Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Windows Blue poised to become Windows 8.1

  1. #61


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    In theory, that sentiment may be good, but in practice, it won't work like that. At the end of the day, you'll be paying a lot more than you do now and potentially with some inconvenience. No one provides subscription models because it's for the benefit of the consumer.
    Even if you paid a little more in the end, if you were always up to date on the latest versions and you didn't have to perform upgrades yourself, the slight extra cost could be worth it. Not to mention, the ability to get your data from anywhere, (PC, tablet, phone, car, watch, etc).

    As far as inconvenience goes, I'm already dealing with that. License keys, activation schemes, copy protection mechanisms. Pirates usually work right around that stuff, while those of us who actually plunk down our money deal with the problems.

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  2. #62


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    In theory, that sentiment may be good, but in practice, it won't work like that. At the end of the day, you'll be paying a lot more than you do now and potentially with some inconvenience. No one provides subscription models because it's for the benefit of the consumer.
    Even if you paid a little more in the end, if you were always up to date on the latest versions and you didn't have to perform upgrades yourself, the slight extra cost could be worth it. Not to mention, the ability to get your data from anywhere, (PC, tablet, phone, car, watch, etc).

    As far as inconvenience goes, I'm already dealing with that. License keys, activation schemes, copy protection mechanisms. Pirates usually work right around that stuff, while those of us who actually plunk down our money deal with the problems.
    I theory, but once you go to a subscription model, you tend to get locked in and if prices start to rise, you are loathe to change because you are so committed and so much may be difficult to move. This is especially likely for the average person who doesn't have a lot of IT knowledge. But that's what those who push subscription models hope/know will happen.

    Also, depending on how the model works and what exactly you can load into your device remote, ie away from internet, work may become problematic. Adobe apparently offer a subscription model for Photoshop, where the software resides on Adobe servers, you can't do anything unless you are connected. At least that's how it appears to work. If things go this way, then the Google Chromebook seems like an even better solution for most people. Cheaper devices, always accessible (given internet connection) and everything in one place.

    Personally, I don't have a problem dealing with activation keys etc, I have to deal with them anyway with the multitude of programs that I use, so one or two more are fairly irrelevant. I have 42 of them so far and I doubt many of them will go to a subscription model.
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  3. #63


    Melbourne,FL.
    Posts : 187
    Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center x64

    Here's what else MS need's to fix


    Why can't password manager's work in the Modern version of I.E. ? I can't use A.I. Roboform in it. Why won't safe toolbar's like for various internet security suite's work in it either ? Program's like Xmark's are also unusable in Modern I.E. How about a equalizer, etc. for Xbox Music and Videos ? Where's Task Manager's ability to show the desktop software's history at ? Why doesn't File History automatically backuo the downloads folder ? Why can't Microsoft's own core pre-installed desktop program's and modern app's speak to each other, i/e: setting's, etc. ? P.S. Microsoft the desktop can't truly be killed for another 5-10 year's. Dual-core cpu's have been out since summer 2005. Now 4, 6 and 8-core cpu's are in most desktps, laptops and ultra-books. Of the thousand's of proram's/software currently available, how many utilize these cpu's to their potential ? How many are Modern U.I app's ? How many are Desktop U.I. ?
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  4. #64


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post

    It didn't take up the whole screen.

    For example, does a TV remote control have to be this big:

    Attachment 19648
    YES. . .old guys like me need them that big so we can see them. . .

    Heck, wish they made keyboards much larger. . .
    But the Windows 8 start screen isn't aimed at us old farts, it's aimed at the hip youngsters, the 'now' generation.
    That is because our "expiration date" is near and younger buyers is not....MS needs to find and keep younger buyers to survive.
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  5. #65


    Hafnarfjörður IS
    Posts : 4,376
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10


    Hi there
    The trouble with subscription services is that

    1) you have to (generally) sign some type of automatic payment from a Bank to the service provider ---- I DO NOT WANT TO DO THIS IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM. I'll pay when I want to pay. Once you sign things like "Direct Debit Mandates" you are effectively giving 3rd parties control overt YOUR Bank account - whatever Banks say about "Checks on direct debits" -- if THEY make a mistake with your money it often takes a while to get it rectified -- and even if the Bank offers you compensation - it's of no use if you are stuck in the middle of nowhere with a credit card that doesn't work because the Bank has made an error -- ever tried arguing the toss with someone on a Friday afternoon at those hideous Indian Call centres these Banks use trying to get a mistake fixed. - Banks make more mistakes than you might like to think about.

    2) Once you sign a contract you don't tend to get the best deal -- new deals are coming out all the time --just look at Mobile Phone contracts -- those who sign up first usually get a lousy deal while "New subscribers" get a sweetener.

    3) The subscription invariably needs to be renewed just when you've had to pay out some money for something else - maybe a Car repair etc so it arrives at an inconvenient time.

    4) If you aren't on the internet for say several days after your subscription is due - you could get termination or suspension of service.

    5) If the REMOTE server goes down you are totally hosed.

    6) These companies do NOT introduce a subscription model for nothing --they KNOW it will be much more profitable for them -- for example I'm still using Office 2007 a lot -- 7 years old -- and it STILL works fine -- just imagine the people at Ms "Licking their lips" with saying - subscription -- even a Cheap one --that's 6 YEARS subscriptions they could have been collecting on a student / teacher edition which only costs 65 USD in the first place.

    7) Prices invariably RISE - and if you are dependent on the software you just have to pony up.

    No way am I going to be tied in to this type of stuff.

    Cheers
    jimbo
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #66


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1 View Post
    I don't really fear this. As we move to more device types, it would be nice to have an account rather than a perpetual software license.

    Not too mention, you could add and remove services as you need them. Would be nice when you need something for a few weeks, but don't want to pay for permanent use.
    In theory, that sentiment may be good, but in practice, it won't work like that. At the end of the day, you'll be paying a lot more than you do now and potentially with some inconvenience. No one provides subscription models because it's for the benefit of the consumer.
    You are right. Kind of like cable/satellite TV where you have access to hundreds of channels but rarely or never watch them. We will be paying for MS services we do not want or need.
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  7. #67


    Melbourne,FL.
    Posts : 187
    Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center x64


    I'll never fully do the software as a service. That's exactly why I'm keeping Office 2010 instead of getting Office 2013 or Office 365. I save my stuff where I want it . On my pc, external hard drives and on my secure Carbonite off-site backup. As for internet security, I usually get a newer version on Amazon for cheaper than the companie's renewal fee.
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  8. #68


    Posts : 740
    Windows 8.1


    Quote Originally Posted by brkkab123 View Post
    Why can't password manager's work in the Modern version of I.E. ? I can't use A.I. Roboform in it. Why won't safe toolbar's like for various internet security suite's work in it either ? Program's like Xmark's are also unusable in Modern I.E. How about a equalizer, etc. for Xbox Music and Videos ? Where's Task Manager's ability to show the desktop software's history at ? Why doesn't File History automatically backuo the downloads folder ? Why can't Microsoft's own core pre-installed desktop program's and modern app's speak to each other, i/e: setting's, etc. ? P.S. Microsoft the desktop can't truly be killed for another 5-10 year's. Dual-core cpu's have been out since summer 2005. Now 4, 6 and 8-core cpu's are in most desktps, laptops and ultra-books. Of the thousand's of proram's/software currently available, how many utilize these cpu's to their potential ? How many are Modern U.I app's ? How many are Desktop U.I. ?
    When I'm on my laptop I can better explain, but I can tell you this:
    Modern apps are compartmentilized, which means that windows controls what the app does and can access (and how much it uses). Desktop apps are basically disorganized. Yes, they can just reside in their own folder in C:/Program Files, but that's not enforced. In fact, application componentscan reside anywhere, making it difficult for the os to track what belongs to what.
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  9. #69


    Melbourne,FL.
    Posts : 187
    Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center x64

    Make's sense in a way.


    Some software should be able to work in either u.i. It's not by any mean's all Microsoft's fault. The various software companies are equally at fault. That's exactly why the desktop u.i can't be done away wih. If Microsoft did that too soon, it would put itself out of business real fast. None of their hardware would save them
    Quote Originally Posted by FuturDreamz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by brkkab123 View Post
    Why can't password manager's work in the Modern version of I.E. ? I can't use A.I. Roboform in it. Why won't safe toolbar's like for various internet security suite's work in it either ? Program's like Xmark's are also unusable in Modern I.E. How about a equalizer, etc. for Xbox Music and Videos ? Where's Task Manager's ability to show the desktop software's history at ? Why doesn't File History automatically backuo the downloads folder ? Why can't Microsoft's own core pre-installed desktop program's and modern app's speak to each other, i/e: setting's, etc. ? P.S. Microsoft the desktop can't truly be killed for another 5-10 year's. Dual-core cpu's have been out since summer 2005. Now 4, 6 and 8-core cpu's are in most desktps, laptops and ultra-books. Of the thousand's of proram's/software currently available, how many utilize these cpu's to their potential ? How many are Modern U.I app's ? How many are Desktop U.I. ?
    When I'm on my laptop I can better explain, but I can tell you this:
    Modern apps are compartmentilized, which means that windows controls what the app does and can access (and how much it uses). Desktop apps are basically disorganized. Yes, they can just reside in their own folder in C:/Program Files, but that's not enforced. In fact, application componentscan reside anywhere, making it difficult for the os to track what belongs to what.
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  10. #70


    Hafnarfjörður IS
    Posts : 4,376
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10


    Hi there
    Surely the whole idea of FIXED full screen apps is actually OLD FASHIONED now -- many people also use large TV's as PC monitors - do you really want to run everything as a single full screen app on a whopping 60 inch LCD screen -- might be fine for watching a movie -- but for creating a presentation, running Photoshop with several layers, translating documents etc -- you need to view the applications CONCURRENTLY.

    Also what a waste --say you've got a blazingly fast i7 multicore processor --- what a waste then if you are running a single application in a full screen window.

    Also whoever runs a browser in a single full screen window -- especially without any Menu or toolbars on it.

    In fact a lot of the multi-media content on a PC is getting superfluous anyway in a lot of cases as TV's incorporate smart technology to enable them to be able to get content directly from The Internet or multi-media server drives.

    On laptop PC's viewing multi-media is still OK but increasingly you no longer need a PC for viewing Internet content if you have access to a smart tv.

    I'm looking forward to smart TV's actually incorporating something like Chrome OS in them -- then during the commercial breaks I can view email etc etc -- bet the TV companies will try and find some way of stopping this from happening.

    Cheers
    jimbo
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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