Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


If the iPad was late, ran Windows 8, it would fail too

  1. #21


    Posts : 5,360
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin


    Bookmark your post and come back to it in a few years. You won't need to edit and twist my post #19 , you will probably understand it then.
    Last edited by SIW2; 21 Jul 2013 at 20:56.

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  2. #22


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    By the way, it's funny how quickly people forget the kinds of criticism the iPad got when it first came out.
    FWIW, I don't like iPads.
    The one I played with was too heavy to hold for more than a couple of minutes.

    The Android GUI (Ice Cream Sandwich?) doesn't fill me with joy either.
    To be fair to Android, I haven't used its GUI on an actual tablet (it was awful on a TV media box that I tested).
    The same is true of Metro on a tablet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cr00zng View Post
    I've been using Windows phone for over a year and Windows 8.1 for couple of weeks and seen only the "smart search in 8.1 that required additional actions to disable. Other than that, none of your claims pan out. It is not mandatory for the end-users to opt-in to MS services, that are available for people who'd prefer to use them. These services are not different from any of the "free" services offered by other companies that used by lot of people.
    It's not mandatory currently.

    Once they (Apple, Google, MS, etc.) can trick enough people into using a "Cloud OS", they can:
    • Control what software you can run
    • Simply remove the ability for the user to be able to use any local storage (i.e. remove the disc file system code).
    • Read everything you store in their "Cloud" storage

    This is in addition to tracking everything you do on the Internet.
    Last edited by lehnerus2000; 22 Jul 2013 at 01:08. Reason: Additional
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  3. #23


    USA, Idaho
    Posts : 1,062
    Win 8, (VM win7, XP, Vista)


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    By the way, it's funny how quickly people forget the kinds of criticism the iPad got when it first came out.
    FWIW, I don't like iPads.
    The one I played with was too heavy to hold for more than a couple of minutes.

    The Android GUI (Ice Cream Sandwich?) doesn't fill me with joy either.
    To be fair to Android, I haven't used its GUI on an actual tablet (it was awful on a TV media box that I tested).

    Quote Originally Posted by Cr00zng View Post
    I've been using Windows phone for over a year and Windows 8.1 for couple of weeks and seen only the "smart search in 8.1 that required additional actions to disable. Other than that, none of your claims pan out. It is not mandatory for the end-users to opt-in to MS services, that are available for people who'd prefer to use them. These services are not different from any of the "free" services offered by other companies that used by lot of people.
    It's not mandatory currently.

    Once they (Apple, Google, MS, etc.) can trick enough people into using a "Cloud OS", they can:
    • Control what software you can run
    • Simply remove the ability for the user to be able to use any local storage (i.e. remove the disc file system code).
    • Read everything you store in their "Cloud" storage

    This is in addition to tracking everything you do on the Internet.
    Think you need to replace that tinfoil. . .

    As to the cloud that is something that I truly have no use for, and never will.
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  4. #24


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    No Tinfoil Involved


    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Once they (Apple, Google, MS, etc.) can trick enough people into using a "Cloud OS", they can:
    • Control what software you can run
    • Simply remove the ability for the user to be able to use any local storage (i.e. remove the disc file system code).
    • Read everything you store in their "Cloud" storage

    This is in addition to tracking everything you do on the Internet.
    Think you need to replace that tinfoil. . .
    This isn't "100,000 Russian Tanks in Canada waiting to invade the US, when the UN gives the order" stuff.


    These points are not only technically feasible, at least one has been shown to have actually occurred.

    If you use their "Cloud OS", they could control what software you are allowed to run on it.
    It will be in the EULA and TOS.

    They could prevent you from being able to store your files locally.
    "To protect you from malware, all files must be stored on our servers."

    They already "read" the data you store in the "Cloud".
    Watch what you store on SkyDrive–you may lose your Microsoft life | WMPoweruser
    Microsoft kills the enterprise cloud | Computerworld Blogs

    Apple regularly releases updates designed to break jail-broken devices.
    Microsoft has already demonstrated that it can "brick" operating systems that aren't "Cloud" based.

    There was the XP WGA incident (which affected legitimate users and pirates)
    There was the Xbox incident (which allegedly only affected pirates).
    Microsoft Bans Up to One Million Users From Xbox Live | PCWorld
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  5. #25


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Once they (Apple, Google, MS, etc.) can trick enough people into using a "Cloud OS", they can:
    • Control what software you can run
    • Simply remove the ability for the user to be able to use any local storage (i.e. remove the disc file system code).
    • Read everything you store in their "Cloud" storage

    This is in addition to tracking everything you do on the Internet.
    Think you need to replace that tinfoil. . .
    This isn't "100,000 Russian Tanks in Canada waiting to invade the US, when the UN gives the order" stuff.


    These points are not only technically feasible, at least one has been shown to have actually occurred.

    If you use their "Cloud OS", they could control what software you are allowed to run on it.
    It will be in the EULA and TOS.

    They could prevent you from being able to store your files locally.
    "To protect you from malware, all files must be stored on our servers."

    They already "read" the data you store in the "Cloud".
    Watch what you store on SkyDrive–you may lose your Microsoft life | WMPoweruser
    Microsoft kills the enterprise cloud | Computerworld Blogs

    Apple regularly releases updates designed to break jail-broken devices.
    Microsoft has already demonstrated that it can "brick" operating systems that aren't "Cloud" based.

    There was the XP WGA incident (which affected legitimate users and pirates)
    There was the Xbox incident (which allegedly only affected pirates).
    Microsoft Bans Up to One Million Users From Xbox Live | PCWorld
    None of those things is even close to what you are proposing.

    I keep all my stuff on local hard drives. I've never used skydrive. Can't imagine I ever will. I'm pretty sure I'm safe from the mind-control microwaves that are being aimed at me right now.
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  6. #26


    Posts : 47
    Windows 8


    Let's back up a bit here. The iPad was successfuly because Apple already had traction in the market through sales of the iPhone. Those stupid, technophobic consumers with too much money lapped up the iPhone making it easy for Apple to sell bucketloads of what is essentially the same device, to the same consumers but with a bigger screen.

    Microsoft haven't had that head start. So they're trying to sell WP8, Win8RT and Win8, and the idea of Modern UI and tablet interfaces into a market where the even more stupid (and considerably financially less well off) are still aspiring to an Apple device!

    There's nothing inherently wrong with Win8 or the Metro interface but those idiot consumers with too much money are the ones who are spreading the message that it "doesn't work" simply because "well, it's not as good as my iDevice"!
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  7. #27


    Quote Originally Posted by SIW2 View Post
    You seem to be completely missing the point.

    MS want to monetise the customers through their cloud services/subs/ads/whatever else they can think up.

    The eventual aim is to get everyone into ever smaller devices that just link to their clouds. A lot of money for MS and huge costs, loss of privacy and lack of control for the consumers.

    They will do that largely by offering baubles and beads. Not very different from the old cowboy movies where the Indian chief sells his kids land for a few shiny glass beads.

    Customers are not going for the first big step - this whole win8 metro thing. There are plenty of reasons for that. I don't think many understand where they are being led. If they did, they would have a very valid reason to say no.

    The steps along the way like moving to RT etc are just details. No point in getting bogged down in details - it should be about being able to see the wood for the trees.
    What would be your plan for MS? Stick to what they were doing? Remember, their market is shrinking so far as the desktop PC goes. Please don't give me the BS that it's because of 8. It was shrinking long before 8 was introduced. We also have a faltering world economy. No one wants to invest money unless they have to, especially businesses, of which will be the only ones that buy desktops, save a few of us that are enthusiasts. The general public is going mobile. No doubt about that.

    It seems to me MS did their best to satisfy you "Desktoppers" with 8.1. You can now boot to the desktop and skip the Start Screen altogether to use All Apps instead. A fair compromise IMO, although I know it is not by default, but, the choice is still there. The way I see it, you can cry bloody murder for your Start Menu. I don't think you'll be getting it back. Metro UI, RT, Start Screen, Store, Store apps, and the whole gambit is far too important monetarily for MS.

    The OS continues to be native. One can continue to use a local account. One has the option to turn off Bing search. One can uninstall all of the store apps. One does not have to participate in CEP. One does not need to use SkyDrive. One can turn off any option they deem intrusive. Is this not so? Personally, when I don't have those choices, I'll be the first one to go elsewhere.

    Corporations/companies monetizing customers? You make it sound like it's something new. That's what companies do. Its called free enterprise. Consumer still have a choice > Buy or not. And yes, there will always be sheeple. Its been that way since the dawn of the marketplace.

    As a born American, I'm here to tell you that I think MS is one of the fairest corporations left in America. I won't get into details because I'll have to get too political, but I will mention a corporation like Walmart. You talk about having it over on sheeple. 99% of their customers will be back to buy the same foreign ill-made crap to replace the foreign ill-made crap they bought their to begin with. Why? Because the prices are so low. Please look up a documentary titled "The High Cost of Low Prices". There are other companies also.

    BTW, I just had a friend who is opening a used car lot buy an all-in-one to present customers info. It has 8 on it.
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  8. #28


    Posts : 5,360
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin


    Please don't give me the BS that it's because of 8. It was shrinking long before 8 was introduced.
    You won't catch flu just by standing in the freezing rain.

    But, if you have flu, it is not good idea to stand in the freezing rain.

    If they want my advice on how to proceed from here, they will have to pay me for it.
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  9. #29


    Posts : 288
    Windows 7 Ultimate, Windows Developer Preview, Linux Mint 9


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post
    It seems to me MS did their best to satisfy you "Desktoppers" with 8.1.
    That may seem to be a bit of exaggeration there.

    Apart from giving the option to boot directly to the Desktop and the new shutdown link, there was no real deal added to the desktop side of Windows 8.1 than there was on Windows 8 RTM.

    The new Start button that leads to the Metro upsets people who thought that a Start button should open a traditional Start menu. This may seem like a mockery to a lot of people.

    And what's more, some of the power "desktoppers" now noticed that WEI and the native ability to make system images from Windows 8 was ripped off on 8.1 when there was no good reason for them to take those out in addition to the others that were taken down before.

    It would have been a more fair assessment if "MS added a few things for Desktoppers on 8.1" but if they had done their "best", we would have seen much better than that on the Desktop side and they wouldn't have ripped off those good features in the first place. There would have been far less complaining this way and maybe even a better uptake of Windows 8 or 8.1 in general. If they had done their "best", they would have listened. M$ or Ballmer's claims that they have listened to the public are mostly lies.
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  10. #30


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by goodintentions View Post
    None of those things is even close to what you are proposing.
    You can rent virtual servers from online companies (e.g. "Cloud OS").
    Cloud Server Hosting by Rackspace

    MS scans the files that users upload to SkyDrive.
    Microsoft responds to SkyDrive privacy concerns - Neowin

    Apple sends out updates to stop people from installing unapproved software.
    After 43 days of jailbreaking frenzy, Apple has closed the cell doors again. The latest 6.1.3 update to iOS released Tuesday includes a patch that prevents the use of the hacking tool evasi0n, which since early February has become the most popular program ever for “jailbreaking” phones and tablets to remove their software restrictions.
    Forbes
    Apple's New iOS Update Blocks Evasi0n Jailbreak--After It's Been Used About 18 Million Times - Forbes

    Quote Originally Posted by goodintentions View Post
    I'm pretty sure I'm safe from the mind-control microwaves that are being aimed at me right now.
    What a witty retort.
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