I believe Win 8 is going to be another Windows Vista

[Mystere]

How many times do I have to repeat myself?

DELL DOES NOT PAY MICROSOFT FOR A COPY OF WINDOWS UNTIL THEY SELL IT TO A CUSTOMER. It's the same for any other major OEM.

Yes, small mom and pop shops may buy individual licenses, and those would count as sold, but those stores are not going to buy a large quantity of them, they'll have whatever they need on hand because they don't have a lot of money for inventory.

Please stop with the absolutes. You seem to love to make these arguments that are all or nothing. Touch sucks because sometimes you need a keyboard, Metro sucks because sometimes you need more than one window, etc.. those are called strawman arguments. You deliberately setup a false scenario by specifying an extreme position and then proceed to discredit it.

I'm not saying there are 0 possible unsold copies in that calculation, but it's unlikely that there is a large percentage because, as I said, OEM's do not pay Microsoft until they have themselves sold a computer with it.

 

[aramil]

OEM's do not pay Microsoft until they have themselves sold a computer with it.

As I work with OEM I can back this up. OS is billed on a customer activation basis not on how many machines you have built. OEMs only pay for what is used by the consumer after point of sale.

 

[Gavin]

So are you saying that 39 million copies are definately being used? At the end of the day, you are the one wanting to argue all the time.Everytime anyone has an opinion or negative about win 8, you say it is wrong, then present your own opinion and say it is fact.You have no idea how many people actually own a copy, but you are saying that because MS has sold 40 million, then 40 million are in use.
You were the one asking what i was doing on this forum by simply stating my opinion that people would not buy it because they read negative reviews whether they are from magazines or Amazon.It doesn`t matter how they are sold, there will not all be sold.Not once have i ever stated i don`t want windows 8 then you twist what i wrote to cause an argument. If people have a differing opinion to you, then you get all upset because it isnt your view.
So please stop making arguments with people who are presenting opinions then questioning why they are on the board.I also see it isnt the first time you have argued with people today, so you must be in an argumentative mood today

 

[Ray8]

I'm not sure that the number of sales is really indicative of the number actually using Windows 8. For example, I purchase a licence for my tablet and PC, but removed Windows 8 from my tablet and retain it on my PC in case it comes out with future improvement that suit my needs, which it doesn't at the moment.

Or you could compare it to Linux downloads. Millions of Linux distributions are downloaded, but how many are actually being fully used and not just downloaded for interest sake? I've downloaded Ubuntu many times and eventually deleted it from my system and recently downloaded Mint and still experimenting with ti, but not using it in anger.

As they say, there are lies, damn lies and statistics.

 

[Mystere]

I'm not sure that the number of sales is really indicative of the number actually using Windows 8.

Of course it doesn't, but that wasn't Gavin's argument so it's a moot point. He claimed that that Nobody would buy Windows 8, and when I countered that there were already more than 40 million copies sold, he first denied that this number had been sold (despite having no evidence to support it), essentially insinuated that Microsoft was lying about the numbers, then tried to claim that those numbers represented millions of computers sitting in warehouses, unsold.

Whether or not those licenses are in use (and I think a large percentage of them are, but that doesn't really matter and there is no data to support it one way or the other), they have been sold.

 

[Ray8]

Here's an interesting take:

The latest figure does not mean that 40 million users have adopted Windows 8. Many of the sales are to PC manufacturers, who in turn sell a large number of machines to companies, very few of which are using Windows 8 yet.

According to tech research firm StatCounter, about 1 percent of the world's 1.5 billion or so personal computers - making a total of around 15 million - are actually running Windows 8.

Microsoft sold 40m Windows 8 licenses in month - Software - Technology - News - iTnews.com.au

 

[mark233]

This is all just silly.

 

[Gavin]

I'm not sure that the number of sales is really indicative of the number actually using Windows 8.

Of course it doesn't, but that wasn't Gavin's argument so it's a moot point. He claimed that that Nobody would buy Windows 8, and when I countered that there were already more than 40 million copies sold, he first denied that this number had been sold (despite having no evidence to support it), essentially insinuated that Microsoft was lying about the numbers, then tried to claim that those numbers represented millions of computers sitting in warehouses, unsold.

Whether or not those licenses are in use (and I think a large percentage of them are, but that doesn't really matter and there is no data to support it one way or the other), they have been sold.

No it was your argument.You show me where i wrote nobody would buy it? You have read an opinion again and decided to make it mean something else.Saying people won`t buy it cause of bad reviews, is not the same as saying nobody will buy it.Why make things up as to what i have written? Maybe they have sold 40 million.or even 100 million, the fact is, if it hadnt been for negative reviews, and the fact some people dont care about a new version, they could have sold 20 million more, so i think my opinion for what it is worth valid.That is what i had written.
I suggest you read my statement again
Also can you show me where i said Microsoft were lying.I never denied it, i just wanted to know where you got the facts from and you provided it, so fair play to you. Again you make things up to try to support your argument.Maybe there aren`t loads of computers in warehouses but i would imagine there are a fair few copies in warehouses.

 

[Mystere]

You show me where i wrote nobody would buy it?

Really? .... Really? You do know we can just scroll back a few pages and see what you wrote, right?

I am simply saying why people won`t buy it

Oh, and

people won`t see the point of spending £40 to upgrade.

You're seriously going to claim you didn't say these things?

 

[Coke Robot]

You know, I have think, why not just cut out the physical phone part altogether? I was considering signing up for an SMS service for Outlook, and using Skype for calling. On a tablet, use a SIM card for data, do the same.

Often the physical phone is a very valid tool. You hardly want to carry around a tablet or similar when you go shopping, but having a phone with you is handy. I smart phone is like a Swiss Army Knife, it can do a lot of handy things to get you out of a bind, buit it's not a substitute for a tool kit. But you're not likely to be carrying around a tool kit all the time.

That's why a tablet needs to be invented that has a phone receiver part of it, actually ASUS has something like that called Padfone. A phone with a tablet.

But if I use a Windows Phone, and Windows 8, I have little need to do something like that as the UIs are similar, but different; so there wouldn't be a need to control anything.

 

[Gavin]

You show me where i wrote nobody would buy it?

Really? .... Really? You do know we can just scroll back a few pages and see what you wrote, right?

I am simply saying why people won`t buy it

Oh, and

people won`t see the point of spending £40 to upgrade.

You're seriously going to claim you didn't say these things?

So you are showing me 3 quotes where it says people won`t buy it, and you interpret that as Nobody will buy it? Why don`t you read what i have written and stop adding words that i never used.Even your three quotes don`t support where i said nobody will; buy it
So again, can you show me where i said NOBODY will buy it? Not people won`t buy it, but NOBODY.They are 2 different things.Also show me where i called MS liars. I just don`t know why you are so argumentative and attributing things i have supposedly said to support your arguments.

 

[mcnulty]

It doesn't *require* any such thing. If you want to use touch, then you need a touch device (which, by the way does not have to be a monitor, there are touch pads available that enable the same functionality for a fraction of the price of a touch screen). If you don't want to use touch, then you don't have to. Please, people.. stop making specious arguments that aren't based in reality. Nobody is forcing you to use touch, or to buy any new hardware (other than if your CPU isn't capable of running it).

The only problem is that if you don't have touch-enabled hardware or want to use touch, you're stuck with a UI designed for touch, which is absolutely brilliant. Don't try to feed me the official Microsoft line that "it works great for both touch and mouse" because that's pure bullshit, such thing does not exist because the interaction modes are radically different. The design of the UI has to take into account screen sizes as well, and frankly, Windows 8 start screen on my 23" monitor looks laughable.

 

[Mike Lonewolf]

Do you guys have the SLIGHTEST clue on how a OEM works? FIRST OFF there is no media SOLD to any OEM, and secondly they buy groups of licenses. WHICH are paid for on delivery. And with the Vista debacle the OEMs were stuck with all the licenses that didn't sell. Whereas you guys MIGHT work for an OEM but going by your lack of knowledge on the business end, it would be in production.

 

[znod]

Actually, I liked, and never had significant problems, with Vista. I like Vista better than Win8, but that's because I find Cham and Metro to be tedious, poorly arranged, and inefficient.

 

[Chrono]

The only problem is that if you don't have touch-enabled hardware or want to use touch, you're stuck with a UI designed for touch, which is absolutely brilliant. Don't try to feed me the official Microsoft line that "it works great for both touch and mouse" because that's pure bullshit, such thing does not exist because the interaction modes are radically different. The design of the UI has to take into account screen sizes as well, and frankly, Windows 8 start screen on my 23" monitor looks laughable.

Then your monitor must suck. Mine is a 21.5" and it looks just fine. And it does work well with a mouse and keyboard. So... there goes your argument?

 

[Mike Lonewolf]

Chrono, you misread his post. He is saying that he doesn't have a touch type monitor, and feels that Windows 8 would be better if he had one. The other part of his message is just whiney sour grapes.

 

[mcnulty]

The only problem is that if you don't have touch-enabled hardware or want to use touch, you're stuck with a UI designed for touch, which is absolutely brilliant. Don't try to feed me the official Microsoft line that "it works great for both touch and mouse" because that's pure bullshit, such thing does not exist because the interaction modes are radically different. The design of the UI has to take into account screen sizes as well, and frankly, Windows 8 start screen on my 23" monitor looks laughable.

Then your monitor must suck. Mine is a 21.5" and it looks just fine. And it does work well with a mouse and keyboard. So... there goes your argument?

You and I have different concepts of what "fine" and "well" mean. That's ok because it doesn't matter how much you or other Microsoft apologists like it, it's still meant and designed for touch. That's a fact you can't change, even if you keep dismissing it.

But hey, if you guys enjoy your monitor looking like a ****ing 10-inch tablet just because Apple sells about every iPad they can build, be my guest.

 

[Chrono]

Chrono, you misread his post. He is saying that he doesn't have a touch type monitor, and feels that Windows 8 would be better if he had one. The other part of his message is just whiney sour grapes.

Well, if he had worded it like that, then I would have agreed.

You and I have different concepts of what "fine" and "well" mean. That's ok because it doesn't matter how much you or other Microsoft apologists like it, it's still meant and designed for touch. That's a fact you can't change, even if you keep dismissing it.

But hey, if you guys enjoy your monitor looking like a ****ing 10-inch tablet just because Apple sells about every iPads they can build, be my guest.

Or you just have an old mouse. It seriously can't be that difficult for you unless you need to take two or three full swipes to get from one side of your monitor to the other. Yes, the interface is designed to be much more touch friendly. So? I can get around just fine and dandy with my 1800DPI Deathadder. So again, maybe you should check to see what DPI your mouse has. Clicking a tile is no different than clicking an icon. In fact, it's easier. The tile is much larger. Moving the mouse on the Metro screen is just as effective as on the desktop. So again, I don't see what, "designed for tablets" has to do with it if the mouse is effective, which it is.

EDIT: Or go into mouse settings and jack up the pointer speed. That may help.

 

[Mystere]

You and I have different concepts of what "fine" and "well" mean. That's ok because it doesn't matter how much you or other Microsoft apologists like it, it's still meant and designed for touch. That's a fact you can't change, even if you keep dismissing it.

That's a ridiculous comment. It's designed to work well with A Keyboard, Mouse, *AND* Touch. Each has their own strengths, and can do things the others can't.

Your argument is just as ridiculous as saying Windows 7 is designed to be used only with a mouse, so using a keyboard sucks.

Not only is your comment logically flawed, it doesn't even begin to make any sense. What makes touch so special that it somehow can't work effectively with a mouse? I keep hearing this BS over and over again, and nobody can explain exactly how using a keyboard or mouse with it is so terrible.

Like you, people complain about the size of the fonts, or that you can't have more than one window open in Metro, and while those things may be true, they have nothing whatsoever to do with the usability with a keyboard and mouse.

Windows 8 is *EXACTLY* as usable with a keyboard and mouse and Windows 7 was. Exactly. I can't think of a single keyboard shortcut that doesn't work, nor can I think of a single way you would use a keyboard and mouse that Windows 8 somehow makes non-functional. Just because they added touch support as well (gestures, etc..) doesn't change the keyboard and mouse functionality, which is identical to what it was.

 

[geeve420]

Can't you just scroll the wheel on your mouse to make the Metro/Modern screen go left and right? Or I am missing something here? That's how I do it at home with a cheap @ss Dell mouse.....

Geeve

(unless you all are talking about something else with the mouse)