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Recommend a Win 8 tablet/laptop hybrid for business/web design?

pparks1

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Yeah, but they coat more than 20 cent cds and are becoming increasingly more difficult to find.

On our xps14, I have a speedy corsair usb3 key, however the stupid usb ports are right next to each other in the xps14,.and the corsair key is too wide and blocks the second (and only remaining usb port).

These machines seemed great on paper, but in actuality became a real pain. They only go to execs that travel heavily.
 

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area 66

Banned
..shall I keep going?

I call it ultra portability. I don't think the XPS 13 is a good choice for someone who use it as a Desktop replacement, but if you have a desktop and you are often on the road like me, and you use it only few time this is a real good choice if you don't look at the price tag ( in my case it,S less money I give to the Gov at the end of the years, as it's an expenses. ) Other solution will be tablets ( not enough productive at my taste and too small screen )

Off course in this comment I'm talking about my choice.
 

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ship69

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stefalopod

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stefalopod

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Hi

I am looking for a decent new laptop for business/web design.

I want something that will run full Windows 8 (although to be honest for the first year or so I will probably only use Windows 7 on it until the worst bugs have been fixed!)

I need:
- Form: Latop/tablet hybrid
- Screen Resolution: 1080p (1920 × 1080) (although perhaps 1600pixels wide would do)
- Touch: Pressure sensitive (ideally Wacom, ideally stylus built in)
- Screen: 12.5"+
- RAM: 8GB
- SSD: 256GB
- Processor: Intel (presumably)
- Weight: 1.5Kg (3.3lbs)
- Battery: 6+ hours
- Resume: instant on
- Must run full Win 8 (and Win 7)
Budget: GBP 1200 (absolute max)

RATIONALE
I had my previous laptop for 6 years, and I a professional tool to replace it and not leave me still wanting/needing an iPad/tablet.
1. It will need to run all my windows applications including full msOffice Suite (incl Excel macros etc), Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Xara Designer Pro etc
2. I want to use finger touch AND as a stylus sensitive device so that I can scribble notes (e.g. during a conference).
3. Personally I find that I think more clearly at higher resolutions and will be wearing reading spectacles, so the higher the resolution the better (within reason).
4. Battery must survive at least 6-8 hours so that I can work anywhere.
5. It needs to be convenient and pretty light to carry (1.5kg max)
6. I need decent connections including Ethernet.
7. (Optional: 1080p would be great for watching video in HD...)
8. (Optional: I love the red nipple/pointing stick on my Lenovo)

CD/DVD not necessary.

- Any recommendations? Does such a device actually exist yet?(!)

J


P.S. I was thinking about the Lenovo IdeaPad Yoga 13 hybrid, but the screen is rather low resolution (only 1,600x900)

I've been doing a lot of research into the available windows 8 devices, and it turns out that many of the specs you want (I wanted them too) are apparently incompatible on the market.

For example: I can't find a 1920x1080 machine currently on the market with a 6+ hour battery life that also weighs less than 1.5 kilos.

Just as a sort of crash course,
The higher the resolution, the greater the drain on battery, the larger (heavier) the battery has to be to have a 6+ hour battery life (no battery life available on the surface pro for comparison purposes yet, although maybe it'll crack this nut)

Also, SSD is still currently terribly expensive, not quite exponential, but the cost of larger ssd harddrives increases proportionately to the size of the drive. HD screens are also terribly expensive, so finding a 256 ssd computer in your price range that also has an HD screen is basically impossible, add to that your weight plus battery specifications and you're going to have to look up into the clear blue to find this pie, man.

Finally, some tablet makers are building Wacom digitizers into their machines -- the telltale sign if you can't find it in the specs, is that the machine either comes with digitizer pen or has a one as an availalbe accessory -- if you have any doubts, if the stylus you're looking at costs less than 50 USD, its probably not a digitizer.
Also, wacom meshes add to the bill of material, so if you want one you'll have to adapt to the idea of paying premium to get it.

Lastly, 12.5+ inches seems to be incompatible with ultraportable/premium spec machine you have invisioned.

So here's my best suggestion, based on the job that you do and the specs that you listed.

You need a machine for business/web design, so that says to me that you're going to want to have a keyboard at hand.

There is a 1080 p tablet/laptop hybrid with a wacom mesh (digitizer included), that runs full windows 8 on an intel processor with a 256 ssd and 8 gigs of ram available in under 1.5 kilos (1.3, as it were). And, it has a multi SD card slot. Other pluses include 2 USB3.0 ports, ethernet port, full sized hdmi port and vga port, plus front and rear facing 2.4 mp cameras.

Unfortunately, the screen size is less than 12.5 -- it's 11.6, and the inbuilt battery lasts less than 6 hours (4.75, as it were). Also, you can't store the digitizer pen in the laptop.

Evidently in you can configure the above machine to come in under 1200 GBP, by hobbling it with a core i3 processor.
An extended battery brings up the battery life to 10 hours (and gives you a place to put your digitizer pen), but it also increases weight and cost... oh, and the mechanism to convert from tablet to laptop is pretty horrible looking by anyone's standards. And it has no track pad.

It's the Vaio Duo 11.
 

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ship69

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@Stefalopod

Hm.... there must be something in what you say because all the component parts in what I/we seek do seem to exist but nobody seems to have brought them all together in one device yet.

Re Vaio Duo 11, I'm not sure about that physical design. Your machine hasnt got a trackpad and the trackpoint is alleged to be fiddly. Also it looks difficult to find a comfortable typing position due to the lack of wrist support area. Also, call me old-fashioned, but I like the idea of being able to protect your screen from scratches when you close the thing up. PLUS I dont think I can get any serious work done on any 1080p screen that is smaller than 13in. And if you're going to have a stylus, it MUST have somewhere or it wont be there when you need it (what were the designers thinking?)


Meanwhile, one device I am increasingly attracted to is another Sony who's price has come down lately.

- Screen: 13.1" with resolution:1920 x 1080
- Battery life: Good - 6.5 hours say wired.com (add a sheet battery to get up to 14 hours)
- CPU: Intel dual-core 2.5 GHz Core i5 (*) ("Ivy Bridge" "Standard power" 35w)
- SSD: 256GB
- RAM: 8GB
- Weight: Excellent - 2.58lb (1.17Kg)
- Resume: "Immediate"

Yours for £1,522 on shop.sony.co.uk
(or £1,622 if you want Wireless WAN)
(Quad-core 2.1 GHz Core i7 if you have the money for another £180 - though battery may suffer, no?)

Also fab colour definition, and flexible non-reflective screen.
On the down-side, there is some muttering about the keyboard and trackpad being not brilliant.

It's the 3rd Generation Sony Z (2012) - Model: SVZ1311C5E

Review:
Sony Vaio Z Review (2012) - Notebook Reviews by MobileTechReview

* * *

Out of desperation, I could ALMOST live with that price... but I would immediately feel like a mug because it's not touch sensitve.

Meanwhile I have found another laptop that is cheaper, with (reviewers tell us) excellent usability and rather gorgeous styling, with:
- Screen: 13.3", 1080p IPS with wide viewing angles - GOOD
- Processor: Intel Core i7-3517U - OK ("Ivy Bridge"/"Ultralow power" 17w)
- RAM: only 4GB DDR3 - NOT GOOD
- SSD: 256GB
Cost: £1355 (incl delivery) on Amazon

IMHO, much better looking that the Sony and better keyboard ergonmics - although only 4GB of (non-upgradeable) RAM, could be a problem for me. There is some moaning about light bleed being visible in dim lighting conditions, but it doesn't sound all that bad.

It's the Asus Zenbook Prime UX31A-DB51

Review:
Asus Zenbook Prime UX31A Review - Ultrabook Reviews by MobileTechReview

* * *

BUT: As soon as I buy either of these rather gorgeous machines I shall feel like an idiot. Why? Because neither if these machines have touch and given that I'm planning to hang on to mine for 4 or 5 years, in about 1 year's time when Win8 is stable and the entire known universe is going mobile, tablet, and touch... I will feel like an idiot.

SO I think I shall just have to wait... [DEEP SIGH]

J

P.S. On the horizon
- Asus is rumoured to have a Touch version of the UX31A which sounds promising, although from what I can see they arent planning to let you open it and do a 360 like the Lenovo Yoga (nor twist like the Lenovo Twist)
- Maybe in the next 6 months Lenovo will wake up and smell the coffee and give us a full-caffeine Windows8 device with a 1080p, 13+inch screen, (plus nipple and wacom touchscreen).
 

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stefalopod

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Lol, "Deep Sigh" is right.
I'm totally feeling you on wanting a full caffeine versions. If I needed to buy something now that was more for work/business (assuming less travel than I typically engage in), I'd look for the 13 inch device (with wacom mesh) and just take a little more weight in the bargain -- and possibly a little more expense too -- particularly for a machine that I hope to have last four to five years.

Me, I want a machine to use for the next 18 months, that I can type on on planes or public transit without extending out into the aisle. I want instant on, and I don't want to have to open the lid to get it -- so a face up lcd is ideal for me.

I don't actually believe in the form factor on the Duo 11, but it seems like first gen windows 8 machines are all about either staying uninformed and loving the tablet you just bought, or informing yourself and then compromising on at least some of the specs you want. If I had pre-ordered a yoga, I'd probably be so committed to it by now that I wouldn't even mind it not supporting digitizing pens... much.
 

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ship69

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Out of interest what do you use the Wacom mesh/stylus for mostly?
i.e. Do you need the variable line thickness? Or are you mainly looking for an accurate dead reliable stylus? And the ability not to get confused by contact with your wrist when writing with a stylus? ...Or what?
 

My Computer

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  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro (x64)
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    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
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    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
    Motherboard
    Intel HM76 (?)
    Memory
    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
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    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
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jimbo45

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jimbo, I disagree with a lot of your points.

I've played with touchscreen devices for a long time. I still have my HP TX2000 TabletPC which has a 12.1" screen. It is not too big for touch as you say.

And if the price is in the range of an ultrabook, you'd rather get the ultrabook? That may be the case for you. But for me, I wouldn't say that at all. In fact, the ultrabook definitely would have to be cheaper than a touch device for me to even consider an ultrabook. I like sleek slender laptops. But I don't sacrifice performance for small. I will sacrifice small for touch.

I still have a 17" laptop, and would still take a high powered 17" laptop over a low power sleek ultrabook. I'd take a touchscreen laptop over an ultrabook in nearly every situation.

HI there
I think you misunderstood the point.

It Wasn't the Touch -- it was just that if you start wanting larger screen sizes the portability of the device goes down -- try and use a 17 inch laptop when you are going "Cattle Class" on a long plane trip and the bozo in the seat in front of you wants to lower the back of his seat so it's almost in your face.

I've found 10 / 11 inches about the maximum size for a decent size / portability ratio.
The newer tablets all have HDMI out which gives decent resolution to a large external monitor / projector if you need to use these devices in an office or at home.

Also once you start talking about 1,000 USD then the distinction between powerful Ultrabooks and a tablet gets vanishingly small.

Cheers
jimbo
 

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Coke Robot

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ship69

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Lenovo Windows 8 ThinkPad X1 Carbon Touch
Yes sound interesting and definitely something to keep an eye on... however unless the screen folds completely back on itself like the Lenovo Yoga does I dont think it will be very good as a tablet (esp on crowded spaces when travelling).

Win8 - a problem?
Given that I will want to actually use Windows7 as my main o/s, and only start taking Win8 seriously after about a year or so (in order for MSFT to debug the thing properly), what should we do? Reinstall Windows completely putting Win8 in as the base o/s (perhaps with a virtual machine running Win8) or do the opposite... or what?

J
 

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    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
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    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
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    Intel HM76 (?)
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    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
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    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
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    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
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dirtyvu

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also check out the Sony and Samung devices. very sexy devices. the sony is more of a convertible. the screen slides back and up. I had a lot of fun with the Sony ones. But since you can't dump the keyboard and base, it's heavy for a tablet. but the sliding mechanism feels very solid and the construction feels like quality. the screen was great.

But the ability to dump the keyboard/dock is the reason I love the Samsung ATIV ones. acts just like a laptop when you need it but you can dump everything and have just a tight little tablet. the only semi-tricky thing was getting used to the docking mechanism but you do start to have confidence the more you use it. the ATIV also comes with a small little capacitive stylus. kind of short. it felt like it was around 3 inches long.

The Yoga is very slick as well. But it just seems kind of weird to have the keyboard exposed when you're in tablet mode.
 

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ship69

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Samsung ATIV Pro is getting close to my desired spec, BUT
- Only an 11 inch screen, whereas to do proper work I think you need 13 at least.
- Including keyboard it is already 1.6Kg - I seek 1.5Kg as an absolute max.

I shall almost always take the keyboard for serious use, but all in all I think detachable keyboard is the probably way to go. Also good to see the ATIV has a stylus... but does it fit into the chassis otherwise I simply wont have it when I need it !(capacitative sounds like Wacom - can it do variable line thickness?)
 

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  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro (x64)
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    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
    CPU
    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
    Motherboard
    Intel HM76 (?)
    Memory
    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
    Screen Resolution
    (1920 x 1080)
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    512GB mSATA Samsung (PM841 Series MZMTD512HAGL-00000 mSATA 512GB SATA III MLC Internal SSD)
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dirtyvu

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13" laptop at 1.5kg? wow, you are demanding. it felt light enough for me, especially when undocked.

how many 13" laptops are 1.5kg??? the mac book pro 13" is 2.06 kg.

There's a little slot for the stylus at the bottom of the tablet. I only scribbled some notes so I don't know if there are multiple levels of pressure. I don't know about whether it's Wacom since I didn't check the device manager.
 

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ship69

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Laptops:
Sony VAIO Z Series VPC-Z21M9E -13.1"screen - 1.18Kg
Asus UX31A-R4003V - 13.3" screen - 1.3Kg
Asus Taichi - 13.3in - 1.5Kg
Acer Inspire S7 - 13.3in - 1.3Kg
Thinkpad X1 Carbon Touch - 14" screen - 1.36kg (coming soon)
...
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro (x64)
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
    CPU
    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
    Motherboard
    Intel HM76 (?)
    Memory
    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
    Screen Resolution
    (1920 x 1080)
    Hard Drives
    512GB mSATA Samsung (PM841 Series MZMTD512HAGL-00000 mSATA 512GB SATA III MLC Internal SSD)
    Keyboard
    Logitech MK700
    Mouse
    Logitech M705
    Internet Speed
    4 to 15Mbps
    Browser
    Firefox, MSIE, Chrome, Opera etc
    Antivirus
    AVG Cloudcare

dirtyvu

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none of those are touch screens. let's see what they weigh with a touchscreen. I didn't see a weight for the Carbon Touch. that weight you listed was for the non-touchscreen.
 

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ship69

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none of those are touch screens. let's see what they weigh with a touchscreen. I didn't see a weight for the Carbon Touch. that weight you listed was for the non-touchscreen.

Looks like you are correct about the Carbon Touch.

However the ASUS has not one but *two* screens one of which is touch - and both of which are 1080p. Personally I think it's a daft design because I would want the screen you see when using it as a laptop to also be touchable (probably only occassional uses in practise)... Also detachable keyboard would also be useful occasionally - particularly if very easily done.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro (x64)
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
    CPU
    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
    Motherboard
    Intel HM76 (?)
    Memory
    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
    Screen Resolution
    (1920 x 1080)
    Hard Drives
    512GB mSATA Samsung (PM841 Series MZMTD512HAGL-00000 mSATA 512GB SATA III MLC Internal SSD)
    Keyboard
    Logitech MK700
    Mouse
    Logitech M705
    Internet Speed
    4 to 15Mbps
    Browser
    Firefox, MSIE, Chrome, Opera etc
    Antivirus
    AVG Cloudcare

ship69

Member
Member
> Asus Taichi - 13.3in - 1.5Kg
The Taichi has not one, but TWO 13" screens one of which is touch. Btw, I think having 2 screens is insane, but it shows what can be done for the weight.

I missed the Lenovo Yoga which has touch, a 13.3" screen and weights just under 1.5Kg. Sadly the screen is only 1,600x900 so it wont be able to play 1080p videos sharply... Nor does it have a stylus attached.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro (x64)
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP740U3E-S04UK (Series 7 Ultra Notebook)
    CPU
    Intel Core i5 - 3337U
    Motherboard
    Intel HM76 (?)
    Memory
    6GB DDR3 System Memory at 1600MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8570M graphics card with 1GB gDDR3 Graphic Memory (PowerExpress)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" SuperBright+ 350nit FHD LED Display with Touch Screeen Panel
    Screen Resolution
    (1920 x 1080)
    Hard Drives
    512GB mSATA Samsung (PM841 Series MZMTD512HAGL-00000 mSATA 512GB SATA III MLC Internal SSD)
    Keyboard
    Logitech MK700
    Mouse
    Logitech M705
    Internet Speed
    4 to 15Mbps
    Browser
    Firefox, MSIE, Chrome, Opera etc
    Antivirus
    AVG Cloudcare

jimbo45

New Member
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Samsung ATIV Pro is getting close to my desired spec, BUT
- Only an 11 inch screen, whereas to do proper work I think you need 13 at least.
- Including keyboard it is already 1.6Kg - I seek 1.5Kg as an absolute max.

I shall almost always take the keyboard for serious use, but all in all I think detachable keyboard is the probably way to go. Also good to see the ATIV has a stylus... but does it fit into the chassis otherwise I simply wont have it when I need it !(capacitative sounds like Wacom - can it do variable line thickness?)


Hi there
at a REDICULOUS price of over 1200 EUR / 1000 GBP (inc tax) or about 1400 USD (Inc the keyboard) why on EARTH would I bother with one of these when I can get a small laptop with a better spec and having more connectivity to all sorts of peripherals for just over ONE THIRD of the price. What am I missing here.

Samsung ATIV Smart Pro Tablet PC with Clamshell Keyboard / Intel Core i5-3317UM / 11.6" LED / 4GB / 64GB / Windows 8 Professional / Free 5 Year Warranty / Free 5 Year Warranty - www.misco.co.uk

cheers
jimbo
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Monitor(s) Displays
    1 X LG 40 inch TV
    Hard Drives
    SSD's * 3 (Samsung 840 series) 250 GB
    2 X 3 TB sata
    5 X 1 TB sata
    Internet Speed
    0.12 GB/s (120Mb/s)

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