Create a system image

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mb1280

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I'm using the original Win 8 . . . I just did this:
Control Panel / Win 7 File Recovery / Create a system image

40.33 GB (estimate) . . . 30.2 GB actual . . . 18 files, 5 folders . . . took 26 minutes

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Questions:

1.) Will it get a true copy of the Registry? It seems like I should have to boot using the System Repair Disc, and "Create a system image" through that, because then the Registry would not be in use.

2.) Some other thread said to use Macrium Reflect Free - because of some problem using Win 8's program to do it, where the image will not restore . . . (but here too, Macrium Reflect is run off of the hard drive, you don't boot to it - wouldn't the Registry be in use for Macrium also, and not copy because it's locked?)

3.) I'm making the image of the OS from a 160 GB drive to another 160 GB drive. I thought the program would be formatting the whole drive before it made the image, but the whole process only took 26 minutes, so I'm pretty sure it didn't do that . . . Do I need to delete what's on there, before I do another image - I think I should be able to do this . . . Will it make the next one with a different file name automatically? . . . I'm wondering about this for both the Win 8 program, and Macrium Reflect.

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I made a System Repair Disc through this:
Control Panel / Recovery / Create a Recovery Drive

Is that the same thing as if I went through:
Control Panel / Win 7 File Recovery / Create a system repair disc

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I keep all my files in one folder. I found this program is good to Mirror them to an external drive. I keep two extra copies:

SyncBackFree
2BrightSparks | Download SyncBackFree
 
In SyncBackFree, I figured out that they apply a filter, so it doesn't backup copy thumbs.db and desktop.ini (among other needless things) . . . that's why there was a difference in the number of files between the source and destination (262 fewer) . . . I deleted the contents of the filter, because then I can easily verify that it copied over everything.
 
I haven't used the W8 built in imaging program. I do use Macrium. Macrium uses the Shadow Copy Service to copy the files, such as registry and other system files, even though they are in use.

Saving an image to an identical drive with a sector by sector copy, which seems to be what you are expecting, is done by some programs. But Macrium uses compression and indexing, rather than sector by sector copy. If you want to try sector by sector you can find some imaging and/or cloning programs that use that technique on thefreecountry.com: Free Programmers' Resources, Free Webmasters' Resources, Free Security Resources
 
I used system image restore the other day and it saved my bacon. I was using EASus Backup/Restore which made the backup successfully on schedule but failed at the restore process. Im now using 8.1 Update 1 which doesnt have the Windows 7 recovery tools so you cant schedule an image its a manual process. EASus backup has never let me down before and has a Linux recovery tool inserted into the the windows 8.1 boot menu as does image recovery. I had no problems with the MS image recovery and the registry so I would recommend the MS tool, just a shame it cant be sheduled. Will also have to try Macrium.
 
I believe (but can not guarantee on all systems) that when you make a System Image via the File History Screen (lower left) the System Image will overwrite any existing System Image Backup. I also use Macrium for backup imaging but a couple of months ago I created a System Image to an external HDD via the File History screen just to try it out and was pleased that it was successful but when I did another it did in fact overwrite the first one so that is the way it worked on my system. So another downside would be that you cannot keep multiple backup images. I never had Windows 7 so I don't have much experience with this utility but I would imagine others here must know it well.
 
You can keep multiple backups on multiple partitions, I made a later system Image to an external HDD using the Native System Image. Just tried Macrium and the Rescue USB stick it created (PE) wouldnt boot!
 
Just tried a different USB stick and it boots. F11 for boot menu here. Testing Macrium now
 
I haven't clicked around to look into this yet, but . . .

I previously made a "system repair disc" - when you boot to it, I imagine that's how it's also known as (at that point, at bootup) a "recovery drive."

. . . When I boot to the "recovery drive," is there anything in there where I can select to make the "system image?" . . . The reason I ask is that the Registry would be totally free . . . This is how I thought it worked to make a system image, before I even looked in to how to do this.

The part where I say that I heard that the Registry won't copy - I think it was in an example where they were explaining why you can't just copy and paste your whole C: drive to an external HDD, Windows and all, and expect it to be a usable, restorative image - it's because the Registry is locked.
 
Interesting, thanks . . . the Win 8 / Win 7 "Create a System Image" must use the Volume Shadow Copy service . . . I see it in Services, set to Manual . . . So the recovery drive probably doesn't even provide the option to make an Image. Any idea why someone would want to use Macrium or Acronis? All I can think of is that it has a feature where you can schedule it to run. I'm going to take my two 160GB drives, on which I currently have an recent Image, and repartition them in half . . . they're like 149 GB actual size, so I can get two 75 GB drives on each . . . Then I can have the current Image, and a previous Image, two copies of each (about 30.2 GB each). It can't hurt to have one copy back. If I have to do a restore, hopefully it will tell me the date of each image, so I can pick the most recent.
 
From what I understand W7 had more of a user interface for system backup but no longer in 8++ just the basic create and restore functionality. 3rd party programs offer a whole range of functionality from scheduling to incremental backups and especially the ability to image a new HDD after a dead HDD and I don't think you can do that with the built-in function. Also, with the 3rd party programs you can save as many images as you want and you can mount the image and see it just like a file and just recover any part of the image. The built in imaging function works but it is very basic. Some of the good 3rd party programs offer a free version that has all the functionality most users need. I don't think there is an apples to apples comparison.

If not already you should also be aware of the Create Custom Refresh Image capabilities using the built-in Recimg utility. This can be a very handy feature for a non-destructive reloading of the OS.

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorial...-create-use-custom-recovery-image.html?filter
 
With Macrium one should add the boot menu option:

screenshot_60.jpg
 
I see that the Standard version of Macrium allows for (two features I might like):
. . . Differential and Incremental backups . . . and . . . File and Folder backup
Macrium Reflect FREE Edition - Information and download

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The benefits of differential and incremental backup:
The benefits of differential and incremental backup (Differential, Incremental)

It looks like if I try doing an incremental backup to save time, it's an added complication that can fail. Why don't they have a "Mirror" option like SyncBackFree (below), which makes it a no-brainer?

Current thinkng: I'll just use the Win 8 image program, and let the computer sit for 26 minutes per image x 2 copies, once every 6 months, or after a big update

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SynBackFree lets you do File and Folder backup
2BrightSparks | Download SyncBackFree

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

I had to figure this out about what SyncBack was doing:

Profiles:
Red 1 - R drive . . . Mirror . . . D:\1 . . . R:\1
Red 2 - S drive . . . Mirror . . . D:\1 . . . S:\1

Profile Setup - Simple / Decisions - Files /
. . . What to do if a files' contents are identical, but the properties, or the case, of the filenames are different:
. . . [dot] Rename file on Destination and copy properties to Destination . . . the default is to "Do nothing, skip the file"
. . . A mirror of my data is great. Why wouldn't renaming it be the default?

I did a backup, and compared the files and folder of the source to the destination. There are 262 fewer files. Why?

Profile Setup - Expert / Copy/Delete / [check] Verify that files are copied correctly . . . no change

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Profile Setup / Change Filter / Files/folders NOT to copy
. . . see screenshot, I can see that the 262 files it cleaned out (10.77 MB), were mostly: . . . *\desktop.ini . . . and . . . *\thumbs.db

19,519 Total . . . 17,017 Files . . . 2,502 Folders
19,257 Total . . . 16,755 Files . . . 2,502 Folders . . . difference = 262 Files

Current thinking: Delete everything in the filter, in the right-hand pane, "Files/folders NOT to copy"
. . . because then it's easy, and possible, for me to verify that everything was actually copied.

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If you're making two backup system images, is there any reason to do a Restart in between them? I'm thinking about how you burn DVDs, I found that does something so you get a good second copy . . . I'm thinking it's probably not necessary, because this is hard drives vs. DVDs, or CD-ROMs . . . on the other hand, it seems like it couldn't hurt . . . Is there any concrete, scientific reason for doing a Restart? Maybe that clears something out.
 
I asked a friend of mine about making the System Image. He says that you always want to test it after you make it, by booting to the external drive . . . I don't think the Win 8 image is bootable though, it's compressed, right? Is there any way that you can verify that the copy will work?

As I understand it, the other way to make a System Image, is to make a clone, which is un-compressed . . . is that what Macrium does (Free), EaseUS Todo (Free), or Acronis ($75)? If so, this would be bootable.

If you make this un-compressed backup, should you put it on what you will consider to be your next C drive? . . . Or when you boot to the Recovery Drive, can you make a clone of the external to a new drive? . . . I'm thinking about issues such as if I put my clone on IDE drive (slower than SATA), or an older drive (vs. if I got a new one).
 
I don't believe the System Image created with the built-in W8.1 utility is compressed, at least not in it's default state. I know that when I make a Backup System Image using the built-in utility it is not compressed, now that is not to say it couldn't be adjusted to do so but I have not seen the ability to adjust parameters.

With Macrium, which is what I use, the default for System Image creation uses Medium Compression and is user selectable and but it can be set for no compression.

With Macrium an image can be verified but I know of no way you can boot to a System Image however, you can boot to the recovery environment to confirm the image and location is recognized.

I know of no purpose to boot the system before making additional System images
 
. . . I don't believe the System Image created with the built-in Windows 8.1 utility is compressed, at least not in it's default state.

I think it is. Please check out the attached screenshot. You can't see "Program Files," for example.

. . . I know that when I make a Backup System Image using the built-in utility it is not compressed, now that is not to say it couldn't be adjusted to do so but I have not seen the ability to adjust parameters.

May I ask, how do you know it's not compressed? If you change the BIOS to boot to USB, and have that attached, does it boot up?

. . . With Macrium, which is what I use, the default for System Image creation uses Medium Compression and is user selectable and but it can be set for no compression.

I think I'll check it out, thanks.

. . . With Macrium an image can be verified but I know of no way you can boot to a System Image

If you set it to boot to USB in the BIOS, or on bootup, hit one of the F keys, and you can change the boot drive

. . . however, you can boot to the recovery environment to confirm the image and location is recognized.

Maybe this confirmation is good enough

. . . I know of no purpose to boot the system before making additional System images

Yes, that's what I think too, it looks like it, but I don't think it hurts.

Have you heard of any cases when a Restore from the Win 8 image failed?
 

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I don't "know" that the built-in utility does not compress the data. I am just going by the overall size of the OS and all my files which is about 60 GB and when I create a system image with the built-in utility that's about what it writes to my external drive. When using Macrium, the calculated size of the files is again, about 60 GB+/- and using the default Medium Compression the transferred file size is about 14 GB. If the built-in utility compresses at all it can't be much.

I can't say I know anyone that uses the built-in imaging utility as their primary back-up method with Windows 8++. I suspect it was popular with W7 as it had a better user interface or at least that is what I understand but never having used W7 I don't really know so I also don't know what a failure rate might be.

I made another system image with the built-in utility this evening and I can see why I would not want to use it as my primary back-up method. It seems very cumbersome when compared to Macrium and other third party programs. I want to be able to manage my system backups and be able to recover certain files if needed and you can't do that with the built-in utility at least not that I am aware of. I will continue to make an occasional image with the tool just to have it but it will never be my primary system imaging tool.
 
. . . I can't say I know anyone that uses the built-in imaging utility as their primary back-up method with Windows 8++.

I don't know why, other than that I don't think it's testable to see that it works, or bootable

. . . I made another system image with the built-in utility this evening and I can see why I would not want to use it as my primary back-up method. It seems very cumbersome when compared to Macrium and other third party programs.

I'll have to try Macrium. Not sure what you mean by cumbersome, you just click to make the image, and it does it.

. . . I want to be able to manage my system backups and be able to recover certain files if needed and you can't do that with the built-in utility at least not that I am aware of.

Ok, yes, I can see that. I think what I'm primarily concerned about is that it's bootable.

Is Macrium the best free version? I see these others:

Free Hard Disk Backup and Restore, Hard Disk Image and Cloning Utilities (thefreecountry.com)
 
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