I've had a lot to say about Windows 8, but here are my final thoughts

[legacy7955]

Again lets stop with the talking points claiming that the Windows 8 "haters" don't like Metro.

NOT TRUE when it is used in the proper environment, it is quite good (tablets and phones) but the bottom line is that no matter how you spin it or which talking points MS tries to use. Metro UI is NOT a worthwhile environment for desktop and laptop users in general.

If MS is so confident in Metro then why not let the customer decide which UI to choose as the default for their device no matter which one it is, the fact that they are forcing Metro on all users as the default tells anyone with some grey matter that they are NOT confident in Metro and believe that they must force it. A bad business model.

 

[Mystere]

Legacy, you seem to speak as if you are speaking for everyone. You make claims that you can't back up. You state ridiculous conclusions.

Did Microsoft "lack confidence" in the Office Ribbon UI? Certainly not, yet they didn't make it optional. It was accepted, and people moved on.

Microsoft is not making it optional because this is the way Windows is going, period, end of story. They are extremely confident in it, and they aren't hedging their bets. That speaks strongly.

Now, I am as much of a doubter of the benefits of Metro as anyone, but I'm willing to give it a shot. If it doesn't work out, then it's not really a big deal. Windows 7 still exists. And chances are, it will be around until long after Windows 9 is out the door.

Microsoft is not changing their mind on this. It's way too late for that. Continuing to whine about it is just being.. well.. whiney. There is nothing you can do to change this outcome, and certainly whining on a forum is not going to help.

Frankly, I'm sick of hearing people complain about this. Windows 8 is what it is, and if you don't like it. Don't use it. I fail to get what you think you're going to accomplish by complaining to people who have nothing to do with the development of windows.

You certainly have a right to speak your mind, but i'd appreciate it if you didn't repeat yourself constantly. You've made your point, repeatedly, and nothing has or will change. What exactly do think is going to happen?

 

[legacy7955]

Legacy, you seem to speak as if you are speaking for everyone. You make claims that you can't back up. You state ridiculous conclusions.

Did Microsoft "lack confidence" in the Office Ribbon UI? Certainly not, yet they didn't make it optional. It was accepted, and people moved on.

Microsoft is not making it optional because this is the way Windows is going, period, end of story. They are extremely confident in it, and they aren't hedging their bets. That speaks strongly.

Now, I am as much of a doubter of the benefits of Metro as anyone, but I'm willing to give it a shot. If it doesn't work out, then it's not really a big deal. Windows 7 still exists. And chances are, it will be around until long after Windows 9 is out the door.

Microsoft is not changing their mind on this. It's way too late for that. Continuing to whine about it is just being.. well.. whiney. There is nothing you can do to change this outcome, and certainly whining on a forum is not going to help.

Frankly, I'm sick of hearing people complain about this. Windows 8 is what it is, and if you don't like it. Don't use it. I fail to get what you think you're going to accomplish by complaining to people who have nothing to do with the development of windows.

You certainly have a right to speak your mind, but i'd appreciate it if you didn't repeat yourself constantly. You've made your point, repeatedly, and nothing has or will change. What exactly do think is going to happen?

Actually I am speaking for at least 50% of MS customers and/ or potential customers. Those people do not like Metro UI for all environments. A 50% + dislike rate for a yet unreleased product like this is a very dangerous thing, even you'd have to agree with that.
Ah, the voice of arrogance, it usually kills businesses when they fail to listen to their best customers.

What's the matter...MS doesn't like looking at stubbornness in the mirror?

In the end the customer always wins.

 

[Coke Robot]

Again lets stop with the talking points claiming that the Windows 8 "haters" don't like Metro.

NOT TRUE when it is used in the proper environment, it is quite good (tablets and phones) but the bottom line is that no matter how you spin it or which talking points MS tries to use. Metro UI is NOT a worthwhile environment for desktop and laptop users in general.

If MS is so confident in Metro then why not let the customer decide which UI to choose as the default for their device no matter which one it is, the fact that they are forcing Metro on all users as the default tells anyone with some grey matter that they are NOT confident in Metro and believe that they must force it. A bad business model.

Not necessarily, Windows isn't the only environment that has metro design in it. It's not really a matter if Microsoft isn't sure about it (I bet there is some concern since it is very different than the norm, but metro design is more of philosophy to them) but it's really more about the "one UI to rule them all." See, Microsoft seems to be consolidating the company down into Xbox, Windows, and Windows Phone. They want those branches to extend to one another. They want those devices to work together, act together, and be used together. They want the UI to have the same design and feeling to it.

In the end, it could be the most brilliant, clever, and down right awesome thing Microsoft has done. They have the potential to make a huge change to the way we interact with technology, and the metro design will be there to do that.

 

[Mystere]

Where exactly do you get this 50% number from? I think you made it up. If you're basing it on the poll from here, this forum isn't exactly a representative population of the entire Windows user base. It's kind of ironic to complain about arrogance when you claim to speak for so many without any real evidence to back it up.

I doubt if even 10% of users will have any strong opinion about 8. (see, I can make up a number as well, difference is I state that this is my opinion) Most users are just that. Users. They use whatever it is they get, and they get their jobs done. Only a small percentage of people care much about the operating system at all.

Microsoft weathered the UAC thing. It was a painful step that had to be taken, and people moved on. The same will be true of Metro.

 

[legacy7955]

Where exactly do you get this 50% number from? I think you made it up. If you're basing it on the poll from here, this forum isn't exactly a representative population of the entire Windows user base. It's kind of ironic to complain about arrogance when you claim to speak for so many without any real evidence to back it up.

I doubt if even 10% of users will have any strong opinion about 8. (see, I can make up a number as well, difference is I state that this is my opinion) Most users are just that. Users. They use whatever it is they get, and they get their jobs done. Only a small percentage of people care much about the operating system at all.

Microsoft weathered the UAC thing. It was a painful step that had to be taken, and people moved on. The same will be true of Metro.

Thing is....I DON'T WANT M$ to fail, because Windows 8 like most of their other products have been pretty good with an exception or two, but it's hard not to dislike a company that is hell bent on not giving the customer the choice of how to use it.

 

[poppa bear]

Final fantasy thoughts of Win8 lovers.

This thread should be re-titled: Final fantasy thoughts of Win8 lovers!

In the end, it could be the most brilliant, clever, and down right awesome thing Microsoft has done. They have the potential to make a huge change to the way we interact with technology, and the metro design will be there to do that.

Yeah and they might invent cold fusion for nuclear power!

And aviators might control their planes with thoughts! See Firefox movie (Clint Eastwood)

And dentists might implant a micro chip into your tooth that downloads info from the ethernet directly into your brain!

And who knows, maybe we'll be able to type on a touch pad wiith our eyes closed by seeing the document with psychic vision!

And 30 or 40 pages of Tiles might be smaller than an alpha numeric text start menu ... and quicker to navigate!

And pigs might fly!

C'mon Coke Bottle, you've been watching so many sci-fi movies you're beginning to believe your own press! Granted you can do all that stuff with a bong or magic mushrooms!

In summary: Win8 is simply a piece of cyber space junk advertising SPAM from Microsoft aimed at the Touch Phone/Tablet market.

And in particular those yuppies who need a touch phone as an appendage to their ear to be on Twitter, FaceBook, YouTube ... ad nauseum!; and for the prestige-image of the would-be-if-they-could-be execs with Tablets, (& maybe laptops), with them wherever they go.

I actually know one woman who is a PhD in child psychology, and she finds her free tablet, provided by a government grant, to be invaluable when she's at seminars and dissertations. She uses it to switch off to boring speakers by listening to music and playing games. Now that's progress!

Heck, I thought they must have been life support medical devices they're so indispensable already!

 

[area 66]

Where exactly do you get this 50% number from? I think you made it up. If you're basing it on the poll from here, this forum isn't exactly a representative population of the entire Windows user base. .

You right it's not representative, it's a Windows 8 forum so you have to expect to find more peoples who like Windows 8, on many of others forums I'm member, It's about 100% of peoples who dislike Windows 8, on Hard OCP ( hard forum) 164,482 members, no one as say something positive about Windows 8 until now.

 

[Coke Robot]

Once you learn that you can pin Desktop items to the Start Screen, things become a LOT, LOT, LOT, better than before. Why some things aren't there by default is a valid question, as I'd like to be able to have those things there, as do I bet a lot of people.

That is not a solution! Switching between these two environment is unpleasant and slow, and if I want to look for a program I don't need a fullscreen research.

Now, let's talk about Metro apps. The first thing I want to discuss is your complaint over how the apps are full screen. I'm pretty sure I seen a poll one time (not sure what site) that asked about PC usage, specifically how many windows were open, on screen, at the same time. The resounding majority said they, most of the time, they only have one screen open, working with one program, in full screen.

But weren't Americans so fond of individual freedom? The fact that the majority behaves in a particular way does not mean that my experience has to be limited/uniformed.

My second point about Metro apps is the second word in that phrase, apps. People love apps. Nowadays, especially with the general public, the question about a consumer electronic is "does it have/how are the/how many: apps." There's an app craze. People don't even realize that it's short for application, they just know that app = cool/fun. That's where Windows 8 will attract, because it has an app store.

I don't care about names, people do? Fine, call them apps, the problems with them is that they are NOT customizable, and they work one at a time. If they care so much about words than they should not cal this Windows: this is not Windows at all, they want fullscreen and a single layer of programs(/apps/applications/executables, call them the way you want), where are the Windows?

Using desktop is not a solution, it leaves you out of innovation and leaves you with an unconsistent environment that doesn't benefit of the new features. Problem is, nowadays MS think innovation lies in doing what apple do and limit user experience, so that everyone behaves the way they want

Not from my experience, switching to the Start Screen is just as fast as opening the start menu.

 

[Coke Robot]

This thread should be re-titled: Final fantasy thoughts of Win8 lovers!

In the end, it could be the most brilliant, clever, and down right awesome thing Microsoft has done. They have the potential to make a huge change to the way we interact with technology, and the metro design will be there to do that.

Yeah and they might invent cold fusion for nuclear power!

And aviators might control their planes with thoughts! See Firefox movie (Clint Eastwood)

And dentists might implant a micro chip into your tooth that downloads info from the ethernet directly into your brain!

And who knows, maybe we'll be able to type on a touch pad wiith our eyes closed by seeing the document with psychic vision!

And 30 or 40 pages of Tiles might be smaller than an alpha numeric text start menu ... and quicker to navigate!

And pigs might fly!

C'mon Coke Bottle, you've been watching so many sci-fi movies you're beginning to believe your own press! Granted you can do all that stuff with a bong or magic mushrooms!

In summary: Win8 is simply a piece of cyber space junk advertising SPAM from Microsoft aimed at the Touch Phone/Tablet market.

And in particular those yuppies who need a touch phone as an appendage to their ear to be on Twitter, FaceBook, YouTube ... ad nauseum!; and for the prestige-image of the would-be-if-they-could-be execs with Tablets, (& maybe laptops), with them wherever they go.

I actually know one woman who is a PhD in child psychology, and she finds her free tablet, provided by a government grant, to be invaluable when she's at seminars and dissertations. She uses it to switch off to boring speakers by listening to music and playing games. Now that's progress!

Heck, I thought they must have been life support medical devices they're so indispensable already!

Uh hu! Keep talking!

 

[Coke Robot]

Legacy, you seem to speak as if you are speaking for everyone. You make claims that you can't back up. You state ridiculous conclusions.

Did Microsoft "lack confidence" in the Office Ribbon UI? Certainly not, yet they didn't make it optional. It was accepted, and people moved on.

Microsoft is not making it optional because this is the way Windows is going, period, end of story. They are extremely confident in it, and they aren't hedging their bets. That speaks strongly.

Now, I am as much of a doubter of the benefits of Metro as anyone, but I'm willing to give it a shot. If it doesn't work out, then it's not really a big deal. Windows 7 still exists. And chances are, it will be around until long after Windows 9 is out the door.

Microsoft is not changing their mind on this. It's way too late for that. Continuing to whine about it is just being.. well.. whiney. There is nothing you can do to change this outcome, and certainly whining on a forum is not going to help.

Frankly, I'm sick of hearing people complain about this. Windows 8 is what it is, and if you don't like it. Don't use it. I fail to get what you think you're going to accomplish by complaining to people who have nothing to do with the development of windows.

You certainly have a right to speak your mind, but i'd appreciate it if you didn't repeat yourself constantly. You've made your point, repeatedly, and nothing has or will change. What exactly do think is going to happen?

Actually I am speaking for at least 50% of MS customers and/ or potential customers. Those people do not like Metro UI for all environments. A 50% + dislike rate for a yet unreleased product like this is a very dangerous thing, even you'd have to agree with that.
Ah, the voice of arrogance, it usually kills businesses when they fail to listen to their best customers.

What's the matter...MS doesn't like looking at stubbornness in the mirror?

In the end the customer always wins.

The customer that refuses to accept new technologies, new design, and new form factors I guess will win the day...

 

[pparks1]

I've not been on the bandwagon or preaching the advantages of Windows 8. However, I do have a box setup at work and am forcing myself to use it in order to get a real world feel for it.

One thing that has me troubled thus far, is say I am running an application in the desktop (the Microsoft Lync client). And then I switch to Metro and launch the full screen IE browser. So, while I am using my full screen IE browser, somebody sends me an IM via Lync. Well, it popped up on my desktop, but nothing told me about it from my full screen IE in the Metro interface. There seems to some functionality lacking that tie the 2 systems together.

Not having a start button is just an exercise in frustration. Until I get the apps that I want launched, and pinned to the taskbar in the desktop it's like being stuck on a machine that isn't mine. I honestly don't want to switch over to Metro, start typing, find my app, launch it and then come back to the desktop. I'd rather just stay on the desktop. Granted, I can right click in the absolute lower left and bring up the Power User Menu, launch run, and find what I want, launch it and then pin in...but that's quite a few hoops to jump through. It just seemed quicker and easier having a start/menu bar to pick from.

 

[poppa bear]

Uh hu! Keep talking!

There's really nothing to talk about because the various claims you make as to the efficacy of Metro, etc, are vacuous and simply unbelievable.

The customer that refuses to accept new technologies, new design, and new form factors I guess will win the day ...

Absolutely, when the new technology is used in an environment it was not designed for, meaning desktop as opposed to Tablet/Touch Phone.

And it’s not actually new technology, just catch up with Apple, Android, Google, etc.

I've been doing tablet/tiles GUI and apps on my $600 waste of money Sony Ericsson Neo Android mobile phone for over 12 months ... AND HATING IT! It's half computer, half phone and not really good at either function; which is what you get when you create a hybrid!

Microsoft Robot, there's no need to be bedazzled and starry eyed, just because it's Microsoft finally doing it! And doing it at the expense of their loyal desktop followers, when they could so easily accomodate both camps ... but point blank refuse!

Microsoft's arrogance alone in this respect will cost them many sales ... even from those who would otherwise be prepared to do the work arounds to use W8 as a desktop OS ... but won't because of M$'s arrogance.

Having spent a great deal of my life time in marketing, the one rule no company can survive breaking, no matter how big they are, is to ignore the wants of their clientelle. Way back in the mid nineteen sixties, the leading soap company in the USA decided to economize by cutting their advertising campaign ... and dropped from top spot into oblivion in quick time.

Regretably, the downside of advertising is that it's often all smoke and mirrors, which makes it possible to sell an inferior product to some poor unsuspecting souls. On this premise, M$ will make some sales with W8. But, as we all know, you can fool some of the people some of the time ... etc.

 

[legacy7955]

Uh hu! Keep talking!

There's really nothing to talk about because the various claims you make as to the efficacy of Metro, etc, are vacuous and simply unbelievable.

I've been one of the most strident givers of my opinion regarding Metro....BUT I don't hate Metro ,because it makes great sense on phones and tablets, it just is not a rational and practical choice on any desktop for anyone engaged in productivity.

I notice that Cokebot glosses right over my distinctions regarding Metro and new technology, I am as interested in new tech as anyone BUT if it doesn't make things better, or more efficient,
the "newness" isn't enough to win me over. The old saying is still true just because it is new doesn't make it "better".

 

[mdmd]

I think some contributors here are over thinking this too much.
Chill... Windows 8 can be an extremely effective, efficient and productive Operating System if you learn how to use it !
I think some folks want it to be perfect.
It will never be perfect.
Apple is not perfect, 7 is not perfect, Linux is not perfect.

System Administrators in business will still have access to control the OS with gpedit.msc
...making the OS for productivity only!

(Microsoft Management Console)
(Group Policy Editor)
try it in 8 > run gpedit.msc

Administrators can block users from access to the Store
and other blocks

 

[poppa bear]

Chill ... Windows 8 can be an extremely effective, efficient and productive Operating System if you learn how to use it!

Why should we have to 'learn how to use it', when we've already got the perfect set-up in Win7? Just give us Win7 with the improvements in the OS as a free update, without the Metro Tablet/Touch-phone promotion!

 

[mdmd]

you have to learn how to use it because it is new

8 is the metro explorer shell.
The OS model is the metro.
Windows Server 2012 uses the metro.

 

[Coke Robot]

Uh hu! Keep talking!

There's really nothing to talk about because the various claims you make as to the efficacy of Metro, etc, are vacuous and simply unbelievable.
QUOTE]
Oh, I thought you had more to say because your response to mine had nothing to do with anything. I was just saying that one UI to rule them all can be a huge success for Microsoft, but apparently internet devices will be in our teeth....

 

[Coke Robot]

Uh hu! Keep talking!

There's really nothing to talk about because the various claims you make as to the efficacy of Metro, etc, are vacuous and simply unbelievable.

The customer that refuses to accept new technologies, new design, and new form factors I guess will win the day ...

Absolutely, when the new technology is used in an environment it was not designed for, meaning desktop as opposed to Tablet/Touch Phone.

And it’s not actually new technology, just catch up with Apple, Android, Google, etc.

I've been doing tablet/tiles GUI and apps on my $600 waste of money Sony Ericsson Neo Android mobile phone for over 12 months ... AND HATING IT! It's half computer, half phone and not really good at either function; which is what you get when you create a hybrid!

Microsoft Robot, there's no need to be bedazzled and starry eyed, just because it's Microsoft finally doing it! And doing it at the expense of their loyal desktop followers, when they could so easily accomodate both camps ... but point blank refuse!

Microsoft's arrogance alone in this respect will cost them many sales ... even from those who would otherwise be prepared to do the work arounds to use W8 as a desktop OS ... but won't because of M$'s arrogance.

Having spent a great deal of my life time in marketing, the one rule no company can survive breaking, no matter how big they are, is to ignore the wants of their clientelle. Way back in the mid nineteen sixties, the leading soap company in the USA decided to economize by cutting their advertising campaign ... and dropped from top spot into oblivion in quick time.

Regretably, the downside of advertising is that it's often all smoke and mirrors, which makes it possible to sell an inferior product to some poor unsuspecting souls. On this premise, M$ will make some sales with W8. But, as we all know, you can fool some of the people some of the time ... etc.

Well, if you're using android, then you're one of many that are obviously dissatisfied with the product, but that's android. All it is just a minicomputer with a phone built on it, and yes, it doesn't do well at either. That's a hardware hybrid that doesn't work because it's a terrible form factor to do that with.

I'm not bedazzled at metro design, though it is cool to me. I'm more into the fact that Microsoft is pushing forward the "one UI to rule them all." I think it's fascinating to have a similar, though somewhat different user experience tailored to that device on different devices that all work together that look similar to each other. I don't see why that's all horrid. I guess I would see it as horrid if I refused to use it.....yadayadyadaya......

See, what I don't understand is why you feel compelled to troll about Windows 8 and how it's inferior to use on a non-touch system. I find that interesting. Instead of realizing the fact that Windows 7 is still there and will be there until 2022 (the best desktop OS I bet in your eyes), you seem to want to blast down 8 in vain. Some people are open to new things, some obviously aren't. Sure, it takes like, about two minutes to make Windows 8 a little more Desktop friendly, but oh well. That's just what you need to do when a Release Preview still wants to show off improvements to some metro styled apps. After that, it's smooth sailing.

 

[Coke Robot]

I've not been on the bandwagon or preaching the advantages of Windows 8. However, I do have a box setup at work and am forcing myself to use it in order to get a real world feel for it.

One thing that has me troubled thus far, is say I am running an application in the desktop (the Microsoft Lync client). And then I switch to Metro and launch the full screen IE browser. So, while I am using my full screen IE browser, somebody sends me an IM via Lync. Well, it popped up on my desktop, but nothing told me about it from my full screen IE in the Metro interface. There seems to some functionality lacking that tie the 2 systems together.

Not having a start button is just an exercise in frustration. Until I get the apps that I want launched, and pinned to the taskbar in the desktop it's like being stuck on a machine that isn't mine. I honestly don't want to switch over to Metro, start typing, find my app, launch it and then come back to the desktop. I'd rather just stay on the desktop. Granted, I can right click in the absolute lower left and bring up the Power User Menu, launch run, and find what I want, launch it and then pin in...but that's quite a few hoops to jump through. It just seemed quicker and easier having a start/menu bar to pick from.

If it would make it easier, on the Start Screen, you right click and click on All apps, like how you would go to All Programs on the start menu. From there, you can right click on something, and pin it to the Taskbar.