Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Microsoft warns Windows XP users risk 'zero day forever'

  1. #61


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    True, but ...


    Quote Originally Posted by DJRoff View Post
    I suspect this will always be true. But that can be like replacing a child because he cries. Eventually, the new one will probably cry, too. Better to find out what's making him cry, so it doesn't happen over and over again, eh?
    True enough.
    I used to work as an electronic repair technician.
    There is nothing more frustrating, than not being able to isolate the cause of some problem.
    Intermittent problems are the worst of all.

    However, I have often wasted hours d***ing around trying to fix something, when I could have simply reimaged and got on with using my PC.

    It seems that a lot of PC/OS problems are caused by things not installing correctly (especially drivers).
    Strangely enough, if you start form from the same position (i.e. reimage) and try again with the same installer, often there will no problems.
    Last edited by lehnerus2000; 23 Aug 2013 at 12:26. Reason: Layout,Spelling

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  2. #62


    Delaware, USA
    Posts : 79
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit, Windows 7 Pro 64-bit, Windows XP Pro 32-bit, Ubuntu 14.04 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DJRoff View Post
    I suspect this will always be true. But that can be like replacing a child because he cries. Eventually, the new one will probably cry, too. Better to find out what's making him cry, so it doesn't happen over and over again, eh?
    True enough.
    I used to work as an electronic repair technician.
    There is nothing more frustrating, than not being able to isolate the cause of some problem.
    Intermittent problems are the worst of all.

    However, I have often wasted hours d***ing around trying to fix something, when I could have simply reimaged and got on with using my PC.

    It seems that a lot of PC/OS problems are caused by things not installing correctly (especially drivers).
    Strangely enough, if you start form the same position (i.e. reimage) and try again with the same installer, often there will no problems.
    Yep, been there. Another one of those "mysteries of modern computing", I guess. But I've also been on the other side too often, where it was a minor hardware conflict that re-installation wouldn't make go away. Once, I installed XP on an older mobo, and everything worked fine, until I ran SP3, then the networking died. After fiddling around for hours, I tried your method. Reinstallation brought the networking back to life, but again it died when I went to SP3. Turns out there was onboard hardware that was simply not supported, once the OS was fully updated. I'm guessing this was a result of having an OS that spanned 14 years of industry changes! But in many cases, you make a good point.
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  3. #63


    Yup.. posted in another thread that my PC crashed whilst posting here no less, LOL
    ..and went through the whole...
    bootrec /fixmbr, bootrec /fixboot, bootrec /scanos, bootrec /rebuildbcd...thing - which helped but the damaged OS still would not load...then tried Automatic Repair option - what total crap..

    ...the only thing that works (and I still believe the best M$ utility ever) is CHKDSK

    Hopefully they can find a way of integrating that into Automatic Repair!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #64


    Australia
    Posts : 716
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    There is nothing more frustrating, than not being able to isolate the cause of some problem.

    However, I have often wasted hours d***ing around trying to fix something, when I could have simply reimaged and got on with using my PC.

    It seems that a lot of PC/OS problems are caused by things not installing correctly.
    Most times re-imaging is the only way to go. Keep all your personal data stored on separate storage media and drag/drop to new image.

    Some problems though do require investigation. I had an interesting one. I purchased a new Belkin USB WiFi adaptor and installed it on a fully loaded Windows 7 and it simply would not connect; even though showing in Device Manager as working correctly. Tried all the usual things of turning off Zone Alarm, Avast, etc while installing. Also tried to install in Safe Mode, and a few other tricks including following error log links to M$; SFC, SCNDSK, msconfig selective start, removing latest updates, registry scan, etc, etc ... but all to no avail.

    Reimaged with bare bones 7 and it ran fine. Installed all 3rd party apps/programs and still ran fine. To test it, uninstalled/reinstalled on fully loaded system and it would not run; even with all security turned off both before and after installing. Exactly the same scenario for Vista and Windows 8.

    Ran posts in this forum and a couple of other tech forums and all to no avail. It seemed the only way to ensure it worked was to load Belkin first on bare bones and never uninstall once fully loaded.

    Finally stumbled on the answer by accident. Turned out Zone Alarm was the culprit, being the common element across all 3 OSs ... even though the Belkin program was ticked in the Trusted list for ZA. The solution was to UNINSTALL ZA totally with Revo which also removed all registry entries. Then no probelmo! And reinstalled ZA after Belkin was up and running.

    Computers! AAAAAGGGGHHHH!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #65


    Delaware, USA
    Posts : 79
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit, Windows 7 Pro 64-bit, Windows XP Pro 32-bit, Ubuntu 14.04 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    There is nothing more frustrating, than not being able to isolate the cause of some problem.

    However, I have often wasted hours d***ing around trying to fix something, when I could have simply reimaged and got on with using my PC.

    It seems that a lot of PC/OS problems are caused by things not installing correctly.
    Most times re-imaging is the only way to go. Keep all your personal data stored on separate storage media and drag/drop to new image.

    Some problems though do require investigation. I had an interesting one. I purchased a new Belkin USB WiFi adaptor and installed it on a fully loaded Windows 7 and it simply would not connect; even though showing in Device Manager as working correctly. Tried all the usual things of turning off Zone Alarm, Avast, etc while installing. Also tried to install in Safe Mode, and a few other tricks including following error log links to M$; SFC, SCNDSK, msconfig selective start, removing latest updates, registry scan, etc, etc ... but all to no avail.

    Reimaged with bare bones 7 and it ran fine. Installed all 3rd party apps/programs and still ran fine. To test it, uninstalled/reinstalled on fully loaded system and it would not run; even with all security turned off both before and after installing. Exactly the same scenario for Vista and Windows 8.

    Ran posts in this forum and a couple of other tech forums and all to no avail. It seemed the only way to ensure it worked was to load Belkin first on bare bones and never uninstall once fully loaded.

    Finally stumbled on the answer by accident. Turned out Zone Alarm was the culprit, being the common element across all 3 OSs ... even though the Belkin program was ticked in the Trusted list for ZA. The solution was to UNINSTALL ZA totally with Revo which also removed all registry entries. Then no probelmo! And reinstalled ZA after Belkin was up and running.

    Computers! AAAAAGGGGHHHH!
    Don't even get me STARTED on Wi-Fi. With all the knowledge I've managed to pick up along the way, that one area is my Achilles heel, and often the bane of my existence. Something that seems like it should be so straightforward, and you'll waste hours banging your head against it. Your scenario is a great case in point.
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  6. #66


    Australia
    Posts : 716
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM


    Quote Originally Posted by DJRoff View Post
    Don't even get me STARTED on Wi-Fi. With all the knowledge I've managed to pick up along the way, that one area is my Achilles heel, and often the bane of my existence. Something that seems like it should be so straightforward, and you'll waste hours banging your head against it. Your scenario is a great case in point.
    Yeah, totally agree. Netgear on XP was even worse, which entailed spending mega time on frequency and other wireless settings on both modem and adaptor.

    Before I stumbled on the solution, I had resigned myself to creating a backup image of my OS where Belkin had been installed first and then the 3rd party stuff; so I knew it worked. But I only discovered the problem was across all 3 OSs when I reloaded Vista from scratch, in order to do a pristine backup image and assumed Belkin would be fine. After multiple hours of getting it all exactly as I wanted it, I loaded Belkin near the end ... and that's when the head banging started and I realized it was the same problem as on W7. And had to start the whole process again.

    My method is to do a bare bones installation of the OS and activate it, and create a backup image. Then add all 3rd party stuff. And burn a 2nd image of the fully loaded OS. I update the fully loaded image periodically and burn an updated image of the fully loaded updated OS. When I need to do a clean installation I simply reload the bare bones activated image as a clean start.
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  7. #67


    Hafnarfjörður IS
    Posts : 4,376
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10


    Hi there
    Unlike Linux, ANY networking on Windows seems a hit or miss affair -- sometimes for what seems like no reason whatsoever one or more Windows machines (might be W7 or XP) just won't allow other computers to share their disks without having to type the whole IP address etc in or going through a whole rigmarole to get them to work. Windows networks *might* work properly if you are lucky.

    Linux networks seem to work just fine straight out of the box and have no trouble sharing with windows machines either (both ways).

    Another totally bovine thing on windows 8 is that if you register on to say a wireless network you can't delete COMPLETELY that network again so you never get the re-registration screen any more for that network - even if you delete the profile via netsh wlan delete profile *.

    So if you want to re-register on to the Wi-Fi Network again you can't do it --it will simply attempt to re-connect using the data saved somewhere. (What I mean here is say you are using a public Wi-Fi service in a place like an office building which requires you to fill in an initial registration screen from an Open Network (i.e no password required) your computer will just re-connect to that network bypassing the initial registration screen). This causes a lot of aggro when you are on one of these types of networks and you get "Limited Connectivity" notifications.

    Cheers
    jimbo
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  8. #68


    Delaware, USA
    Posts : 79
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit, Windows 7 Pro 64-bit, Windows XP Pro 32-bit, Ubuntu 14.04 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    Hi there
    Unlike Linux, ANY networking on Windows seems a hit or miss affair -- sometimes for what seems like no reason whatsoever one or more Windows machines (might be W7 or XP) just won't allow other computers to share their disks without having to type the whole IP address etc in or going through a whole rigmarole to get them to work. Windows networks *might* work properly if you are lucky.
    This is about the only computer-related area where I actually stooped to buying one of those infernal black-and-yellow "for Dummies" books...
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #69


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by DJRoff View Post
    Don't even get me STARTED on Wi-Fi. With all the knowledge I've managed to pick up along the way, that one area is my Achilles heel, and often the bane of my existence. Something that seems like it should be so straightforward, and you'll waste hours banging your head against it. Your scenario is a great case in point.
    Agreed.
    I have a thread on SevenForums because my friend and I cannot get any of our 802.11n routers to run at more than 15 Mbs.

    This is true regardless of:
    • The range between the router and device(s)
    • The OS used (XP, W7, Linux Mint or Arch Linux)


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang View Post
    My method is to do a bare bones installation of the OS and activate it, and create a backup image. Then add all 3rd party stuff. And burn a 2nd image of the fully loaded OS. I update the fully loaded image periodically and burn an updated image of the fully loaded updated OS. When I need to do a clean installation I simply reload the bare bones activated image as a clean start.
    I use a similar method.

    I create:
    • An image after installing the OS and updates.
    • A second image after I have installed the majority of my programs.
    • Another image every month, before Patch Tuesday (operating systems and data partitions).


    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    Linux networks seem to work just fine straight out of the box and have no trouble sharing with windows machines either (both ways).
    Some people have trouble with wireless on their desktop Linux distros.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    Another totally bovine thing on windows 8 is that if you register on to say a wireless network you can't delete COMPLETELY that network again so you never get the re-registration screen any more for that network - even if you delete the profile via netsh wlan delete profile *.
    There is a section in the Registry that remembers the network profiles.
    I can't remember where it is though.

    Try creating a network profile, give it an unique name and then search for it using RegEdit.
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  10. #70


    Delaware, USA
    Posts : 79
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit, Windows 7 Pro 64-bit, Windows XP Pro 32-bit, Ubuntu 14.04 64-bit


    [QUOTE=lehnerus2000;270873]
    Quote Originally Posted by DJRoff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    Another totally bovine thing on windows 8 is that if you register on to say a wireless network you can't delete COMPLETELY that network again so you never get the re-registration screen any more for that network - even if you delete the profile via netsh wlan delete profile *.
    There is a section in the Registry that remembers the network profiles.
    I can't remember where it is though.

    Try creating a network profile, give it an unique name and then search for it using RegEdit.
    That would explain a lot of things, like when I uninstall a printer and reinstall it, it keeps coming up as "HPLaserJet (2)" or something. Same thing with the network profiles, it's like trying to kill a vampire. Sounds like the real "fix" is brain surgery. (That's the way I always feel when I go into the Registry.)
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Microsoft warns Windows XP users risk 'zero day forever'
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