Windows 8 will be 'largely irrelevant' to traditional PC users: IDC

Summary: IDC’s top 10 system software predictions for 2012 are out. One of them casts doubt on Microsoft’s potential market for Windows 8 among traditional PC users.

It’s that time of year: The time when prognosticators get out their crystal balls and make predictions.

The researchers at IDC have just released to their clients their “Worldwide System Infrastructure Software 2012 Top 10 Predictions.” (Al Gillen Program VP, System Software, tweeted the list of ten on December 2.)

One of those predictions caught my eye: “Windows 8 Will Launch with Split Success.”

Windows 8 will be 'largely irrelevant' to traditional PC users: IDC | ZDNet

 

[Dave76]

Agree there will be some major changes, would like to see more of the OS before saying it's good or not.

Like what I've seen so far, even if it is a very limited look into what is coming out.

Seems like some people are deciding if it's any good by the WDP, way too early of a build to be making decisions yet. Lots of time before we can see which direction they will go.

 

[ADRz]

Dave76 said

Did I mention WDP is a pre-Beta, for app developers?
Give it a look when the beta or RC are released, I would bet it will be different then what you have seen so far.[end-quote]

Well yes Dave, we are ALL aware that this is a stable alpha version of the Windows Operating System. BUT non-withstanding Microsoft is viewing ALL WDP boards, so that they can get an understanding of what users of the O/S worldwide are liking and disliking about Windows8 before it goes into Beta. I believe also when the beta is released that we are in for some major interface changes with Windows 8.

No, there are not going to be major interface changes. We know a lot from very late leaked builds of Win8. If, somehow, you are expecting a major change, you would be mistaken. There may be some kind of a "taskbar" in the Start Screen, but this is a much as you would get.

 

[Mike Lonewolf]

Dave76 said

Did I mention WDP is a pre-Beta, for app developers?
Give it a look when the beta or RC are released, I would bet it will be different then what you have seen so far.[end-quote]

Well yes Dave, we are ALL aware that this is a stable alpha version of the Windows Operating System. BUT non-withstanding Microsoft is viewing ALL WDP boards, so that they can get an understanding of what users of the O/S worldwide are liking and disliking about Windows8 before it goes into Beta. I believe also when the beta is released that we are in for some major interface changes with Windows 8.

No, there are not going to be major interface changes. We know a lot from very late leaked builds of Win8. If, somehow, you are expecting a major change, you would be mistaken. There may be some kind of a "taskbar" in the Start Screen, but this is a much as you would get.

May I ask you ADRz as to where you acquired that information from? I am aware that the Metro UI will remain, BUT also from what I have heard (rumor at this point) that there will be major changes as to usability of said Metro UI.

 

[ADRz]

Dave76 said

No, there are not going to be major interface changes. We know a lot from very late leaked builds of Win8. If, somehow, you are expecting a major change, you would be mistaken. There may be some kind of a "taskbar" in the Start Screen, but this is a much as you would get.

May I ask you ADRz as to where you acquired that information from? I am aware that the Metro UI will remain, BUT also from what I have heard (rumor at this point) that there will be major changes as to usability of said Metro UI.

There are many leaked screens of the beta (at least the pre-beta builds). The "usability of the Metro" you are referring to is a taskbar at the bottom of the Metro Start Screen. Not that major a change but the most obvious one. Metro stays as a non-optional UI. The rest is very close to what you already know. In any case, you should not have anticipated drastic differences within a few months. I think that the beta is essentially ready today and what you would get would be "feature-complete". From the beta onwards, there would be no more changes except those that fix bugs.

 

[Coke Robot]

May I ask you ADRz as to where you acquired that information from? I am aware that the Metro UI will remain, BUT also from what I have heard (rumor at this point) that there will be major changes as to usability of said Metro UI.

There are many leaked screens of the beta (at least the pre-beta builds). The "usability of the Metro" you are referring to is a taskbar at the bottom of the Metro Start Screen. Not that major a change but the most obvious one. Metro stays as a non-optional UI. The rest is very close to what you already know. In any case, you should not have anticipated drastic differences within a few months. I think that the beta is essentially ready today and what you would get would be "feature-complete". From the beta onwards, there would be no more changes except those that fix bugs.

So you're basically saying Windows 8 will in fact be Windows 7 with a metro interface? Wow, I need to go tell everyone....

 

[ADRz]

There are many leaked screens of the beta (at least the pre-beta builds). The "usability of the Metro" you are referring to is a taskbar at the bottom of the Metro Start Screen. Not that major a change but the most obvious one. Metro stays as a non-optional UI. The rest is very close to what you already know. In any case, you should not have anticipated drastic differences within a few months. I think that the beta is essentially ready today and what you would get would be "feature-complete". From the beta onwards, there would be no more changes except those that fix bugs.

So you're basically saying Windows 8 will in fact be Windows 7 with a metro interface? Wow, I need to go tell everyone....

Do you have a better story???

 

[Coke Robot]

So you're basically saying Windows 8 will in fact be Windows 7 with a metro interface? Wow, I need to go tell everyone....

Do you have a better story???

Yeah, I do. It's called the first major step in the development of a new Windows operating system. It has new features a build of this kind wouldn't normally have, but 8 is different.

I should had told people Windows 7 was going to be exactly like vista, but it just works...

 

[The Howling Wolves]

Are you two agreeing to disagree?

Let's all step back, take a big deep breath and WAIT till the Beta comes out.
Opinions and speculations come from the same body part and we all have one.
THW

 

[Vertex]

Yeah, I do. It's called the first major step in the development of a new Windows operating system. It has new features a build of this kind wouldn't normally have, but 8 is different.

That may not be exactly be the most specific and accurate sentiment if we are talking about Desktops but even if you are a tablet user, be advised with the Metro on a Desktop, its a different story, my friend. Again, I not against the Metro, I just want it to have a separate button than the Start Menu. And I guess many would agree that there should be a power button on the Metro because when its there, you have to log off first before you can turn off the PC.

I should had told people Windows 7 was going to be exactly like vista, but it just works...

That is an understatement against Windows 7 saying its "exactly" going to be like Vista? Most who have used it have proven that wrong. Windows 7 is the best operating system that has ever been officially released by Microsoft.

 

[Vertex]

The other night, I had an idea on how the Metro and its apps should work. First of all, in my idea, Metro is not integrated with the Start Menu. I like to provide a visual aid of my idea on this forum if I have the time.

The Metro needs:

1. It needs to have a separate button than the Start Menu.
2. It needs a power button, duh.
3. Metro Apps should have minimize, close and shutdown buttons because they don't terminate immediately when you go back to the Start Screen. One example is Piano, I could still hear its sound even if I pressed the Windows button to go back to the Start Screen. It just doesn't terminate immediately and that is a design flaw that better should be resolved in the beta.

4. A sliding bar on the top or bottom of Metro should show minimized Metro apps.

5. In the idea that I have, Metro screen is divided into two parts. One is where you see the Metro apps of course and the other one is where you see tiles of your installed programs, which you can sort and group. You can switch between these 2 parts on a button on the upper side of the Metro screen. Each of the these two parts of Metro screen should have a "Go Back to Desktop" button.

6. Metro should have a built-in feature to change its background without the use of third party programs because this is also a built-in feature on phones and tablets. It should also have the native ability to change the background of the log-on screen.

7. Outside the Metro, is you standard Desktop with icons of course and a Start Menu like Windows 7 but retaining all the other improvements on Windows 8, however, I dislike the ribbon on Windows Explorer, its just bulky and ugly. Windows 7's explorer is still better and space-efficient.


I am hopeful there would be less bugs and there would be more things added on the Beta but unfortunately, I also do not feel we are gonna see any major change of the current design we have seen of it as of now. Why? Because of the leaks of screenshots we are seeing, its looking like there's no visible change in the design at all so I have to agree on what ADRz said on that part but this is just an assumption, I'm not saying this will be what's gonna come up. Remember, we are just waiting for the Beta here and even that is still a bit of a long way from the final version so what we can hopefully do now is weigh which is better for the most people not just in our own preferences and ourselves then submit a statement to Microsoft and see if they will listen and accept our ideas.

 

[echrada]

The upcoming Windows 8 operating system is built around touchscreen technology- bringing the smartphone and tablet experience to the traditional PC. It’s still in development but is expected to launch in 2012.

It is true that previous attempts to launch touchscreen desktops failed to catch the imagination, but the fact Microsoft is building Windows 8 from the ground up for this specific purpose is invaluable. The advance should lead Apple to compete with a touchscreen Mac or MacBook- or perhaps even its mooted Apple television set.

More HERE

 

[ADRz]

The other night, I had an idea on how the Metro and its apps should work. First of all, in my idea, Metro is not integrated with the Start Menu. I like to provide a visual aid of my idea on this forum if I have the time.

The Metro needs:

1. It needs to have a separate button than the Start Menu.
2. It needs a power button, duh.
3. Metro Apps should have minimize, close and shutdown buttons because they don't terminate immediately when you go back to the Start Screen. One example is Piano, I could still hear its sound even if I pressed the Windows button to go back to the Start Screen. It just doesn't terminate immediately and that is a design flaw that better should be resolved in the beta.

4. A sliding bar on the top or bottom of Metro should show minimized Metro apps.

5. In the idea that I have, Metro screen is divided into two parts. One is where you see the Metro apps of course and the other one is where you see tiles of your installed programs, which you can sort and group. You can switch between these 2 parts on a button on the upper side of the Metro screen. Each of the these two parts of Metro screen should have a "Go Back to Desktop" button.

6. Metro should have a built-in feature to change its background without the use of third party programs because this is also a built-in feature on phones and tablets. It should also have the native ability to change the background of the log-on screen.

7. Outside the Metro, is you standard Desktop with icons of course and a Start Menu like Windows 7 but retaining all the other improvements on Windows 8, however, I dislike the ribbon on Windows Explorer, its just bulky and ugly. Windows 7's explorer is still better and space-efficient.


I am hopeful there would be less bugs and there would be more things added on the Beta but unfortunately, I also do not feel we are gonna see any major change of the current design we have seen of it as of now. Why? Because of the leaks of screenshots we are seeing, its looking like there's no visible change in the design at all so I have to agree on what ADRz said on that part but this is just an assumption, I'm not saying this will be what's gonna come up. Remember, we are just waiting for the Beta here and even that is still a bit of a long way from the final version so what we can hopefully do now is weigh which is better for the most people not just in our own preferences and ourselves then submit a statement to Microsoft and see if they will listen and accept our ideas.

I have a better suggestion altogether. Make this Metro Start-up Screen fully optional for those who feel the need to use it. Let me repeat this one more time. I buy Windows to run Windows applications. If I have had any "thirst" for Metro apps, I would have gone and bought a WP phone...and I did not. I have no use for these Metro-style apps. Whatever they are going to be, they would be, at best, simplistic versions of desktop apps. Let's be clear about it. No touch-based spreadsheet can ever be as comprehensive as the desktop Excel.

Then, you would have the fact that Android will be virtualized in 2012 (it is already in certain environments). Thus, one would be able to run any of 400,000 (and counting), Android apps in Windows!!! Why bother with Metro?????? The same may become true with OSX (it would allow the virtualization of iOS).

This "Metro-style" foray by Microsoft is just too little, too late (there may be about a dozen apps now !!!!). It is ridiculous. MS would have gained more by working to have Android run as a task under Windows. RIM did just that for its QNX OS. Reportedly, MS would allow Linux to run as a task under Windows, so Android would not be too far behind.

 

[tseven]

I'm a traditional PC user. I don't own a tablet. I think any next version is exciting especially since windows hasn't waited as long as Vista to arrive. Not only that but hopefully they have improved much more unlike how vista didn't seem like as much of an upgrade with that long of a wait. What they need is to have a team or have a little bit like half half with the focus on the metro and a focus on the desktop. So far I haven't seen much of any upgrade to the desktop. Visually I see they are toning down on the aero and going flatter but to be honest I don't think they should get too flat. Metro is nice and all but even metro needs a bit of shading and dimension. The things I've seen on the metro side just seem way to flat and while simple overly so. Also I don't know if the best idea is to combine the desktop with the new metro start screen. Partially because metro is so flat so simple and the desktop isn't. The more they try to simplify the actual look of the desktop the more complicated the stuff they add to it like that ribbon interface. Which is horrible. They are having a contradiction. With the simple look but complicated features. What they need to work on is the desktop a bit more and maybe give some life to the metro to tie it all in. Also maybe have a way to not install the metro for businesses at all unless they actually need to install it. I know I would not like to use it unless I am using a tablet. I don't want to install it if I know I won't be using it. Maybe they should have a option where it's like install metro only, desktop only or install both.

 

[Coke Robot]

Yeah, I do. It's called the first major step in the development of a new Windows operating system. It has new features a build of this kind wouldn't normally have, but 8 is different.

That may not be exactly be the most specific and accurate sentiment if we are talking about Desktops but even if you are a tablet user, be advised with the Metro on a Desktop, its a different story, my friend. Again, I not against the Metro, I just want it to have a separate button than the Start Menu. And I guess many would agree that there should be a power button on the Metro because when its there, you have to log off first before you can turn off the PC.

I should had told people Windows 7 was going to be exactly like vista, but it just works...

That is an understatement against Windows 7 saying its "exactly" going to be like Vista? Most who have used it have proven that wrong. Windows 7 is the best operating system that has ever been officially released by Microsoft.

You don't need to log off to shut the PC off, you go to Settings and click the power icon to shut down.

I know, I was being sarcastic.

 

[Coke Robot]

Are you two agreeing to disagree?

Let's all step back, take a big deep breath and WAIT till the Beta comes out.
Opinions and speculations come from the same body part and we all have one.
THW

I'll do that!


I'm just correcting misunderstandings, that's all....

 

[Coke Robot]

The other night, I had an idea on how the Metro and its apps should work. First of all, in my idea, Metro is not integrated with the Start Menu. I like to provide a visual aid of my idea on this forum if I have the time.

The Metro needs:

1. It needs to have a separate button than the Start Menu.
2. It needs a power button, duh.
3. Metro Apps should have minimize, close and shutdown buttons because they don't terminate immediately when you go back to the Start Screen. One example is Piano, I could still hear its sound even if I pressed the Windows button to go back to the Start Screen. It just doesn't terminate immediately and that is a design flaw that better should be resolved in the beta.

4. A sliding bar on the top or bottom of Metro should show minimized Metro apps.

5. In the idea that I have, Metro screen is divided into two parts. One is where you see the Metro apps of course and the other one is where you see tiles of your installed programs, which you can sort and group. You can switch between these 2 parts on a button on the upper side of the Metro screen. Each of the these two parts of Metro screen should have a "Go Back to Desktop" button.

6. Metro should have a built-in feature to change its background without the use of third party programs because this is also a built-in feature on phones and tablets. It should also have the native ability to change the background of the log-on screen.

7. Outside the Metro, is you standard Desktop with icons of course and a Start Menu like Windows 7 but retaining all the other improvements on Windows 8, however, I dislike the ribbon on Windows Explorer, its just bulky and ugly. Windows 7's explorer is still better and space-efficient.


I am hopeful there would be less bugs and there would be more things added on the Beta but unfortunately, I also do not feel we are gonna see any major change of the current design we have seen of it as of now. Why? Because of the leaks of screenshots we are seeing, its looking like there's no visible change in the design at all so I have to agree on what ADRz said on that part but this is just an assumption, I'm not saying this will be what's gonna come up. Remember, we are just waiting for the Beta here and even that is still a bit of a long way from the final version so what we can hopefully do now is weigh which is better for the most people not just in our own preferences and ourselves then submit a statement to Microsoft and see if they will listen and accept our ideas.

A lot of what you said will be in the beta. The Start Screen will not go, that's for sure. Maybe it's time to move away from menus?

I'd like to see Windows Explorer metrofied, with the Details pane on the bottom, with side to side scrolling. And of course, in Pictures, the metro icons for pictures in a mosaic like setup, it's so cool!

 

[Coke Robot]

The other night, I had an idea on how the Metro and its apps should work. First of all, in my idea, Metro is not integrated with the Start Menu. I like to provide a visual aid of my idea on this forum if I have the time.

The Metro needs:

1. It needs to have a separate button than the Start Menu.
2. It needs a power button, duh.
3. Metro Apps should have minimize, close and shutdown buttons because they don't terminate immediately when you go back to the Start Screen. One example is Piano, I could still hear its sound even if I pressed the Windows button to go back to the Start Screen. It just doesn't terminate immediately and that is a design flaw that better should be resolved in the beta.

4. A sliding bar on the top or bottom of Metro should show minimized Metro apps.

5. In the idea that I have, Metro screen is divided into two parts. One is where you see the Metro apps of course and the other one is where you see tiles of your installed programs, which you can sort and group. You can switch between these 2 parts on a button on the upper side of the Metro screen. Each of the these two parts of Metro screen should have a "Go Back to Desktop" button.

6. Metro should have a built-in feature to change its background without the use of third party programs because this is also a built-in feature on phones and tablets. It should also have the native ability to change the background of the log-on screen.

7. Outside the Metro, is you standard Desktop with icons of course and a Start Menu like Windows 7 but retaining all the other improvements on Windows 8, however, I dislike the ribbon on Windows Explorer, its just bulky and ugly. Windows 7's explorer is still better and space-efficient.


I am hopeful there would be less bugs and there would be more things added on the Beta but unfortunately, I also do not feel we are gonna see any major change of the current design we have seen of it as of now. Why? Because of the leaks of screenshots we are seeing, its looking like there's no visible change in the design at all so I have to agree on what ADRz said on that part but this is just an assumption, I'm not saying this will be what's gonna come up. Remember, we are just waiting for the Beta here and even that is still a bit of a long way from the final version so what we can hopefully do now is weigh which is better for the most people not just in our own preferences and ourselves then submit a statement to Microsoft and see if they will listen and accept our ideas.

I have a better suggestion altogether. Make this Metro Start-up Screen fully optional for those who feel the need to use it. Let me repeat this one more time. I buy Windows to run Windows applications. If I have had any "thirst" for Metro apps, I would have gone and bought a WP phone...and I did not. I have no use for these Metro-style apps. Whatever they are going to be, they would be, at best, simplistic versions of desktop apps. Let's be clear about it. No touch-based spreadsheet can ever be as comprehensive as the desktop Excel.

Then, you would have the fact that Android will be virtualized in 2012 (it is already in certain environments). Thus, one would be able to run any of 400,000 (and counting), Android apps in Windows!!! Why bother with Metro?????? The same may become true with OSX (it would allow the virtualization of iOS).

This "Metro-style" foray by Microsoft is just too little, too late (there may be about a dozen apps now !!!!). It is ridiculous. MS would have gained more by working to have Android run as a task under Windows. RIM did just that for its QNX OS. Reportedly, MS would allow Linux to run as a task under Windows, so Android would not be too far behind.

I've been seeing a difference between android and Windows Phone people.....

 

[Vertex]

A lot of what you said will be in the beta. The Start Screen will not go, that's for sure. Maybe it's time to move away from menus?

I still prefer the classic way of handling menus. I don't want the menu to take the whole screen and I'm still not interested in tablets as of now. But as we all know, there is more to see on the Beta. But on the main concept of the idea of that I gave, you'll get to enjoy the best of both worlds.

 

[ADRz]

A lot of what you said will be in the beta. The Start Screen will not go, that's for sure. Maybe it's time to move away from menus?

I still prefer the classic way of handling menus. I don't want the menu to take the whole screen and I'm still not interested in tablets as of now. But as we all know, there is more to see on the Beta. But on the main concept of the idea of that I gave, you'll get to enjoy the best of both worlds.

Well, we know now that you are not going to get your wish. The ribbons and the Start Screen will stay and they would continue to be there unless this approach is a commercial failure