Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Start Menu will reportedly return to Windows 8.1 this fall

  1. #31


    USA, Idaho
    Posts : 1,062
    Win 8, (VM win7, XP, Vista)


    The one argument you will not get from me is the need for the desktop. As for the modern apps there are none out there that can compete with the likes of AutoDesk CAD, Quicken, Adobe Photoshop CS 6, Adobe Audition CS 5.5. . . .I could go on when it comes to certain applications that just work better as a desktop program. Until developers come up with better programing for modern apps the desktop will never go away. As a part time (to old for full time) book editor the modern apps along with Linux and OS X there will never be anything out there that can beat Word 2013 and its editing abilities. . .period (oh, and the publishing companies give me Office 2013 for free.
    Last edited by Lee; 25 Apr 2014 at 23:55.

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  2. #32


    Forget Windows 8 > A disaster. Windows 8.1 Pro:

    I beg to differ and one can find something with less clicks and time in most cases. Start Screen did not replace the Start Menu or cascading menu > All Apps did. Although different in size, it follows the same principles as the Start Menu did, but in a linear motion. E.g. Scrolling left to right just as we read any script. (I realize some languages are inverse)

    It surely is in alphabetical order in the “By name” and the “Category” categories as seen below to clear up that false info. The categories to search by are:

    Click image for larger version

    It’s been a while since I used the Start Menu, so bear with me. If I remember correctly one could configure the Start Menu to show recent, which is the “Most used” category of All Apps. Newly installed programs folder would show as new for a time, which is “By date installed” category. “By category”-wise the Start Menu was left and right with programs in the left column and admin/system tools in the right column.

    Let’s say I want to find a program of the Office Pro 2013 suite. I’ll show “By categories” with semantic zoom first:

    Click image for larger version

    Press/Enter that category of Office and it automatically scrolls to this, or simply scroll to it without semantic zoom. Notice everything is in alphabetical order.

    Click image for larger version

    I won’t get into the archaic desktop system, but they do have OneNote written in Modern/Metro finished and in the Store. Try it. Once they are finished with the rest of the Office apps they will be available there as well. When enterprise learns about side loading custom-tailored apps to fit their business we be seeing less of desktop applications and then eventually no desktop app/portal at all. They’ll eventually work out the multi-windowing. 10 to 15 years from now we won’t see too many mice and less keyboards, for it will be touch/pen and voice-to-text systems.

    Any architectural and engineering firms have at least 2, if not 3 monitors at every work station. A definite must have to get any decent amount of work completed. A lot are switching to a flat or slightly tilted large touch/pen monitors for designing. I can envision MS writing a CAD program in Modern/Metro to compete with the likes of AutoCad and others.
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  3. #33


    Posts : 219
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64 Bit


    All apps is terrible hippie.. Are they in alphabetical order? Yes, but the start over again mid menu, so it literally goes A to Z 2x, which is just stupid. There is no rhyme or reason that I could discover regarding why an app would end up in the first group or the second. Finding anything therefore takes TIME. It was so much easier before, and still is with classic shell, with the concise, all programs view of the start menu. All apps still remains, utterly un-intuitive.
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  4. #34


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by musiclover7 View Post
    All apps is terrible hippie.. Are they in alphabetical order? Yes, but the start over again mid menu, so it literally goes A to Z 2x, which is just stupid. There is no rhyme or reason that I could discover regarding why an app would end up in the first group or the second. Finding anything therefore takes TIME. It was so much easier before, and still is with classic shell, with the concise, all programs view of the start menu. All apps still remains, utterly un-intuitive.
    The first A to Z is Metro Apps, the second A to Z is desktop programs. At least on my system it is. I prefer to sort by Category. The quick way to find something is to just start typing its name while on the Start Screen or All Apps Screen.
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  5. #35


    Posts : 902
    Win8.1 Pro, Desktop Mode


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post

    I beg to differ ~snip~

    You do get that it's not that we can't figure it out... but rather we just don't like it, right mate../???
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  6. #36


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    Quote Originally Posted by musiclover7 View Post
    ... There is no rhyme or reason that I could discover regarding why an app would end up in the first group or the second...
    @ musiclover7 Hello. The metro menu uses the same folder structure from explorer.exe as the classic shell.
    The only difference is no nesting.

    All listings in the metro menu are just shortcuts as in the classic shell.

    The first group consists of shortcuts listed in the start menu folder and would include shortcuts to metro apps ...

    Click image for larger version

    App shortcuts are added to the apps view here and listed in the first group ...

    Click image for larger version

    Click image for larger version

    The second group consists of the programs folder or all programs as in the classic shell.

    Click image for larger version

    Click image for larger version
    Last edited by mdmd; 25 Apr 2014 at 16:08. Reason: added prefix
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  7. #37


    Posts : 219
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64 Bit


    Wrong.. Many non metro apps appear in the first list.. So that is not true at all..
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  8. #38


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    Quote Originally Posted by musiclover7 View Post
    Many non metro apps appear in the first list ...
    True. Who are you referring to? (not me?) ok. thanks. The reference to "apps" is a metaphor to a shortcut listing. An app can be anything from a text document or pdf, a URL, a folder, to a desktop music or paint program. It depends on what exists in the start menu folder. If the sort is by name, it works as described according to folder organization.

    The confusion is clear when an app is not understood to be just a shortcut.
    It also becomes more confusing when the term program is compared to app.
    In Windows 8, an App is not specific to the metro interface only i.e. > the desktop ###

    The new proposed start menu would not work for me as I have about 200 shortcuts pasted.
    Last edited by mdmd; 25 Apr 2014 at 16:09. Reason: added controversy
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  9. #39


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    I stand corrected, the first group looks to be what is pinned to the main Start menu and the rest are in the second group. That is if you have it set to sort "by Name" If I set it to sort by category though, all I see in what looks like the first group are Metro Apps. I use by category so that's why I thought it was just metro Apps. That's all I saw. Taking another look though I see "Desktop" is a category so I just wasn't looking close enough. My apologies.
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  10. #40


    Quote Originally Posted by Rickkins View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post

    I beg to differ ~snip~
    You do get that it's not that we can't figure it out... but rather we just don't like it, right mate../???
    The brains to learn it is one thing, but to use it on a daily basis over a good period of time to really get to know the system and what one can do with it is another.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    The tile system works best for SIMPLE application geared to a SINGLE task and also when you don't have too many applications == it's also passable for touch devices.
    My hat off to users like Jim who at least gives credit to 8.1 for the option to boot to desktop and/or use All Apps instead of Start Screen, but I think some have not investigated all the other changes made in 8.1. That’s why I stated to forget 8. It was a Sinofski disaster. Changes to All Apps is only one of the changes. There are many. I know Jim likes his cascading menus and has designated a thread and some posts on it, but when someone makes a statement like this it is guaranteed that it will get a counter opinion as you can see. That’s all these are on both sides > Opinions. Until someone shows me results from an in-depth study on one system vs the other then I’ll change my mind, otherwise I will state my opinion.

    So far as I see today this continues to be called Windows Eight Forums and to support Windows 8, 8.1, WP8, and soon to be WP8.1. Not Windows Seven, Linux, OSX, or what have you, but if it weren’t for the name I think someone looking in on some of these threads would begin to wonder what this forum is really all about.
    Last edited by HippsieGypsie; 25 Apr 2014 at 20:17.
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