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Fragging wonderful: The truth about defragging your SSD

  1. #31


    BELGIUM
    Posts : 503
    WINDOWS 8.1 x64


    "Sure, lower capacity SSD drives 128GB and 256GB are rapidly decreasing in price, but for 0,5 TB drives and above you are still sweating it at around and above 4 times the price compared to a SATA HDD.

    A 500GB HDD will cost you about $60 at Amazon

    A 500GB SSD will cost you about $300 or above..."

    True Coram, but in order to have your HDD fast, not only do you need to defrag it, but keep in mind that when using 60 % (or more) of the disk capacity your performance will degrade. You do not have that with a SSD.

    HDD are nice for static data and.....that's it.

    Jeff

    have to edit this:

    " I do NOT agree that the knowledge about not having to defrag SSD's was common spread three years ago,"

    BUT IT WAS. I use SSD's from the take off, i guess some 5-6 years ago. My first buy where 6 OCZ (their first make) and already then it was common sence NOT to defrag a SSD.

    Jeff

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #32


    Hafnarfjrur IS
    Posts : 4,376
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10


    Quote Originally Posted by jeffrys View Post
    "Sure, lower capacity SSD drives 128GB and 256GB are rapidly decreasing in price, but for 0,5 TB drives and above you are still sweating it at around and above 4 times the price compared to a SATA HDD.

    A 500GB HDD will cost you about $60 at Amazon

    A 500GB SSD will cost you about $300 or above..."

    True Coram, but in order to have your HDD fast, not only do you need to defrag it, but keep in mind that when using 60 % (or more) of the disk capacity your performance will degrade. You do not have that with a SSD.

    HDD are nice for static data and.....that's it.

    Jeff

    have to edit this:

    " I do NOT agree that the knowledge about not having to defrag SSD's was common spread three years ago,"

    BUT IT WAS. I use SSD's from the take off, i guess some 5-6 years ago. My first buy where 6 OCZ (their first make) and already then it was common sence NOT to defrag a SSD.

    Jeff
    Hi there @ jeff

    Don't want to keep labouring the point but modern spinners DO NOT NEED TO BE DEFRAGGED -- you basically for the domestic market have 5400 RPM and 7200 RPM drives -- 10,000 RPM SCSI expensive drives etc are usually specialized server stuff so we'll concentrate on the Domestic stuff.

    1) 5400 RPM disks are so slow anyway that the performance is just going to be horrible whatever you do and anything short of replacing the drive will not yield any user perceptible performance.

    2) OS data doesn't change much - most non persistent data is in the page area and scratch data which get re-initialized every time -- unless you run your disks 95% full no defragging will help in optimising these OS areas.

    3) User data is essentially READ ONLY (in general) such as music / multi-media so it doesn't really benefit from any defragging - the rate for example at which Music is played on your audio card is far slower than even HORRIBLE disks so you won't get an I/O penalty here.

    4) I've explained how basic OS I/O works in previous posts and how it's overlapped with processing and the concept of PRE FETCHING -- any 7200 decent spinner will perform adequately - 5400 one's won't - simple END OF STORY. Always have your OS separate from DATA partitions.

    5) SSD's will always improve ANY system.

    6) Bottleneck on the OS is usually caused by POOR disk I/O (5400 RPM devices) - and running too many apps with insufficient RAM -- NONE of this will be improved to any perceptible degree by defragging.

    If you are running online servers / web sites where users can make queries on DB's then you MUST HAVE FAST DISKS.

    Anyway in all this not ONE person has even posted on what sort of performance you SHOULD expect by defragging a disk so IMO the whole question is largely irrelevant anyway.

    You can still improve performance on Desktop type systems by having the OS age and Scratch work areas on a different device to the OS (unless the OS is an SSD - I/O is fast enough on SSD's to have the page data etc on the OS disk.

    Also rule nr one -- DUMP any 5400 RPM spinner - or just use for backup and archive.

    Cheers
    jimbo
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #33


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    I thought that I read somewhere that "Wear Leveling" isn't as effective if you don't have free space on your SSD.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #34


    Let me ad couple more drops of fuel on the fire. Large data base program and MS Office (at least) intentionally leave some space free for files that are continually growing as the amount of data in them is expanded and so increase reading and writing speed. Such space looks like it is fragmented and defragmenting and solidifying such space can actualy slow them down.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #35


    Posts : 1,925
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by CountMike View Post
    Let me ad couple more drops of fuel on the fire. Large data base program and MS Office (at least) intentionally leave some space free for files that are continually growing as the amount of data in them is expanded and so increase reading and writing speed. Such space looks like it is fragmented and defragmenting and solidifying such space can actualy slow them down.
    That hasn't been true for well over a decade, since the inclusion of Sparse file support in NTFS.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #36


    Posts : 454
    Windows 8.1 Pro with Media Center


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    I thought that I read somewhere that "Wear Leveling" isn't as effective if you don't have free space on your SSD.
    The tl;dr version is to leave 25% free to keep performance high. With TRIM, you don't even to leave space unpartitioned.

    AnandTech | Exploring the Relationship Between Spare Area and Performance Consistency in Modern SSDs - Print View
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #37


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    Thanks crawfish


    Quote Originally Posted by crawfish View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    I thought that I read somewhere that "Wear Leveling" isn't as effective if you don't have free space on your SSD.
    The tl;dr version is to leave 25% free to keep performance high. With TRIM, you don't even to leave space unpartitioned.

    AnandTech | Exploring the Relationship Between Spare Area and Performance Consistency in Modern SSDs - Print View
    Thanks for that link crawfish.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #38


    BELGIUM
    Posts : 503
    WINDOWS 8.1 x64


    Well Jimbo,

    you might be right, but i always had to defrag my HDD's, but that was 6 years ago, before i switched to SSD's.

    I never used SATA drives until SSD's came along, always used SCSI drives with a Raid card.

    So no, i do not have exerience with Win 7 or Win 8 on HDD's.

    Jeff
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Fragging wonderful: The truth about defragging your SSD
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