Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Sorry, bringing back the Start menu won't help Windows 8

  1. #31


    Quote Originally Posted by Jf1450 View Post
    Every time I fire up 8 and see that Metro/Modern interface I look like this guy. It reminds me of a freaking carnival, not an OS designed and developed by and to be used by, professionals. Talk about cheesy looking.....

    -jeff
    Admittedly I think the default Start Screen is quite "loud". Have you considered modifying it? Here's a thread of a lot of posts of members doing so. Some are quite amazing to me.

    www.eightforums.com/showthread.php?t=4506

    I'm quite sure in future releases and/or updates that MS Will add more personalization options for the Start Screen. We see hint of this in Blue.

    Let's look at it from a business standpoint of finances and time. I'm quite sure they allotted an X amount of money and time to write the code of 8 and release the initial product. They can always add to it just as they've done with past OSs.

    Keep in mind that this industry moves exponentially quicker nowadays. Releases of new products and concepts change rather quickly. e.g. How often do the new iPhones and iPads with hardware and software get released? Can we say what we buy today is already obsolete? They are already working on the "next model". I think that's true with most products. Yes?

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  2. #32


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post
    Keep in mind that this industry moves exponentially quicker nowadays. Releases of new products and concepts change rather quickly. e.g. How often do the new iPhones and iPads with hardware and software get released? Can we say what we buy today is already obsolete? They are already working on the "next model". I think that's true with most products. Yes?
    Lets agree to disagree. I think the advances were bigger with more impact back in the early days, the 80's and 90's if you will. Sure, we're still advancing but to me it's more like putting a different face on the same ole stuff. Somebody develops a new idea for a web site. It's still a web site. Processors get faster and faster. How fast is fast enough? Hard drives get bigger. I can't come close to filling what I have now. Screen resolution gets better. The displays we have now already look like a quality photograph. I have a first generation iPad. I go to a store and look at a 4th gen. What's the big deal? I guess I'm getting jaded and showing my age.

    -jeff
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #33


    Posts : 123
    Windows 8, 2012, 7, 2008R2, 2008, 2003, XP,SUSE


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post

    Keep in mind that this industry moves exponentially quicker nowadays. Releases of new products and concepts change rather quickly. e.g. How often do the new iPhones and iPads with hardware and software get released? Can we say what we buy today is already obsolete? They are already working on the "next model". I think that's true with most products. Yes?
    Interesting that all of your examples are not only tablets and phones but also Apple. Computers have stopped evolving as fast. My desktop machine upstairs is still extremely fast and able to run anything I throw at it although it is over 3 years old (a record for me!). Sure, I bumped it up to 16 GB of ram but it has the same hard drives and video card that I put on it 3 years ago when I built it. I imagine my laptop with also last for my needs for quite a few years as well but it did start out as a beefy machine too (i7,two hard drives and 16 GB of ram). My work machine will also last me years before I would ever get the OK to upgrade it (i7,20 GB ram...)

    My phone would be more like your example. I'm on my third upgrade in 15 months and was thinking about the new Galaxy S4 but I think my wife will have a phone intervention for me before I can do that!

    It also points out a glaring issue that I have with Windows 8. People who defend it the strongest compare it to more of a phone than a laptop/desktop OS. It's not. And Microsoft has mixed up the two far too much. Does windows 2012 server really need the Modern UI just like a phone or an XBOX? Does my desktop really need an airplane mode? When you make a one size fits all OS, you end up alienate everyone and making a product that doesn't fit well in anything.

    Stop using iPhone/iPad examples.
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  4. #34


    Sloe Deth, Californicatia
    Posts : 3,908
    Windows 8 Pro with Media Center/Windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XweAponX View Post
    It's not JUST the missing Start Menu - It's the hiding of "Safe Mode" under layers of forced-reboots you must do to get to it - Not to mention, if the OS is not working perfectly, you cannot get to any of those areas.
    And how many times does that happen that safe mode is needed?
    Agreed, not many - HOWEVER, the process of getting into it should be as easy as it has ever been. I remember having a helluva time hitting F8 at JUST the right moment in Windows 98. Under 2000, XP, and Vista/7 this is much easier cos that window was elongated. But in 8 it is this huge PROCESS. Safe mode needs to be readily available, because although it is not used that much, it is STILL needed, and it should be easy to access.
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  5. #35


    Sloe Deth, Californicatia
    Posts : 3,908
    Windows 8 Pro with Media Center/Windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by McRuff View Post
    They never gave the true technical reason, just market speak.

    The True technical reason is that Microsoft has a vision of one interface for all devices. To accomplish that the interface has to work on Celeron Tablets with integrated graphics, while using the least amount of power possible.

    There is no reason they could not have left the Aero theme available for those who wish to use it on Desktop systems, except that a lot of people would do so and they would no longer have their vision of one interface. Same reasoning goes with the removal of the start menu.

    Microsoft stated that Aero was cheesy and outdated. It is nothing of the sort. These are just terms thought up (probably by a PR company) to explain to their customers why the interface on the Windows desktop was downgraded.

    Now, this is odd, because in my Celeron machine, under Vista for which it was designed for, but not really designed for as Vista required at least a Core Duo for proper use, I could never get AERO to work.

    But the moment I installed Windows 7, it worked immediately, despite it being a Celeron with Integrated Graphics. All they had to do was integrate whatever they had done ti Windows 7 to make it work with more machines and upgrade it a little so that it could work for even more older machines by including native support.
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  6. #36


    Quote Originally Posted by Jf1450 View Post
    Lets agree to disagree.
    Ok. I can respect that. We are all individuals with different viewpoints and realities. Mine is certainly not the only one.

    I think the advances were bigger with more impact back in the early days, the 80's and 90's if you will.
    Yes, impact and advantages were greater back in those days. e.g. We have by far more computing power in our cars than the Apollo missions had back in the late 60's early 70's. Memory on our phones that used to take up large-sized rooms.

    I looked at your profile and it's hard to say, but I'll assume we're roughly the same age if you remember computing in the 80"s. I'll also assume that you're either an IT Pro or use a computer professionally. Either way, I can tell you're an advanced user. You can read about me and others here: Personal Computer Related Memories - I Remember: Perhaps you'd like to post your history there, for I'd like to see the thread revived. I think history is quite important, especially for the younger.

    Sure, we're still advancing but to me it's more like putting a different face on the same ole stuff. Somebody develops a new idea for a web site.
    It's still a web site. Processors get faster and faster. How fast is fast enough? Hard drives get bigger. I can't come close to filling what I have now.
    Screen resolution gets better. The displays we have now already look like a quality photograph. I have a first generation iPad. I go to a store and look at
    a 4th gen. What's the big deal?
    One thing I've noticed about we humans; I especially learned this raising my children; We are always seeking to be entertained or finding ways to entertain ourselves. We're enthusiasts here, either as a Pro or novice. We're unique in that we seek the edge of new tech. I agree it's basically the same old stuff with a different face, but don't we all like new things? I think we'd get bored if we didn't. I would anyway. e.g. I'm a builder. Although I like Victorian houses (but wouldn't own one), I'd get bored building them over and over again or even looking at them. There is and always will be always "the modern". Mankind always seeks a better way of doing things.

    We are getting close the the end of Moore's law. Computer architecture will slow down pretty soon, but then look at bio or atomic-scale computing. Will there be an end to computing?

    I guess I'm getting jaded and showing my age.

    -jeff
    Yes, it's hell getting "older".
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #37


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by Jf1450 View Post
    Hard drives get bigger. I can't come close to filling what I have now.
    Create more backups.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #38


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by turbofish View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post

    Keep in mind that this industry moves exponentially quicker nowadays. Releases of new products and concepts change rather quickly. e.g. How often do the new iPhones and iPads with hardware and software get released? Can we say what we buy today is already obsolete? They are already working on the "next model". I think that's true with most products. Yes?
    Interesting that all of your examples are not only tablets and phones but also Apple. Computers have stopped evolving as fast. My desktop machine upstairs is still extremely fast and able to run anything I throw at it although it is over 3 years old (a record for me!). Sure, I bumped it up to 16 GB of ram but it has the same hard drives and video card that I put on it 3 years ago when I built it. I imagine my laptop with also last for my needs for quite a few years as well but it did start out as a beefy machine too (i7,two hard drives and 16 GB of ram). My work machine will also last me years before I would ever get the OK to upgrade it (i7,20 GB ram...)

    My phone would be more like your example. I'm on my third upgrade in 15 months and was thinking about the new Galaxy S4 but I think my wife will have a phone intervention for me before I can do that!

    It also points out a glaring issue that I have with Windows 8. People who defend it the strongest compare it to more of a phone than a laptop/desktop OS. It's not. And Microsoft has mixed up the two far too much. Does windows 2012 server really need the Modern UI just like a phone or an XBOX? Does my desktop really need an airplane mode? When you make a one size fits all OS, you end up alienate everyone and making a product that doesn't fit well in anything.

    Stop using iPhone/iPad examples.
    Should your desktop OS have drivers for mobile GPUs and batteries or wifi cards or touchpads? Or better yet, power modes that most applicable for battery life?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #39


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jf1450 View Post
    Hard drives get bigger. I can't come close to filling what I have now.
    Create more backups.
    Give me a four TB hard drive and I will fill it up within a week guaranteed.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #40


    South Coast NSW, Australia
    Posts : 615
    Windows 8.1 'Ultimate' RTM 64 bit (Pro/WMC).


    I have 5.75TB, and am thinking of getting another 2TB.


    Wenda.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Sorry, bringing back the Start menu won't help Windows 8
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