Working Antivirus for Win8

[jimbo45]

Hi there
at least you know what you are doing and as you wipe an infected machine you have also more or less agreed that using AV software to disinfect a machine is a total waste of time.

Actually an even nastier tactic than malware are these SNEAKWARE sites such as DRIVERMAX -- you know those sites that say FREE driver search or free computer scan -- and when the program has done its stuff it tells you that you have to PAY/ REGISTER or SUBSCRIBE in order to use anything useful that you want to do such as obtain the driver or registry cleaner or whatever.

None of these sites contain any malware so no AV virus will dectect anything amiss -- but by suckering people into PAYING and REGISTERING these horrible sites have actually earned far more money than by employing people to write viruses with the intent of infecting computers.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[sohointegration]

@jimbo45: No, I don't necessarily agree that using AV software to disinfect a machine is a total waste of time. If the infestation is bad enough, and it is left to continue its dirty work long enough, then yes, AV or AM software is a waste of time. The programs can remove the source of the problem, but unfortunately cannot repair the damage done to the registry and system files. The trick is to PREVENT the infestation in the first place, by using good AV and AM programs along with good internet and email habits and best practices. As I posted earlier, WE are our own worst enemies.

Cheers back at ya!

 

[aem]

Who would use these free online computer scannings tools? You gotto be blind to use it literately i mean come on it's a deadset virus traps.

AV software depend on what it is and how it is used, can help protect virus but at the end of the day it is the enduser that allows their pcs to be infected. In an corporate environment, if Pcs have USBs disabled, internet policy enforced (matter of fact disallow internet access altogether), and AV server pushing out virus defiinitions to clients regulary i recon viruses would have a hard time getting through to the machines.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
I think you missed the point here -- I'm NOT saying you should stop using AV software (although most of it is no better - or worse - than MSE) but IF you DO get a computer infected then using the AV program on the infected computer itself is IMO a total waste of time as you could never be 100% sure that the computer was clean.


The point here is not whether you use an AV program or not - but IF your computer is unfortunate enough to become infected what is a SAFE and 100% reliable way of fixing it.

Running ANY operation on an infected machine IMO is just ASKING for troubles / problems later down the line.

Disallowing USB's while sounding attractive could be a problem.

Loads of people copy files to USB's from work to continue working OFFLINE at home and then re-load the files back the following day. Not everybody takes work computers home or can even access their networks via VPN's etc.


What might be a less restrictive but still a safe policy is to only allow access to DOWNLOAD stuff to a USB but no UPLOAD. Not sure how you would enforce that on Windows --can be done on Linux OK for example set the USB to WRITE ONLY but apart from the directory names no FILE READ.

In any case if you disallow this sort of stuff people then will use the email -- it's easy to encrypt stuff to bypass corporate Virus scanning programs and by breaking it up into chunks you've got round any mail send / receive size limits.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[aem]

A waste of time in having an AV that protects your machine and cleans it at a "satisfactory" level? I think not. I say satisfactory level because there's no such thing as 100%. If a machine is infected and then cleansed the best we can hope for is to continue using that machine without any operational issues. That said it will depend on the need of the machine, what the machine is used for and who uses it that the continuing usage of the machine is warranted. Not all situations are the same. Take for example if a machine used to store or process top secret data at FBI HQ is infected, you wouldn't want to continue allowing it to be used regardless of what has been done to clean it. This is an example of an unsatisfactory safe level.

As for the question of what is a SAFE and 100% reliable way of fixing an infected machine, the answer would depend on the need of the machine, what the machine is used for and who uses it. If the machine is on the network, you'd want to disconnect it off the network and then do a full scan, where the AV definitions are not up to date (for what ever reasons) you'd want to first update the definitions by downloading onto USB and updating them before running the scan. As for 100% reliable, again there is no such a thing as 100% and in a non perfect world we must work with what we have. No point in thinking outside the scope if you know what i mean.

As for allowing what can come into a machine and what can't complete disabling of media usages such as USB sticks, CD/DVD drives etc will work but again this will depend on the need of the machine, what the machine is used for and who uses it. Companies should enforce strict IT policies for their own good. Emails and Internet filtering can be done also, but again nothing is 100% and we as IT Support people can only work with what we have, not what we don't have.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
I think your answer is a typical I.T guys response.

In the REAL WORLD for example if you have a SERIOUS problem with your Car engine the garage will REMOVE the engine from the vehicle and do the appropriate repairs.

Surely if your computer on a network gets infected it should also be repaired OFF LINE and certainly by using tools that aren't connected to the network the computer got infected from ( or where the infection was dected from ).

As I keep saying 99% AV software is 100% useless and only supplies jobs for people having dubious qualifications in even more dubious locations.

Most people actually would be better off in just taking daily backups of their computers --these days a decent backup will probably take around 20 mins on a typical workstation-- and if the machine is infected a restore from a last known GOOD backup would also only probably take around 20 mins too.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[aem]

My answer might be from an IT dude, but it's real and that's how most IT Deppartment deal with viruses, and virus threats.

Unfortunately not all companaies have the luxury of time, money or resources to deal with threats the way you have detailed in your anology. Again i make a point that you can only work with what you have and not what you don't have. There are rules that needs to be applied including IT practices and Audit. You can't just do things YOU think is best.

If a computer on the network is infected, it will ideally need to be repaired offline, that means taken if off the network so as to stop the virus from spreading. Whether it is done quick enough to prevent it from happenning is another thing. there's no self removing off the network when a virus hit, humans have to do it. And by the way i have stated it should be off the network, please read my post.

You keep on saying with 10000% certainty that it is 99% useless to have AV software (other than MSE no doubt). It would seem that you haven't worked in a corporate environment to understand the need for AV protection and prevention. But if you have you'd know that you can only work with what you have and do the best that the company's technology and resources has to offer. You can't do more than that and there is no such thing as 100%.

I failt to see how backups could be an alternative to fixing an infected machine. Sure if the machine cannot be revitalised and you need to wipe and reimage that's fine but that's not the first thing you thing of when you have an infected machine, if you go the method you're not dealing with virus infection or protection rather sweeping it under the carpet.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
Repairing corporate Networks or infected computers on a corporate LAN is a different matterentirely -- I specefically am referring to STAND ALONE (or very tiny Network) HOME user machines -- especially as I doubt whether any corporates will be using W8 for a long time yet -- most are only just starting the W7 upgrade process --they aren't going to repeat this whole exercise again in a year or two.

There really isn't any problem with HOME users being able to backup and restore as often as they care to (and they SHOULD take regular backups anyway whether their computer gets infected or not.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[aem]

Understood there are differences between enterprise environment and non enterprise environment, but the core concept of virus protection and prevention is the same. AV software provides protection as well as prevention and if that's understood then it's presence is necessary, and paramount if you are referring to enterprise environments.

I really cannot see how data backup relates to protecting your pc from virus threats. Sure having regular backups of your data is important and needful incase of the need to restore lost data but these backups does not help protect or prevent virus threats. What does protect or prevent is an effective implementation of AV.

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
again I think you have slightly mis understood (or maybe my bad English).

The purpose of regular Virus free backups isn't to PREVENT your computer to get infected - it's a great time saver and excellent way of restoring your computer to Virus Free state AFTER it's been infected.

As I said I would never trust a computer that had only been cleansed via a Virus cleansing program -- corporate computer or not --and as an end user I can and have not only the right but also the duty to ensure that I use company provided computers responsibly --so If I'm in any way responsible for the equipment provided I will insist it's in 100% working order before I accept any responsibility for its use (or abuse).

My post was not about saying don't use ANY AV software but about the fact there really isn't ANY advantage these days in using 3rd party products for HOME computers (Corporate Lans diffent matter).

Most 3rd party products consume resources and in general interfere with the OS far more than is really necessary and do they really give you any better protection than the standard built in Microsoft one.

The only way AFAIK is to actually TEST a load of LIVE viruses on a machine and see what happens. - However this is also a little bit of a problem since the manner in which people use computers is so different -- so just by saying Virus A is detected by B,C,D, Virus B is detected by A,C for example doesn't prove that package C is better or worse than Package A. Package A might be more useful in some cases where the users never go near sites that could infect user with Virus B.

Statisctical analysis needs VERY VERY careful interpretation to present meaningful and sensible results.

This whole case of AV software is riddled with inconsistences and "exaggerated" statistics -- but like all things "Caveat Emptor"

"You pays your money and takes your choice".

Cheers
jimbo

 

[aem]

I still don't see the point of talking about backups when this thread is about AV. I have good reason to don't see the point because it has nothing to do with AV. In saying that your 2nd and 3rd paragraph kinda contradict one another. On one hand you said it's an excellent way to restore your machine to virus free state after it's been infected, then on the other hand you said you will not trust a machine that hae been infected. If you don't don't trust an infected machine, why have it data restored to virus free State (or why would you even suggest it)?

Again i need to mention that you or any other endusers (and when you speak of an enduser you are basically referring to a user not a support staff, which implies you are working within a company organisation) will have to make due of the technology that exists within the company. This include what's running on the machine. If your machine is somehow infected it is up to IT to "fix" it. They might clean it or they might reimage it depending on factors such as what the machine is used for and how damaged it is. As an enduser not working within the IT department of your company you do not have a say as to what you want or how you want your machine to be like when a situation arrises. It's up to IT to provide you with a "working" machine so that you can do your work and that's about it. How the machine gets protected or what goes on the machine or not is up to IT not you.

Now for home use, everything is up to you how you want your machine to be is up to you. Be knowing that you cannot project your home use of a machine thoughts and ideas into a company IT infrastructure, home use and enterprise use are not the same and can not be.

So really my summary is this, AV program has it's place in our society at work and at home. AV programs are there to protect us from viruses, it can prevent and it can cure. Every company is different and the practices of safe guarding machine may also differ. To not have AV (or properly implement an AV solution) is to dig one's own grave (or the grave for a company).

 

[joesoap99]

tried pc tools av,it crashed me and there is no safe start on this program,it just goes round in circles,hadto put drive on other machine as slave to format it and get it to work..
amd 2.7 dual core
w8 64bit

 

[windows]

What about ESET?

 

[CB]

My own experiences working with PC at home and Office, a bit unique. Dealing with viruses definitely a must to have AV program installed (and works). But what makes us safer is to be cautious in doing things that is being the modus how viruses have its way to infect. Educating co-workers to pay attention working with all kinds of flashdrive and other external drives is the hardest thing to do (in my situation here, most people have their flashdrive as part of bringing work home or elsewhere they find their time doing the work. Unfortunately most of the local viruses are all spreading through it, and totally annoying. The only advantage is that our company's server is linux based program. Me myself have been years being free from any kind of virus. For any of it coming from internet I trust my firewall and AV. Other than those, I am just watchful in plugging in any external media..

That is what I can do this far... and it helps a lot.

 

[acer54]

AVG Free 2012 is fully functional on my PC! Seems to be more features than anything else I've used on WDP!
I was using Ad-Aware free which was also working but wasn't updating automatically, however manual updating was working.

 

[JMH]

AVG Free 2012 is fully functional on my PC! Seems to be more features than anything else I've used on WDP!
I was using Ad-Aware free which was also working but wasn't updating automatically, however manual updating was working.

Good to hear.
Please continue to post both the good & bad news re AVG.
Thanks.

 

[joesoap99]

What Antivirus works with this build ?

~updated 05/01/2011~

*AVG - Doesn't work on 7850 (Work on 7955)
*Avast - Doesn't work on 7850 (Work on 7955)
*MSE - Doesn't install on 7850 (Install on 7955)

Avira - Works (reported by Dwarf)
PC Tools AV - Works
ClamWin - Works (no real time protection)
Panda Cloud Antivirus - Works (reported by Bill2)
NIS 2011 - Works (reported by yowanvista)

What else have you tryed?

I have dual boot w7+w8 dev prev.both 64 bit,i have found that avg free scans the partitioned drive for viruses when it scans the primary drive so in my case it scans w8 which is on my F partition.

 

[vrosa]

What works for each build - compilation



Not that its off topic, but lets try to keep the list clean and useful.
No need to insert things that doesnt work (IMHO).

BUILD 7850
Avira - Works (reported by Dwarf)
PC Tools AV - Works (reported by Vrosa)
NIS 2011 - Works (reported by yowanvista)
ESET Smart Security 5 (reported by Cookieman)
ESET NOD32 Antivirus 5 (reported by Cookieman)

BUILD 7927
AVG - Works
Avast - Works
MSE - Works
PC Tools AV - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Panda Cloud Antivirus - Works
AVG Free - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Avast! 6 - Works (reported by Vrosa)


BUILD 7955
AVG - Works
Avast - Works
MSE - Works
PC Tools AV - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Panda Cloud Antivirus - Works
AVG Free - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Avast! 6 - Works (reported by Vrosa)


BUILD 7959
MSE - Works
We need more input here plz....


BUILD 7989
MSE - Works
PC Tools AV - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Panda Cloud Antivirus - Works
ESET Smart Security 5 Beta - Works


BUILD 8102 DP x86 / x64
MSE - Works
PC Tools AV - Works (reported by Vrosa)
Panda Cloud Antivirus - Works
NIS 2011 - Works (reported by yowanvista)
SAS - Works (reported by ZigZag3143) * Hey Zigzag, is that just for 8102?
GFI Vipre - Works (reported by sohointegration)
AVG Free 2012 - Works (reported by JMH) ... If JMH says I believe ...lol...

 

[LovingWindows]

Latest version of Comodo Internet Security appears to work on Windows 8 DP Build 8102. Installed successfully with Windows 7 compatibility and ran as administrator.

Will test out the other features of the security suite later this evening and report back.

 

[LovingWindows]

Latest version of Comodo Internet Security appears to work on Windows 8 DP Build 8102. Installed successfully with Windows 7 compatibility and ran as administrator.

Will test out the other features of the security suite later this evening and report back.

Disregard this. The security suite will not initialize after installation thus rendering it useless. I assumed that if it worked in virtualbox it would work on real hardware, I assumed wrong.

Sorry.