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SSD Woes - still a pain even with the newest OS!


Posts
7
#1
Ok, so the title sounds pretty negative so I'll give a few props first. I built my own win8 pro machine and the install (clean) went pretty flawless and fairly quick, granted the install media was dvd which was much slower than usb which I had used for the "previews". (I am surprised the boxed OS didn't ship on usb3 thumb drives instead but I suppose cd's are more compatible).

Moving on, I decided to donate my old 32g SSD to my wife's PC and performed a clean install on her machine as well (yes, I bought a second copy of win8 pro) and this install went pretty seamless as well. However I realized space with slim and decided to do as I did with the "previews" and moved the following folders using mklink /d from a recovery command prompt (after using robocopy to capture all the data on my secondary drive)

x:> robocopy /copyall /mir /xj x:\Users d:\Users
x:> robocopy /copyall /mir /xj "x:\Program Files" "d:\Program Files"
x:> robocopy /copyall /mir /xj "x:\Program Files (x86)" "d:\Program Files (x86)"

and confirmed none failed

Then deleted the original folders so I can make the symlinks

x:> rmdir /s /q x:\users
x:> rmdir /s /q "x:\Program Files" - first problem, files in use, couldn't delete
x:> rmdir /s /q "x:\Program Files (x86)" - same here

why would these be in use...whats the point of recovery command line if I can't work with the media offline???

So I tried to at least make the symlink for the users folder which did delete but I kept getting an error at the command prompt:

x:> mklink /d x:\Users d:\Users
incorrect function

even junctions...
x:> mklink /j x:\Users d:\Users
incorrect function

A search on the web resulted in nothing for "mklink incorrect function" so I attempted a refresh from recovery which failed twice without any reason given. I then tried to restore which also failed...the funny thing was that it told me that it needed the installation media which was the 64bit dvd and after placing it in the drive it came up with this:

2012-10-27_23-11-55_484.jpg
which is hilarious because this is the very same media I installed from. Ok, so now I am reinstalling clean after a reformat but I am still stuck on moving the c:\users, c:\Program Files, c:\Program Files (x86), and c:\ProgramData.

I've seen a very indepth sysprep tool/xml script method which seems to be written prior to retail (which may still work but I'm skeptical this will go smooth either) as well as an option in the folder properties to change the location which appears to be super easy but does not seem to be built in the version I purchased (what?).

So I am at a loss, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated but another reason for starting this thread is the amazement that there isn't a tool built into the installer that says something like "There is limited hard drive space on the system drive. Would you like assistance in moving your personal or program folders to another drive?"

Wouldn't that seem like a no brainer? Especially with the growing popularity of SSDs?

Oh and lastly, I was a little bummed I couldn't upgrade from RP (I know there is possibly some hack that may work but it requires modifying the install media which you can't do with the retails dvds) - you'd think MS would want to give back to those that beta tested and helped refine their product by making a simple key purchase as an unlocker to the retail version.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

Kebero

New Member
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Posts
354
#2
I'll say what I've said in other threads like this. Leave the user folders alone. If you need space, and have a secondary drive, right-click, drag, and select "move" with the library folders (documents, pictures, etc).
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows Server 2012 Standard w/Hyper-V
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    HP ProBook 4430s
    CPU
    Intel Core i3-2310M
    Memory
    16GB DDR3
    Hard Drives
    80GB Intel 320 SSD
    500GB Samsung Momentus
Posts
7
#3
That doesn't actually solve anything. That's like throwing in the towel. I was hoping to get some responses from some tweaker geeks that like taking on a challenge. This is a real problem and it appears MS has completely missed the boat.

Again, I don't want to move just the folders within the user profile, I want to move all of the root program/user folders that don't need to be on the SSD, the core OS and that's it. I had this working without a hitch on CP and RP but the retail version for some reason has been crippled/changed for some reason because the mklink executions result in "incorrect function" now.

And the answer surely isn't "go buy a larger SSD" either. I have a 256gb on my machine, but surely I don't want to waste this 32gb I purchased a few years ago and it has definitely increased the performance of my wife's pc. I just need to keep the remaining 8 gigs for updates, drivers etc. EVERYTHING else on the 7200 S3 drive!!!

Problems:
1) program files folders still in use and cannot be deleted or moved even in recovery mode (whats the point of recovery???)
2) mklink doesn't work and errors out with an unknown error (did the syntax change in the win8 version?)
3) location tab is only present on certain user profile subfolders (is there e reg tweak to add this to any folder?)
4) restore option (using retail dvd) from recovery is completely broken and seems like a big oversight for an "off the shelves" product
5) There is no easy way in win8 (just as previous OS's) to permanently relocate the users/program files and programdata folders and I suppose I was little too naive in thinking surely this would be addressed in the retail release of this OS...especially since there was so much talk about it in the MS dev channel.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

bbinnard

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Member
Posts
16
#4
I don't have Win8 (so far I've seen no compelling reason to update from Win7-64) but I do have a small (64GB) SSD boot drive and I understand your desire to move stuff off your SSD.

I used a program called JunctionLinkMagic to do that and I've had no problems. Frankly I was unaware of the mklink command or the robocopy program. I made my relocations with a plain copy/paste/delete and then used JunctionLinkMagic to create the links. So far I've not had any problems at all, other than the sometimes confusing situation where a set of files/folders appears to be in one place but is actually in another.

Of course this is exactly the reason for making junction links, so I can't complain.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Win8-64
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    ASUS Zenbook
    CPU
    Intel i5
    Memory
    8GB
Posts
7
#5
I've used that program before (also with my win7/64)...it's basically a gui for the mklink cli and it works very well. Unfortunately it doesn't appear it is an option if I can't boot into a mode in which the folders I want to move, or copy, delete and link are in use.

I know the issue with the mklink and "incorrect function" isn't really the root of the problem for the program files folders but I should have been able to at least move the "Users" folder as others seem to have had success with it...but I'm wondering if any of them have had success with a retail release because I too had used this method on the CP and RP release without issues.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

Mystere

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1,925
#6
You can't just copy your program files folders to another drive. Even if you could solve your problems with locked files, you will run into another problem.

That problem is that most apps have registry entries that point to physical locations on disk. Once installed, and app can't just be copied to other places. This is nothing new with Windows 8, and has always been the case. (some apps don't have such entries and can be copied, but most won't work).

All you can do is uninstall some apps and re-install them to the other drive.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro
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    Intel i7 3770K
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Posts
7
#7
That's not hopeful for windows 8 if that's true because I've junctioned both program folders on win7 Ult 64bit for years without issue.

I've successfully junctioned the following folders (in Win7 and Win8 CP and RP):

c:\Users
c:\ProgramData
c:\Program Files
c:\Program Files (x86)
c:\Windows\winXSX
c:\PerfLogs

Actually, the only issue I have ever had with junctions is with the c:\Windows\winSXS folder which would cause some windows updates to fail, due to hard links, but that's it. One would expect a newer OS to not go back in time but forward.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

Mystere

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#8
Sorry, I had forgotten you were using junctions.

When you said a "Recovery command prompt" what did you mean? How did you start it?

Did you boot from the Windows install disk and do a recovery?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro
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Posts
7
#9
Yep, booted from the same disc I installed from and chose repair your computer and then troubleshoot, advanced options and then command prompt.

I initially tried to make symlinks but then tried junctions as well. I think I'd be satisfied if I could figure out how to get the program file folders completely free from being in use and then also figure out how to get mklink to work without that odd error.
 

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System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

Mystere

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#10
I think the recovery console requires that you log in, which means it has to load the registry. Not sure why that would lock Program Files though. Are you running any apps from there? Is your copy of robocopy in that folder?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro
    CPU
    Intel i7 3770K
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7
#11
It doesn't ask me to login at any prompt when booting off the dvd. I does state that a couple files are in use and I didn't write them down but it had something to do with touch ui probably to support touch enabled devices in the absence of a keyboard but really shouldn't that be in the core rather than program files? Maybe its just poor design or oversight because all the MS dudes have gigantic SSD's and never even thought of even moving those folders =)

p.s. robocopy is built in to the recovery ram drive tools I believe. That's why my c: drive becomes x:
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Professional

WaterMark

New Member
Posts
2
#12
I was getting the "incorrect function" error from mklink but, in a moment of inspired trial and error, got it working.

Assuming that command prompted booted you to X:>, do the robocopy and rmdir commands using X: as the drive letter. But, for the mklink, use C: as the drive letter. i.e.:

x:> mklink /J C:\Users D:\Users

With that tweak it worked perfectly and my entire Users structure is now apparently on C: but actually on my 3TB D:.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7, Windows 8, Windows XP

FuturDreamz

Spacemonaut
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Posts
740
#13
Windows 8 is not designed to be butchered up into little pieces. You can do with with the Previews, but it is unlikely to continue to work on a consistent basis.

If you want to keep using your 32GB SSD, then i suggest you use it as an Intel SRT cache.
 

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pparks1

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#15
I think the title of the thread should be "tiny SSD woes...still a problem". I've always said anything smaller than 60GB just isn't a good idea on a Windows box.

To the original poster, it's too bad that this has been such a challenge. I've not had the displeasure of trying to put home folders anywhere else. These folders are never large on my drives as I have file servers that hold the big stuff.
 

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System One

  • OS
    Windows 7
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pparks1

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#16
I think the title of the thread should be "tiny SSD woes...still a problem". I've always said anything smaller than 60GB just isn't a good idea on a Windows box.

To the original poster, it's too bad that this has been such a challenge. I've not had the displeasure of trying to put home folders anywhere else. These folders are never large on my drives as I have file servers that hold the big stuff. And for stuff like my music, I don't put them in the library locations within my profile, but rather just create a folder on my storage drive called X:\music and point my music player application at this directory. I know that I could add it to my library location...but it's unnecessary.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7
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    Self-Built in July 2009
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    Intel Q9550 2.83Ghz OC'd to 3.40Ghz
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    Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R rev. 1.1, F12 BIOS
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jeffrys

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BELGIUM

Posts
503
#17
Pingram,

i think one should at least have 64 gb for the OS partition on a SSD, but 120 gb is better. And only for the OS.

Jeff

sorry must add: i have SSD's from day one, in the beginning not the best and never had problems with one of them.

Only one OCZ drive died on me, but was replaced by OCZ.
 

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System One

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    WINDOWS 8.1 x64
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Mystere

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#18

My Computer

System One

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    Intel i7 3770K
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    Logitech MX

FuturDreamz

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Posts
740
#19
FuturDreamz, how should we configure Windows 8 to use separate drives for the OS and default data stores?
You can move libraries such as videos and pictures easily. But i consider moving your entire users folder and programs to other drives to be a potential disaster.

I'd recommend Intel RST if you want to use a 30Gb ssd.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1
    Computer type
    Laptop
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    Asus Tansformer Book Flip TP500LN
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    Intel i5-4210U
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rdwray

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301
#20
Can't get a straight answer from google: Why does Robocopy fail to copy some files?
 

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System One

  • OS
    Windows 8 Pro
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    Dell Inspiron 1750
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    Duo Core 2.5 G HZ

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