I am a PC, not a tablet

[ilovewindows8]

Metro doesn't bother me one bit. I like it, in fact.

 

[HPDeskjet]

Metro doesn't bother me one bit. I like it, in fact.

And once you have to start paying for every single worthwhile app I'm sure you'll like it even more.

 

[ilovewindows8]

Metro doesn't bother me one bit. I like it, in fact.

And once you have to start paying for every single worthwhile app I'm sure you'll like it even more.

Who said I was going to have to buy apps?

 

[HPDeskjet]

Metro doesn't bother me one bit. I like it, in fact.

And once you have to start paying for every single worthwhile app I'm sure you'll like it even more.

Who said I was going to have to buy apps?

That's the whole point of Metro. Just like Apple's iOS, you'll soon have to buy the best apps via the Marketplace. It's meant to turn the operating system in to a cash cow for Microsoft, just as the App Store has become for Apple. If you think otherwise then you're living in a dream world I'm afraid.

 

[Coke Robot]

Wow.....

First off, vista shouldn't be mentioned and Windows Phone shouldn't even be in that sentence either. Windows Phone is a great product and has receive stellar critic reviews and a vast majority of people that have one would recommend it. That is highly short sighted of one to say Windows Phone is a disaster considering the phone market is totally different than the PC one. Microsoft is trying to make it into that market faced with cell carriers more interested in selling cheap crapdroid phones than quality ones. That my friend, is the truth.

Secondly, Windows 8 isn't for everyone. It's for the people that want better form factor choices than just a desktop. Have you seen what a best buy looks like now? It's filled with laptops to the brim. No one buys desktops as much as they used to because given the option, people choose what's better to them: be mobile and not have to hassle with cables or stay in one place and deal with cords. You might think that just because there are cables, that isn't the reason why it turns people off because it actually does.

Even then, I've been using Windows 8 since last September on my desktop and I have no problems with it other than overly large text that has been fixed since then. One should look into customization and personalization and learn how to use a new UI to suit their work flow. I personally don't spend a lot of time in metro apps, since I use the Desktop. I only use a few metro apps and metro IE. There's a reason why Microsoft is calling Windows 8 "Windows Reimagined." It's not because it's Windows 7 but faster, it's a whole new break from what the evolution of Windows has been. No longer is a new OS a simple warmed over version from the past, but a whole change that doesn't even look or act as the one before.

Besides, just because someone's a PC doesn't mean it's a desktop. Just like the people that use Windows, form factors vary. A PC can be desktop. A PC can be an ultrabook, netbook, notebook, or a laptop. A PC can be tablet or a slate or an All In One PC or an AIO with a touch screen. Though those varied form factors, the one thing that unites them all is Windows.

 

[ilovewindows8]

And once you have to start paying for every single worthwhile app I'm sure you'll like it even more.

Who said I was going to have to buy apps?

That's the whole point of Metro. Just like Apple's iOS, you'll soon have to buy the best apps via the Marketplace. It's meant to turn the operating system in to a cash cow for Microsoft, just as the App Store has become for Apple. If you think otherwise then you're living in a dream world I'm afraid.

And where exactly did I state that I use Metro?

 

[HPDeskjet]

Wow.....

First off, vista shouldn't be mentioned and Windows Phone shouldn't even be in that sentence either. Windows Phone is a great product and has receive stellar critic reviews and a vast majority of people that have one would recommend it. That is highly short sighted of one to say Windows Phone is a disaster considering the phone market is totally different than the PC one. Microsoft is trying to make it into that market faced with cell carriers more interested in selling cheap crapdroid phones than quality ones. That my friend, is the truth.

Secondly, Windows 8 isn't for everyone. It's for the people that want better form factor choices than just a desktop. Have you seen what a best buy looks like now? It's filled with laptops to the brim. No one buys desktops as much as they used to because given the option, people choose what's better to them: be mobile and not have to hassle with cables or stay in one place and deal with cords. You might think that just because there are cables, that isn't the reason why it turns people off because it actually does.

Even then, I've been using Windows 8 since last September on my desktop and I have no problems with it other than overly large text that has been fixed since then. One should look into customization and personalization and learn how to use a new UI to suit their work flow. I personally don't spend a lot of time in metro apps, since I use the Desktop. I only use a few metro apps and metro IE. There's a reason why Microsoft is calling Windows 8 "Windows Reimagined." It's not because it's Windows 7 but faster, it's a whole new break from what the evolution of Windows has been. No longer is a new OS a simple warmed over version from the past, but a whole change that doesn't even look or act as the one before.

Besides, just because someone's a PC doesn't mean it's a desktop. Just like the people that use Windows, form factors vary. A PC can be desktop. A PC can be an ultrabook, netbook, notebook, or a laptop. A PC can be tablet or a slate or an All In One PC or an AIO with a touch screen. Though those varied form factors, the one thing that unites them all is Windows.

Windows Phone is a great product, I even have an HTC Radar. The problem is that your average consumer is not interested in it. It is not a good seller. We can sing it's praises here but that's what it comes down to. It is not selling in any way near the way it was expected to. It is not available on the handsets people want to own and its got a bad name for itself in the marketplace. That's not to say that it's bad name is in any way justified, that's just how it is I'm afraid. Windows Phone does not sell in great numbers.

As for cables and desktops, that problem was solved years ago with bluetooth, wireless and wi-fi. No need for lots of cables if you run a desktop PC these days. Like many others, I use a laptop for its portability, a desktop because I like having a large monitor when working on certain projects and a tablet for minor playtime activities, such as the odd e-mail check and You Tube film. I can't do any real work on a tablet, without a physical keyboard and real programmes designed to do actual work on I consider tablets playtime devices at this point.

Trying to combine the desktop and tablet experience in to one operating system has, as far as I'm concerned, not been a success. In order to make it work to most peoples satisfaction it still needs a lot of work.

 

[Coke Robot]

Wow.....

First off, vista shouldn't be mentioned and Windows Phone shouldn't even be in that sentence either. Windows Phone is a great product and has receive stellar critic reviews and a vast majority of people that have one would recommend it. That is highly short sighted of one to say Windows Phone is a disaster considering the phone market is totally different than the PC one. Microsoft is trying to make it into that market faced with cell carriers more interested in selling cheap crapdroid phones than quality ones. That my friend, is the truth.

Secondly, Windows 8 isn't for everyone. It's for the people that want better form factor choices than just a desktop. Have you seen what a best buy looks like now? It's filled with laptops to the brim. No one buys desktops as much as they used to because given the option, people choose what's better to them: be mobile and not have to hassle with cables or stay in one place and deal with cords. You might think that just because there are cables, that isn't the reason why it turns people off because it actually does.

Even then, I've been using Windows 8 since last September on my desktop and I have no problems with it other than overly large text that has been fixed since then. One should look into customization and personalization and learn how to use a new UI to suit their work flow. I personally don't spend a lot of time in metro apps, since I use the Desktop. I only use a few metro apps and metro IE. There's a reason why Microsoft is calling Windows 8 "Windows Reimagined." It's not because it's Windows 7 but faster, it's a whole new break from what the evolution of Windows has been. No longer is a new OS a simple warmed over version from the past, but a whole change that doesn't even look or act as the one before.

Besides, just because someone's a PC doesn't mean it's a desktop. Just like the people that use Windows, form factors vary. A PC can be desktop. A PC can be an ultrabook, netbook, notebook, or a laptop. A PC can be tablet or a slate or an All In One PC or an AIO with a touch screen. Though those varied form factors, the one thing that unites them all is Windows.

Windows Phone is a great product, I even have an HTC Radar. The problem is that your average consumer is not interested in it. It is not a good seller. We can sing it's praises here but that's what it comes down to. It is not selling in any way near the way it was expected to. It is not available on the handsets people want to own and its got a bad name for itself in the marketplace. That's not to say that it's bad name is in any way justified, that's just how it is I'm afraid. Windows Phone does not sell in great numbers.

As for cables and desktops, that problem was solved years ago with bluetooth, wireless and wi-fi. No need for lots of cables if you run a desktop PC these days. Like many others, I use a laptop for its portability, a desktop because I like having a large monitor when working on certain projects and a tablet for minor playtime activities, such as the odd e-mail check and You Tube film. I can't do any real work on a tablet, without a physical keyboard and real programmes designed to do actual work on I consider tablets playtime devices at this point.

Trying to combine the desktop and tablet experience in to one operating system has, as far as I'm concerned, not been a success. In order to make it work to most peoples satisfaction it still needs a lot of work.

Awesome! I have a Nokia Lumia 900! I don't think it's just that the average consumer doesn't care, it's that the average consumer doesn't know much and cell carriers take advantage of that. Seriously, walk into your local Verzion store ask about the Windows Phone. Either a) they'll look at you weird and ask what that is or b) they're COMPLETELY uninformed about it. I went with a friend a couple months ago and the lady there said that one of the reasons why Windows Phone is bad is because there are only 4,000 apps for it. There are over 80,000. Not only that, go to T-Mobile, and their Windows Phones aren't even displayed or the floor models aren't in working condition. Go to sprint, the same. But ATT is the only provider that will sell you a Windows Phone because they need a new flagship phone since the iphone isn't exclusive to them anymore. It all comes down to money for the providers. If you have a mid range android device that costs less to subsidize and the provider can sell not only talk and text, but a pricy data plan; that there is their cash cow. An iphone is their expensive cash cow because it's the latest fashion accessory that is constantly connected but perpetually disconnected.

As for the wire-free desktop, how many desktop models out there that are price effective that have wireless input? The vast majority of desktop systems sold are wired systems. I, personally, am a strong believer in the power of the desktop. If someone asks me what is best for power, I always answer a desktop. But many want portability because I am always asked, "What is the best laptop?" Or, "Can you help me pick a laptop?" It's the form factor of the times. The desktop days of the decade past is ending where this desktop from Dell is faster than HP's. It's now, this laptop from HP has better battery life and speed than this laptop from Dell and vice versa. It's a new stage of innovation and design from the shell of the laptop to the chip. The desktop doesn't really provide that anymore, other than the AIO form factor. That has more play to it.

See, that's the great thing about Windows 8. Before, you had to compromise touch portability and power and work. It was either a laptop or an ipad for some reason. A laptop is great for work, but lacks touch and the popular apps that people are into now. It also doesn't have the best battery life. But an ipad doesn't even cut it for work but is better suited for simpleton entertainment. With a slate (an AMD or Intel powered tablet), that compromise is gone. You can have the apps people are into, while having the Desktop stage for work, and also use it for not only simpleton entertainment, but some serious entertainment like Media Center for some, or Xbox Live for having your Xbox and PC connect to each other better, or for DirectX powered games that the ipad will never have. It can do all that, while using the inputs of touch, gesture, mouse and/or keyboard to suit your needs. It's the perfect hybrid. And since Windows 8 will command the tablet market and tech, innovation will spur like no other. Windows 8 isn't even out and Intel and AMD and NVIDIA are working hard perfecting power efficiency and processing power into their chips to be used in tablets and slates. It's much like a decade ago where that trio was working hard trying to achieve the highest clock speed and chip performance. Now, it's gone mobile with a touch screen and everything else will follow.

 

[BillWindows]

@coke robot, I think you and I are the only ones who can see the future of computing on Windows 8.

Well, besides Microsoft that is.

 

[legacy7955]

I think the conclusion that even the M$ fanbois are admitting to is that to survive they need the cash from the apps they will sell through Windows 8 Metro.....so why doesn't MS just admit this publically, and also offer a version of Windows 8 with the default UI as the desktop for a higher price than the Metro based version?

Considering that many folks will NOT pay a red cent for ANY metro apps, this would be something significant to consider, I for one would be willing to pay more LESS in this case.

It cannot be cannot be said enough, MS is DESTROYING the loyality of nearly their entire desktop customer base. This is a fact.


I used to be very supportive of MS because I believed that they were the more benevolent major OS company around, with Apple and Jobs being a capitalist robber baron in the most insidious way. I also continually have praised them in their continuing to support the much loved but now very outdated Windows XP, this probably cost them money but it solidified the loyality of its users and MS could have been sure that when they purchased their new OS it would be a Windows product because of the long lasting support they had.

I hate to break it to you fanbois but MS is throwing customer loyality all away, which is invaluable.

MS had been the cool, reasoned, pragmatic option in operating systems that yes did try to please everybody and often times did just that.

Of course I will NEVER EVER purchased that damned fruit company OSX, but MS is forcing my hand with their sudden arrogance and will absolutely lose many loyalists to Linux, and yes even some to freaking Apple OSX.

 

[BillWindows]

I think the conclusion that even the M$ fanbois are admitting to is that to survive they need the cash from the apps they will sell through Windows 8 Metro.....so why doesn't MS just admit this publically, and also offer a version of Windows 8 with the default UI as the desktop for a higher price than the Metro based version?

Considering that many folks will NOT pay a red cent for ANY metro apps, this would be something significant to consider, I for one would be willing to pay more LESS in this case.

It cannot be cannot be said enough, MS is DESTROYING the loyality of nearly their entire desktop customer base. This is a fact.


I used to be very supportive of MS because I believed that they were the more benevolent major OS company around, with Apple and Jobs being a capitalist robber baron in the most insidious way. I also continually have praised them in their continuing to support the much loved but now very outdated Windows XP, this probably cost them money but it solidified the loyality of its users and MS could have been sure that when they purchased their new OS it would be a Windows product because of the long lasting support they had.

I hate to break it to you fanbois but MS is throwing customer loyality all away, which is invaluable.

MS had been the cool, reasoned, pragmatic option in operating systems that yes did try to please everybody and often times did just that.

Of course I will NEVER EVER purchased that damned fruit company OSX, but MS is forcing my hand with their sudden arrogance and will absolutely lose many loyalists to Linux, and yes even some to freaking Apple OSX.

Look Legacy, have a real good look at the computing world, have a look at Google and Apple and Microsoft, look at the phones and the tablets. Look at phones and tablets as little computers, have a look at the market share of all these companies and their devices.
When you've done that, come and tell me what else Microsoft could possibly do in the face of whats coming.

 

[Coke Robot]

@coke robot, I think you and I are the only ones who can see the future of computing on Windows 8.

Well, besides Microsoft that is.

It sure seems that way....

 

[Kat]

They could do what we've been telling them (and you) for the last six months or more.

Simply give us the option to turn Metro AND the Start Button/Menu on or off.

How hard can that be to do? OR understand?

 

[Coke Robot]

I think the conclusion that even the M$ fanbois are admitting to is that to survive they need the cash from the apps they will sell through Windows 8 Metro.....so why doesn't MS just admit this publically, and also offer a version of Windows 8 with the default UI as the desktop for a higher price than the Metro based version?

Considering that many folks will NOT pay a red cent for ANY metro apps, this would be something significant to consider, I for one would be willing to pay more LESS in this case.

It cannot be cannot be said enough, MS is DESTROYING the loyality of nearly their entire desktop customer base. This is a fact.


I used to be very supportive of MS because I believed that they were the more benevolent major OS company around, with Apple and Jobs being a capitalist robber baron in the most insidious way. I also continually have praised them in their continuing to support the much loved but now very outdated Windows XP, this probably cost them money but it solidified the loyality of its users and MS could have been sure that when they purchased their new OS it would be a Windows product because of the long lasting support they had.

I hate to break it to you fanbois but MS is throwing customer loyality all away, which is invaluable.

MS had been the cool, reasoned, pragmatic option in operating systems that yes did try to please everybody and often times did just that.

Of course I will NEVER EVER purchased that damned fruit company OSX, but MS is forcing my hand with their sudden arrogance and will absolutely lose many loyalists to Linux, and yes even some to freaking Apple OSX.

Now, to say that NO ONE would ever pay for an app, that's hilarious! What do you think apple did in 2008? The app store. Everyone pays a red cent and then some for apps. Just like people pay many red cents for Office software. I don't know if you realize, but Microsoft is the best capitalistic enterprises out there. A lot of what they do, a lot of what every tech enterprise does is make money. I'd say the main customer loyalty they might lose are the hard core people out there that don't want any molestation to their Desktop by the company that codes it unless. It's becoming a tiring argument....

 

[Coke Robot]

They could do what we've been telling them (and you) for the last six months or more.

Simply give us the option to turn Metro AND the Start Button/Menu on or off.

How hard can that be to do? OR understand?

Why?

 

[mcnulty]

They could do what we've been telling them (and you) for the last six months or more.Simply give us the option to turn Metro AND the Start Button/Menu on or off.How hard can that be to do? OR understand?

Microsoft wants everyone developing Metro applications. They want to capture the tablet market and they're doing whatever they think it's necessary to accomplish that, desktop users be damned. Do they care so much if we, disappointed traditional desktop users stick with Windows 7 or even some go to Mac/Linux/BSD/whatever? That's the point of view you need to understand what they're thinking.

 

[alphanumeric]

@ Coke Robot + BillWindows,

1. > How many Metro Apps can you open at the same time on the same monitor?
2. > How many Metro Apps can you open at the same time on multiple monitors?

For me with two 1280 by 1024 LCD screens the answer is 1 and 1

3. > How many Desktop Apps can you open at the same time on the same monitor?
4. > How many Desktop Apps can you open at the same time on multiple monitors?

For me I can easily view 2 programs on each monitor at the same time. I can also "easily" cycle though a lot more.

 

[HPDeskjet]

@coke robot, I think you and I are the only ones who can see the future of computing on Windows 8.

Well, besides Microsoft that is.

I wouldn't be be too sure about that. Most people seem to be simply complaining about not being able to turn off Metro whilst in desktop mode. They are not talking about getting rid of Metro, it's just a question of choice, the choice to disable Metro if they so wish. The problem MS has is that they let us as testers know it was possible in the Developer Preview. Since taking the choice away many people now seem to have decided that they do want the option to enable/ disable Metro back. Asking for it back does not make them anti-Windows 8.

I, like most, have always stated that what's been done with Windows 8 under the bonnet is very worthwhile. It's fast, responsive and generally works very well. It's not the operating system per se that I have a problem with, it's things like the removal of the choice to switch Metro off and on, the ability to choose how folders and files are displayed [we now have 2 options instead of the 8 we have in Windows 7, multitasking Windows 8: Thrown into a multi-tasking mosh pit ? The Register etc.. Dumbing down the whole UI for those who only use the operating system for checking a few E-mails and play a few games is bizarre.

 

[severedsolo]

I, like most, have always stated that what's been done with Windows 8 under the bonnet is very worthwhile. It's fast, responsive and generally works very well. It's not the operating system per se that I have a problem with, it's things like the removal of the choice to switch Metro off and on, the ability to choose how folders and files are displayed [we now have 2 options instead of the 8 we have in Windows 7, multitasking Windows 8: Thrown into a multi-tasking mosh pit ? The Register etc.. Dumbing down the whole UI for those who only use the operating system for checking a few E-mails and play a few games is bizarre.

While I agree with you, Microsofts problem is, that from an "average consumer" point of view, they can't actually get rid of Metro, or give you an option to turn it off.

Why? Because on the face of things at least, 8 is just 7 with a stupid start menu, you take that away, and what you are left with is Windows 7 minus Aero. Now I, and probably just about everyone else on here, knows that there have been a lot of under the hood tweaks, and it runs beautifully, dare I say it better than 7, but the average consumer won't see that, they will just see Windows 7, and go "WEll why should I pay x amount for that, when I can get 7 for this smaller amount" (as 7 will no longer be the flagship product it will be cheaper). They have almost shot themselves in the foot, in a weird sort of way, 7 was almost too successful.

As for the Vista analogy, I see where you are coming from. There was nothing really wrong with Vista, it just got a bad reputation, I can certainly see 8 going the same way, if Microsoft aren't careful.

Just one thing I must say in 8's defence though, I've been quite vocal in the past about how poor the Desktop interface is, they have taken big steps to alleviate this in the release preview. It no longer feels like I'm playing "Hunt the pixel" which is appreciated.

Just one suggestion though Microsoft... why not let the "touch gestures" be used by a mouse as well, have Windows register holding the left mouse button down and doing the gesture, the same as doing it with your finger. For example swiping in the charms bar.

They could do what we've been telling them (and you) for the last six months or more.

Simply give us the option to turn Metro AND the Start Button/Menu on or off.

How hard can that be to do? OR understand?

Why?

Why not? Microsoft are not Apple. I am a Microsoft customer for a reason... Microsoft have always been pro choice (as long as you don't interfere with their Intellectual Property). That's why I like them, and its why I don't buy Apple.

 

[ilovewindows8]

@coke robot, I think you and I are the only ones who can see the future of computing on Windows 8.

Well, besides Microsoft that is.

Hey, you forgot me.