Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Windows 8.1 and Surface Pro

  1. #61


    Posts : 5,592
    ME, XP,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win8.1


    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post

    If make the USB Recovery Drive
    Recovery Drive - Create with USB Flash Drive in Windows 8

    & than
    1) Delete the Recovery Partition.

    2) Wipe the HDD.

    3) Add drive letter to the Recovery Partition.

    The USB Recovery Drive will be unusable.
    Apologies for what's probably a dumb observation... but if I was in the following scenario:

    1. Make a USB Recovery Drive

    2. Suffer complete HDD failure at some future date

    3. Replace HDD with a new blank one

    ... then I would hope the USB Recovery Disk would be what I could use to recover the computer, as that's exactly the sort of scenario when I'd expect it to be the recovery method.

    What's the step in the first scenario that makes the USB unusable, and how is it different from my scenario?
    If you use the OEM version of
    Recovery Drive - Create with USB Flash Drive in Windows 8
    warning   Warning
    Deleting the Recovery Partition is NOT RECOMMENDED


    The OEM manufacturer's USB Recovery drive, only overwrites the OEM manufacturer's install.


    If you Replace HDD with a new blank one.

    You need to use the Windows system image. (or 3rd Party)

    System Image - Create in Windows 8

    or
    You can order the Microsoft official OEM Recovery disks from the OEM manufacturer's website.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #62


    Posts : 5,592
    ME, XP,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win8.1


    Quote Originally Posted by benko View Post
    Ok, than no worries

    When I want to create bootable USB with Rufus for Surface Pro, I need to select GPT partions scheme for UEFI and FAT32(or NTFS?) format?
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    I use the Windows 7 DVD Download tool to make my USB thumb drive install media. That tool formats them in NTFS.
    Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #63


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by benko View Post
    Ok, than no worries

    When I want to create bootable USB with Rufus for Surface Pro, I need to select GPT partions scheme for UEFI and FAT32(or NTFS?) format?
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    I use the Windows 7 DVD Download tool to make my USB thumb drive install media. That tool formats them in NTFS.
    Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI.
    I have no problem installing in UEFI with my thumb drives formatted in NTFS.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #64


    Thanks for all helps guys !
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #65


    Posts : 5,592
    ME, XP,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win8.1


    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by benko View Post
    Ok, than no worries

    When I want to create bootable USB with Rufus for Surface Pro, I need to select GPT partions scheme for UEFI and FAT32(or NTFS?) format?
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    I use the Windows 7 DVD Download tool to make my USB thumb drive install media. That tool formats them in NTFS.
    Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI.
    I have no problem installing in UEFI with my thumb drives formatted in NTFS.
    Just one quote, but 100's more on the net. (Windows, Linux, Mac.)

    Prepare an usb thumb drive, to boot windows 7 or 8... - Lenovo Community


    Quote Originally Posted by LENOVO
    4. Using windows format the usb again in FAT32. Windows 7 USB/DVD Download tool, formats it in NTFS. We need a FAT32 formatted disk to achieve our goal. Formating again the USB in FAT32 will not touch the MBR of the USB thumbdrive. And after copying back the files (see step 6) the USB will still be bootable. (nice, and simple, isn't it?)
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #66


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post



    Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI.
    I have no problem installing in UEFI with my thumb drives formatted in NTFS.
    Just one quote, but 100's more on the net. (Windows, Linux, Mac.)

    Prepare an usb thumb drive, to boot windows 7 or 8... - Lenovo Community


    Quote Originally Posted by LENOVO
    4. Using windows format the usb again in FAT32. Windows 7 USB/DVD Download tool, formats it in NTFS. We need a FAT32 formatted disk to achieve our goal. Formating again the USB in FAT32 will not touch the MBR of the USB thumbdrive. And after copying back the files (see step 6) the USB will still be bootable. (nice, and simple, isn't it?)
    Hey, that's fine, obviously for some PC's it has to be fat32, or you have to use fat32 if you are following that particular procedure. All I'm saying is that's not a hard and fast rule for every PC. The statement "Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI" is incorrect. The USB thumb drives I install Windows 8 from were created with the Windows 7 DVD Download Tool and work just fine for installing with UEFI. They are NTFS formatted and bootable. Just my 2 cents.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #67


    Posts : 5,592
    ME, XP,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win8.1


    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post

    I have no problem installing in UEFI with my thumb drives formatted in NTFS.
    Just one quote, but 100's more on the net. (Windows, Linux, Mac.)

    Prepare an usb thumb drive, to boot windows 7 or 8... - Lenovo Community


    Quote Originally Posted by LENOVO
    4. Using windows format the usb again in FAT32. Windows 7 USB/DVD Download tool, formats it in NTFS. We need a FAT32 formatted disk to achieve our goal. Formating again the USB in FAT32 will not touch the MBR of the USB thumbdrive. And after copying back the files (see step 6) the USB will still be bootable. (nice, and simple, isn't it?)
    Hey, that's fine, obviously for some PC's it has to be fat32, or you have to use fat32 if you are following that particular procedure. All I'm saying is that's not a hard and fast rule for every PC. The statement "Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI" is incorrect. The USB thumb drives I install Windows 8 from were created with the Windows 7 DVD Download Tool and work just fine for installing with UEFI. They are NTFS formatted and bootable. Just my 2 cents.
    Unified Extensible Firmware Interface - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Booting

    The UEFI specification defines a "boot manager", a firmware policy engine that is in charge of loading the OS loader and all necessary drivers. The boot configuration is controlled by a set of global NVRAM variables, including boot variables that indicate the paths to the loaders.

    OS loaders are a class of UEFI applications. As such, they are stored as files on a file system that can be accessed by the firmware. Supported file systems include FAT32, FAT16 and FAT12. Supported partition table schemes include MBR and GPT. UEFI does not rely on a boot sector.

    Boot loaders can also be auto-detected by firmware, to enable booting on removable devices. Auto-detection relies on a standardized file path to the OS loader, depending on the actual architecture to boot (\EFI\BOOT\BOOT[architecture name].EFI, e.g. \EFI\BOOT\BOOTx64.EFI).

    It is common for UEFI firmware to include a user interface to the boot manager, to allow the user to select and load the operating system among the possible options.

    https://help.ubuntu.com/community/In...n/FromUSBStick

    6.The bootable partition should be formatted as either a FAT16 or FAT32 filesystem. This is the default for most USB flash drives.

    Sale your Tutorial to
    UEFI - Home
    you get more then 2 cents.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #68


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post

    Just one quote, but 100's more on the net. (Windows, Linux, Mac.)

    Prepare an usb thumb drive, to boot windows 7 or 8... - Lenovo Community

    Hey, that's fine, obviously for some PC's it has to be fat32, or you have to use fat32 if you are following that particular procedure. All I'm saying is that's not a hard and fast rule for every PC. The statement "Use FAT32 as NTFS can only install Legacy, FAT32 can install in Legacy & UEFI" is incorrect. The USB thumb drives I install Windows 8 from were created with the Windows 7 DVD Download Tool and work just fine for installing with UEFI. They are NTFS formatted and bootable. Just my 2 cents.
    Unified Extensible Firmware Interface - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Booting

    The UEFI specification defines a "boot manager", a firmware policy engine that is in charge of loading the OS loader and all necessary drivers. The boot configuration is controlled by a set of global NVRAM variables, including boot variables that indicate the paths to the loaders.

    OS loaders are a class of UEFI applications. As such, they are stored as files on a file system that can be accessed by the firmware. Supported file systems include FAT32, FAT16 and FAT12. Supported partition table schemes include MBR and GPT. UEFI does not rely on a boot sector.

    Boot loaders can also be auto-detected by firmware, to enable booting on removable devices. Auto-detection relies on a standardized file path to the OS loader, depending on the actual architecture to boot (\EFI\BOOT\BOOT[architecture name].EFI, e.g. \EFI\BOOT\BOOTx64.EFI).

    It is common for UEFI firmware to include a user interface to the boot manager, to allow the user to select and load the operating system among the possible options.

    https://help.ubuntu.com/community/In...n/FromUSBStick

    6.The bootable partition should be formatted as either a FAT16 or FAT32 filesystem. This is the default for most USB flash drives.

    Sale your Tutorial to
    UEFI - Home
    you get more then 2 cents.
    Well it would seem that some of that info is out of date. I have installed Windows 8 in UEFI mode from an NTFS formatted USB thumb drive. The EFI partition is there on my hard drive and the boot to UEFI Firmware Settings option is there in Advanced Options. If you don't want to believe then don't believe me. I'm not making this up. Maybe it has something to do with the way ASUS updated the BIOS on my laptop to add UEFI support. It doesn't look any different to any other BIOS I've used and has pretty limited options. I do believe this laptop, ASUS K75DE, was at one time offered with Windows 7 and a non UEFI BIOS.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #69


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by benko View Post
    Thanks for all helps guys !
    No problem, sorry for dragging this thread a bit off topic. I'm done with the UEFI discussion as its going nowhere. Do post back with how things go if you don't mind.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #70


    Just a quick note, NTFS is not possible with GPT partition scheme for UEFI, Rufus refuses to make those settings. It is only possible with MBR partition scheme for UEFI/BIOS.

    Will report how installation passed, will do it in a few days.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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