tablet with my work style. I want to remind people that this is only the first generation of tablets and people keep making it seems that they are already at their pinnacle of perfection. If the app store were open, I would use my Samsung tablet with Win8 on it over my Android tablet any day of the week.

To each their own, I have been pleased with the win 8 on my media center also. There are nuisances, do not get me wrong and a lot to be cleaned up. But I like where MS is going ..... working the same way year after year is not always the best way to move forward.

 

[ADRz]

I guess you are right. It expresses a certain unexcitement. That was different in the early Win7 days. But maybe they surprise us with the Beta.

Everybody is pretending that they are "excited" about a tablet version of Windows (which is what it is) but nobody really is. Win8 in tablets would be irrelevant to most. It stands little or no chance against the ecosystems of iOS and Android (which includes both Google and Amazon). Do consumers need another ecosystem to buy music or movies? I think not. Microsoft would find it very difficult to match the offerings of iTumes and Amazon. These tablets are fast becoming irrelevant. In the meantime, MS is busy screwing the desktop. Good work!!!

I disagree totally, as someone who uses his tablet daily for work and for pleasure, I am excited to have a platform in which to sink my tablet with my work style. I want to remind people that this is only the first generation of tablets and people keep making it seems that they are already at their pinnacle of perfection. If the app store were open, I would use my Samsung tablet with Win8 on it over my Android tablet any day of the week.

To each their own, I have been pleased with the win 8 on my media center also. There are nuisances, do not get me wrong and a lot to be cleaned up. But I like where MS is going ..... working the same way year after year is not always the best way to move forward.

As you said, to each ther own. I personally have absolutely no use for tablets. Between my laptops and my cell phone with its generous screen, I really do not need a tablet. I guess most do not. This does not mean that I wish to work the same year after year. I want real progress in computing and that means making computers smarter. If I want to touch something, I have better things to touch than glass. Tactile feedback is fine for finger-operated hardware (like telephones), but taking computing back to the Mesopotamian age is not my idea of advance in computing.

 

[revel911]

ADRz,


What do you do on your laptop? I am curious because I never thought I would have any use for a Tablet either, but as it does have more screen real estate than a phone, and more portable than a laptop I find myself using it ALL the the time. With updated batteries and new cores, we are about to come onto a generation of tablets that have 12+ straight active battery time which is amazing. HD video for an entire flight to China! Developer's are also finally really taking advantage of the way touch screens do work.


Now to this comment "but taking computing back to the Mesopotamian age is not my idea of advance in computing." I think the problem is ... people really feel Microsoft did not do there homework. Does anyone really think Metro was built for just Tablet and cool factor .... and that they were going to force it onto Windows? I need to find the diagram, but it showed that 70%+ users place icons on their desktop over using the search or programs tree feature. They see this ..... now, what they are doing is giving the people to do so in a more organized manner.


For most companies, how many programs do they actually use? Outlook, Excel, Word, Remote Desktop, and 1 or propriety programs? I am graphic designer, and I only use maybe 7-8. All able to fit on Metro and this way I can organize them nicely. I figure businesses will like this because they will be able to lock what programs people see on their start menu .... no more solitaire, no more internet browsing.

As I mentioned, they still have a lot to clean up on it. What matters is not working in the same manner, but an efficient one. Is this is, not now, but with a few adjustments. It's a good start.

 

[jimbo45]

"
Navigating through a classical menu screen with zillions of submenus etc or looking at a desktop simply littered with shortcut links doesn't please me at all"

Jimbo. I don't have a cluttered destop, but why do you see that as different from a desktop (Metro) cluttered with icons?
My "classical" Windows 7 start menu is organised into folders. After using the same basic structure since way back legacy OSs, I know where to quickly go for any particular program.
Like most, whilst I have a large number of programs on my computer, many are rarely used and are only for that rare convenience.
The thought of gazing at all those icons, as a welcome to my Windows 8 desktop, does not get my motor going. I will move on, for the benefits of, hopefully, improved performance - particularly in the 64Bit category. I am already, getting accustomed to the Non metro desktop and have not, so far, encountered any problems.

Hi I DID mention that the metro apps need to be able to be customised and arranged arranged differently from what they are now.


It's not the actual Desktop in W7 that's the problem it's when you install something there could be literally ZILLIONS of sub menus

for example your desktop could point to App1.exe that's fine when you want to use that mainly
but there could be loads of sub and sub sub menus

app1
app2 ====>sub menu1
submenu1 ===>option 1
option2
option 3
etc .

Now if you have a lot of these that you don't use often finding them can be a real pain at times.


however if the user can customize the Metro apps it should be possible to combine the rarely used but required sub menu into the main tile with the main menu. It's not so easy to re-arrange the "classical" menu format.

I certainly don't want my W8 desktop to look like a teenagers Smart phone which is why I hope the Metro tiles will be customisable so you can just include the links you want. Clicking on a Metro tile which contains embedded tiles would also be a preferable way IMO for operating this type of OS on a traditional Workstation / laptop.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Mark Phelps]

As the proud owner of a 2006-era Windows Tablet, I can truthfully say that the tablets people are buying today are NOT the first generation of tablets -- far from it.

I bought my tablet back in the day of paper day-timers! (remember those). I was using a Palm at the time, in addition to the day-timer, and found it an interesting idea to be able to replace BOTH with a single device.

Over the years, MS had improved the tablet-specific features built into their OSs to the point that with Win7, it is a much better machine than it was originally with XP.

As to who will buy them? Yeah, if all you do with your smart phone or tablet today is watch videos, make calls, send text messages, use a calendar or other functions (previously relegated to that ancient device known as a PDA), a larger smartphone (like the new Motorola Razr) would suffice. But, I used my tablet a lot to take notes -- and the now excellent handwriting recoginition feature prevented me from having to type stuff in at the end of the day. Being able to replace some of the functions previously needing a stylus with simply touching the screen is a big plus to me.

But then, I might be one of only a handful of folks that would buy a Win8 tablet.

 

[Coke Robot]

The mere fact that we have to ask the question in this forum as to why we would want Windows 8 is an indictment of this development program.

I still sometimes have to convince people to switch from vista to 7....it's kind of a tough sell. Now, convincing people from vista to 8, that is easy.

 

[Coke Robot]

For tablet users, 8 is a must since people kind of don't want a tablet that is kin to a smartphone when they could just buy a laptop. Touch is a good thing, it's natural, it's intuitive. Touching open an app and flicking through them is more natural than a mouse pointer. Soon, it might be all hand gestures...and touch...

 

[whs]

The mere fact that we have to ask the question in this forum as to why we would want Windows 8 is an indictment of this development program.

I still sometimes have to convince people to switch from vista to 7....it's kind of a tough sell. Now, convincing people from vista to 8, that is easy.

How do you figure that ??

 

[ADRz]

ADRz,


What do you do on your laptop? I am curious because I never thought I would have any use for a Tablet either, but as it does have more screen real estate than a phone, and more portable than a laptop I find myself using it ALL the the time. With updated batteries and new cores, we are about to come onto a generation of tablets that have 12+ straight active battery time which is amazing. HD video for an entire flight to China! Developer's are also finally really taking advantage of the way touch screens do work.


Now to this comment "but taking computing back to the Mesopotamian age is not my idea of advance in computing." I think the problem is ... people really feel Microsoft did not do there homework. Does anyone really think Metro was built for just Tablet and cool factor .... and that they were going to force it onto Windows? I need to find the diagram, but it showed that 70%+ users place icons on their desktop over using the search or programs tree feature. They see this ..... now, what they are doing is giving the people to do so in a more organized manner.


For most companies, how many programs do they actually use? Outlook, Excel, Word, Remote Desktop, and 1 or propriety programs? I am graphic designer, and I only use maybe 7-8. All able to fit on Metro and this way I can organize them nicely. I figure businesses will like this because they will be able to lock what programs people see on their start menu .... no more solitaire, no more internet browsing.

As I mentioned, they still have a lot to clean up on it. What matters is not working in the same manner, but an efficient one. Is this is, not now, but with a few adjustments. It's a good start.

Well, this is a decent question. Let me start with what I do not do. I do not watch movies. However, I produce lots of staff including complex technical documents, detailed project timelines, extensive spreadsheets, etc. I work in pharmaceutical R&D. In that context, the last thing I need is a stupid, brainless, full-screen task switcher. I need robust multitasking, multithreading, windowing applications. The windowing is quite essential not only to me but to everybody in the same context. Working on long documents, I need to have documents open while I have open browsers, databases, biostatistical tables, etc, etc and I need to move information from one document to the other, I need to generate complex graphs and tables etc, etc. In this context, the stupid Metro interface is only a hindrance and a serious impediment. MS is devoting time to this utter stupidity, chasing a market it would never catch instead of working in making complex work on the desktop much, much easier. Maybe the average consumer that dabbles in a bit of email and some web browsing is likely not to affected by a non-essential touch interface, but I would be affected quite seriously. Never mind all the time and effort not spend improving the current paradigm.

Have you ever worked in highly demanding situations such as real-time investing in which tones of information has to be on the screen at the same time? Have you worked ever putting together long submissions to the FDA for which you need to be working on a word processor while examining databases, launching SAS programs and examining a long list of PDFed hand-written reports, examining PDF X-rays and MRI images, etc, etc. Why would I want a Metro-interface??? It is for kids and for my grandma!!

Now, consumers with low computing demands may benefit from Metro (debatable) but I seriously doubt that anybody who does any real work would see any benefit, only another stupid layer. Thus, MS is going to be shut out from most of the enterprise. If Apple plays its cards correctly and produces and iOS that provides the richness of working on a desktop, it can make huge inroads while MS is trying desperately to sell a few tablets.

I do not believe that MS would even be successful in the tablet space. Why would anybody want a Windows tablet? There is more compelling content in the Apple and Google (Android) space. What does MS have that can even remotely compete with iTunes and Amazon??? Why purchase an expensive Win tablet when one can get access to superior content on a much cheaper and (in my opinion) far better ICS-driven tablet??? It makes no sense. MS is simply too lake to the party (and it has not even showed up).

And seriously, the Metro interace is far inferior (and I stress the "far") to that of ICS.

 

[ADRz]

As the proud owner of a 2006-era Windows Tablet, I can truthfully say that the tablets people are buying today are NOT the first generation of tablets -- far from it.

I bought my tablet back in the day of paper day-timers! (remember those). I was using a Palm at the time, in addition to the day-timer, and found it an interesting idea to be able to replace BOTH with a single device.

Over the years, MS had improved the tablet-specific features built into their OSs to the point that with Win7, it is a much better machine than it was originally with XP.

As to who will buy them? Yeah, if all you do with your smart phone or tablet today is watch videos, make calls, send text messages, use a calendar or other functions (previously relegated to that ancient device known as a PDA), a larger smartphone (like the new Motorola Razr) would suffice. But, I used my tablet a lot to take notes -- and the now excellent handwriting recoginition feature prevented me from having to type stuff in at the end of the day. Being able to replace some of the functions previously needing a stylus with simply touching the screen is a big plus to me.

But then, I might be one of only a handful of folks that would buy a Win8 tablet.

Why would you do this? These tablets are going to have capacitive screens are are not good for accurate writing. For that, you need a resistive screen. Of course, certain companies offer both (Fujitsu does in its tablets) but then we are not talking about consumer tablets, are we??

By the way, I do have a circa-2008 convertible laptop/tablet which I use for detailed design work. It can do things that a normal capacitive screen tablet is incapable of doing (precise control down to one pixel and hundreds of levels of pressure sensitivity). I need, and I will purchase, a more improved version of such a machine but then it would be around $2000 or more!!! (and I do not need to have a stupid Metro interface on this).

Again, the Metro interface is seriously dated. ICS, which would drive the upcoming generation of Android tablets is far superior as an interface because it is much mover versatile and has already copied and even surpassed ideas of the Metro interface (and I can modify it all that I want). These tablets are going to be in various sizes with all kinds of capabilities and much cheaper than Win8 ones.

So, let me see: If I need a tablet, I have a choice of cheaper ones with a better OS UI. Why would I want a Win8 tablet? I have not heard any argument on this as yet.

 

[Mark Phelps]

Why would you do this? These tablets are going to have capacitive screens are are not good for accurate writing. For that, you need a resistive screen. Of course, certain companies offer both (Fujitsu does in its tablets) but then we are not talking about consumer tablets, are we??

I would do it because I use the tablet for taking notes. And, given what you said, would probably look for a Fujitsu (which is what I have right now). But ... you make a good point.

ICS, which would drive the upcoming generation of Android tablets is far superior as an interface ...

I thought along the same lines ... until I read a post on one of the Android forums about failings of ICS.

So, let me see: If I need a tablet, I have a choice of cheaper ones with a better OS UI.

I have needs that Android tablets (at least currently) can not meet, namely, local usage of MS Windows apps (Office being only one of them), real-time synch with MS Exchange servers, and local disk storage (I don't want some Sys Admin at a remote site browsing through my data!).

If your needs are different, then of course, your solution would be different as well.

And, I saw today a thread on another forum about how the Win8 tablets would need to be priced down with the Android tablets to be competitive -- something I already mentioned in my thread. I'm certainly NOT going to pay the kind of $$$ for a Win8 tablet that I paid for my XP tablet back in 2006.

 

[ADRz]

Why would you do this? These tablets are going to have capacitive screens are are not good for accurate writing. For that, you need a resistive screen. Of course, certain companies offer both (Fujitsu does in its tablets) but then we are not talking about consumer tablets, are we??

I would do it because I use the tablet for taking notes. And, given what you said, would probably look for a Fujitsu (which is what I have right now). But ... you make a good point.

ICS, which would drive the upcoming generation of Android tablets is far superior as an interface ...

I thought along the same lines ... until I read a post on one of the Android forums about failings of ICS.

So, let me see: If I need a tablet, I have a choice of cheaper ones with a better OS UI.

I have needs that Android tablets (at least currently) can not meet, namely, local usage of MS Windows apps (Office being only one of them), real-time synch with MS Exchange servers, and local disk storage (I don't want some Sys Admin at a remote site browsing through my data!).

If your needs are different, then of course, your solution would be different as well.

And, I saw today a thread on another forum about how the Win8 tablets would need to be priced down with the Android tablets to be competitive -- something I already mentioned in my thread. I'm certainly NOT going to pay the kind of $$$ for a Win8 tablet that I paid for my XP tablet back in 2006.

Let me summarize: if you want a tablet for notes, then you would need to buy one with resistive and capacitive screens and here we are talking about serious money. As you well know, Fujitsu tablets of this kind are way above the current tablet pricing model.

ICS is not perfect. But by the time Win8 tablets are out, Android would be in version 5, leaving the interface of Win8 further and further behind. Whatever the failings of ICS may be, its UI is more attractive and more flexible for what I have seen so far in Win8

Local use of MS apps? Are you serious? If you want this, why are you even discussing a tablet? You should be considering an ultrabook at least, that has serious capability in running MS Office applications. It is likely that Fujitsu would release convertible ultrabook designs (I think that this is near certainty) that would have both capacity and resistive screens and would provide for your note taking and other requirements. My guess is that such ultrabook/tablets would be in excess of $1500. In any case, these machines would work with Win7 for the applications you have in mind. From what I see here, you do not need a tablet and certainly not Win8

 

[JMH]

Why should I buy Windows 8 rather than continue with Windows 7 on my desktop.

You can buy Windows 8????
{Rhetorical question I know......}

When it is released to the public I will buy it to keep up with new technology.

If we adopted the Philosophy of "resistance to change" we would still be in the Stone Age.

 

[ADRz]

Why should I buy Windows 8 rather than continue with Windows 7 on my desktop.

You can buy Windows 8????
{Rhetorical question I know......}

When it is released to the public I will buy it to keep up with new technology.

If we adopted the Philosophy of "resistance to change" we would still be in the Stone Age.

I am not resistant to change. Quite the opposite, in fact. I would adapt (and I do all the time) to lots of change that make my computing experience better and more enjoyable. I do not see any particular virtue to adapt to bad change, do you? So, since you have lots of choices in computing, you should adapt to changes that make sense for you, not because MS has so dictated.

Let me tell you one change that I did not adapt to: The change to 16:9 aspect ratio in laptop screens from 16:10. This is a change that is bad for users but excellent for hardware manufacturers because these screens cost so much less. Yes, this limits my choices in hardware, but I would not accept it. It does not make sense with the way all of us work in the web and at the office (where most things are vertical).

Now, it says something that Apple has remained steadfast on 16:10 screens (and so did a few Japanese manufacturers of business computers)

 

[revel911]

16:10 to 16:9 was less about cost and more about creating a consistent video production. Blame the increase of use of HDTV's as monitors for this.

Curious where tablet's are going to go with this, as most of them are at 16:10.

 

[ADRz]

16:10 to 16:9 was less about cost and more about creating a consistent video production. Blame the increase of use of HDTV's as monitors for this.

Curious where tablet's are going to go with this, as most of them are at 16:10.

Video was the excuse given, but costs were the real reason. Let's not mistake the fake rationales provided by manufacturers for the truth. Are we then to believe that Apple eschewed "consistent video production"? I think not. I believe that the 16:9 panels are substantially cheaper than the 16:10 ones and the resolution is consistently lower.

 

[Corpsecrank]

I think for me personally and this is considering I would run 8 from a desktop not a mobile device. I would think I could get a nice performance boost by going with 8 since it is so light weight in comparison to previous versions.

I do a lot of really resource intensive work on this rig and I can free up even more if I have a lighter OS running. 8 fits that bill so far and regardless of the interface I could work with it for that increase. Though I hear that metro is optional I still have no hands on experience with the interface or how that would translate in actual use. Anyone want to fill in those blanks feel free.

I do plan to use a Cintiq 24HD which may or may not make 8 an even more appropriate choice for me. I think graphics guys should consider that to some degree.

 

[whs]

since it is so light weight in comparison to previous versions.

The final verdict on this is still out. We are now working with a very small alpha footprint. Whether the RTM version will still be that light remains to be seen.

 

[vrosa]

The final verdict on this is still out. We are now working with a very small alpha footprint. Whether the RTM version will still be that light remains to be seen.

Surely, after all hidden features being enabled / added the scene may be a bit diferent, but I still think that W8 will be a nice OS