Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums

Let's stop moaning

  1. #1

    Let's stop moaning


    It seems to me, on observation, that 90% of the comments, in this forum, when discussing the Metro screen, seem to lead into an argument, which leans towards comparison, of the two.
    I, personally, do not see any fruitful outcome to such a comparison. It is very much a question of choice.
    In the preceding OSs, there was a similar choice, but not, possibly, so dramatic. If you refer back to ancient threads, you will find countless numbers, advocating a 1. Busy taskbar, 2. A busy desktop, or, 3. Merely keeping, and using, the start menu to its full extent. Purely a matter of individual taste.
    There is a minority of members here (only on this forum, to such an extent) who appear to have found difficulty in accepting the Metro start menu. Rather than setting up there Metro as they did there old desktop (#2), they prefer to argue the merits of the old method. Ditto the taskbar.
    I, whenever I completed a reinstall., spent a little time in the old menu, creating folders and tucking my shortcuts into those folders. After installing all of my regular software, this could take about ten minutes. That was not a lot of valuable time for me, as it was only a once in a blue moon operation. My normal method, after my frequent experiments, was to re-establish my image, with everything intact.
    I liked a clean desktop - not everyone's choice, that is apparent. Now I have the best of both worlds. I can set up my Metro, as in the old start way, and I still have a clean desktop waiting for me, with the usual choice of a couple or so icons (Recycle bin - Control panel etc..) should I prefer to go there, at the click of my mouse or one key - ditto returning to metro. My one regret, so far, is that in Metro, those folders remain open, which tends to make the Metro look cumbersome. It could be made to look visually more attractive, but as it is designed primarily for touch screens, I guess that is why MS has kept those hideously large and ugly squares - in spite of a multitude of suggestions.
    I have weakened, to the extent that I have installed the "Classic" menu. This, again, gives me the choice, of, when closing an App I may be using, I can click into the old, familiar, menu, or click into the Metro screen.
    I can certainly see that use of the taskbar, if that is a users choice, can be beneficial, but to me (not all, obviously) that tends to look a little cumbersome to me. For the busy desktop users, it remains their choice. But, as I said, I prefer to keep at least one, empty desktop, which I now have by default.

    The endless arguments here, on the relative merits and uses of all three methods, are quite pointless and can have no satisfactory conclusion. I can see, on analysis, that it is only a handful of subscribers who are actually involved (guilty!) but, for newcomers, or those who only occasionally visit, it certainly gives an impression of a general hate session for Windows 8 - a rather remarkable impression, none the less, for a Forum which is calling itself a Windows 8 forum!
    There are several other aspects of Windows 8, which seem to have slipped through the cracks, here and on other forums. Here is one of several, for example, on performance. Small improvements for the general user, but surely a move forward?
    I am sure it will be of great help to all members, if the discussions start to put more emphasis on small ways , or even hacks, to improve the performance facilities and enhance the general us of Windows 8

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #2


    Solo.
    Posts : 2,159
    Windows 10 Pro 64-bit


    I am not used to be the first replier, but here is mine.

    As an average user, I see those preferences as it is. Each of us does have. Some say it in normal tone, others louder, but surely it can not be quantified as majority.

    I'm not the fan of metro UI but I honestly like Win 8 my way. I can choose using classic shell (or other third party start menu), or arrange all frequently used app icons on the first metro screen and ignore the rest. That is how my preferences have it ways.

    Change has never been easy, but people will eventually pick their way following it sooner, or.... later.

    Sorry if my English a bit scrambled.

    Kevin.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #3


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    I've been a HUGE proponent of the Start Screen and find it's better to use for me versus the menu. That's cool that others don't see that.......yet.

    And I agree, it's pointless. I also agree about people who are just disregarding trying to use the new and keep it the old way. It's a waste of time for everyone to debate over things that some aren't even trying to use and just belittle it and sparking a flame war.

    As this is a support forum, I'd rather have people guiding others in how to use the new. There are a couple of threads I've come across that do and that's awesome. If you want a start menu, go for it, great, but don't be trying to start a HUGE debacle over what is better than what. What I find better may not be what you find better, OK.

    I just have to say this because I have to, the title just sets it up for, but that's what she said!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #4


    Ah yes. if you don't like it you must not have tried it, seriously bud. That's the best you got. Because it's just not possible for all those people to have actually tried it and coming away thinking it was crap, lmao.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #5


    Newport, South Wales, UK
    Posts : 573
    Windows 10 Pro x64 x2 Windows 10 Enterprise x64, Ubuntu


    I am old enough to have been in this business for quite some time , and can remember the release of many, no make that ALL Microsoft windows releases, Everyone of them caused an outcry from users who did not like the change to what they were used to.

    I can remember the first windows release and the words of wisdom from the DOS advocates "Who Needs it" "What's the Point" "I'm fine with DOS and TSRs, they're quicker" (TSR= Terminate and Stay Resident applications that were used to access things in addition to the ONE program DOS allowed), People took a while but adapted to what was the greatest change ever in the PC world.

    I can recall the outcry from users when Microsoft got rid of the "good old Program Groups", and replaced them with, "this Stupid Start Button", with the release of Windows 98. Again people got used to it

    One of the most hated User interfaces at the time of release was Windows XP, with it's "Interface designed by Disney", Now look at it, Loved and fondly missed, ( or still in use ), often retained by IT departments that Cannot or Do not want to learn something New, as it's "Better the Devil you know"

    Vista, "the worst OS ever", "A total Dog", I used in many locations for about three years without any major isuues, I preffered the interface to XP's and I ran it on hardware up to the task, I as many others have seen Vista running on XP era hardware and the resultant problems, that also applied to XP on Widows 95 Hardware, though not to the same level as the changes under the hood were much greater in Vista than XP, People still use Vista and are happy with it, they adapted to it's quirks and got on with it.

    Windows 7 was an unusual release for Microsoft as it met with almost universal acceptance from the Users, ( though not from a lot of companies who had various reasons for staying with XP, weather valid or not).

    Now it's the current champion and Blue eyed boy of the MS stable, I think it's probably the best Windows since Windows 2000 but I can see where MS are looking to a future where the PC is less prevalent in the home and workplace. Tablets and Smart devices will soon be the way most users interact with computingand a universal look and feel makes sense.

    I am beginning to get used to the Metro interface and can see good and bad, for my usage, but when I've shown the interface to Not IT people, (the people who will actually use it at home or in work, the general impression is good, they understand the concept, and quickly work out how to do "what they want to do" Use the net for various things, white a letter, listen to music.

    I think that windows 8 and Metro will not be liked by all, especially us Geeks that populate this and other Tech forums, but with correct marketing, may be quite popular in the real world.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #6


    Germany/Florida
    Posts : 4,514
    Vista and Win7


    Many people seem to go thru a lot of trouble to make Win8 look like Win7 - with all kinds of obscure shells and OEM programs. What is the point of that. Why not use Win7 instead, then you do not have to stand on your head.

    There is very little in Win8 that makes it worth to spend even the $40 that an upgrade is supposed to cost. I will save my money and rather spend it on a good dinner.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #7


    Quote Originally Posted by whs View Post
    Many people seem to go thru a lot of trouble to make Win8 look like Win7 - with all kinds of obscure shells and OEM programs. What is the point of that. Why not use Win7 instead, then you do not have to stand on your head.

    There is very little in Win8 that makes it worth to spend even the $40 that an upgrade is supposed to cost. I will save my money and rather spend it on a good dinner.
    I'll be honest with you guys, I personally LOVE metro (modern ui), been following it since the Zune HD, always wanted but cant afford one, im waiting on the list to get my Surface tablet just because of metro really, but the deal is, it does not work on desktop.
    Even though it looks nice and all, I still find myself in desktop 99.9% of time on my desktop.And all the saying why not staying with win7 instead, win8 has many new features I love. First of, its like a Ferrari compared to the Thin PC (which is even stripped down windows 7 and should be fast), I love the new copy thingy, mount iso support, task manager and all that should have been with Windows 7 in a first place.

    I love Windows 8 , I really do, but not on my desktop, I cannot love it here, on my upcoming tablet, yes for sure.
    Using Windows 8 daily since CP and I still kinda hate not having a proper start menu, and distracting the whole screen by it. What if I just want to search something from start that I want to read form notepad? No can do.

    Most important stuff I use is pinned to taskbar and I'm really fine the way it is.

    Oh yeah and then there is that app store. Microsoft should really control what stuff they put up there, for example: apps that look really crappy, even tho metro is really nice or there are apps that name is in English, you download it and discover its some Taiwan, Chinese crap.

    EDIT: It is not moan, its my opinion, I know you guys don't give a crap, but why was this topic started then. I have right for my opinion, whether you like it or not.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #8


    I thing the new start screen is way better than the old one and I like the idea of metro. win8 seems to be good optimized under the hood, but I really have to say it's unbelievable ugly and have a lot of unnecessary annoyance. I was pro win8 a long time and I think many changes are good. I even like the idea from the new simple interface, but it's just really really bad finished and it's no fun to use due to that. the should hire some good designers and let them finish the stuff. I can only think of two possible reasons, not enough time or strange decision from the mr. balmer(aka I want to this way because i'm the boss) .even gnome3 feels way better!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #9


    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    It seems to me, on observation, that 90% of the comments, in this forum, when discussing the Metro screen, seem to lead into an argument, which leans towards comparison, of the two.
    I'm not sure many of my comments have lead to arguments, but a discussion and comparison of the 2 for sure. This is such a big change, and something that cannot be disabled in Windows 8...so it only seems natural to be discussed a lot.


    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    There is a minority of members here (only on this forum, to such an extent) who appear to have found difficulty in accepting the Metro start menu. Rather than setting up there Metro as they did there old desktop (#2), they prefer to argue the merits of the old method. Ditto the taskbar.
    I'm guilty of being one who finds difficulty in using the new start menu. Cutting to the chase, for somebody who uses my PC day in and day out in a business sense, using nothing but desktop apps, and multitasking heavily...this new change isn't very appealing to me. For a home user, or lighter user (who are becoming more the majority of the user base), things are probably not so much an issue. I'm not arguing that these people are wrong in their like for the OS, just explaining why it isn't right for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    I liked a clean desktop - not everyone's choice, that is apparent. Now I have the best of both worlds. I can set up my Metro, as in the old start way, and I still have a clean desktop waiting for me, with the usual choice of a couple or so icons (Recycle bin - Control panel etc..) should I prefer to go there, at the click of my mouse or one key - ditto returning to metro.
    I like to have a clean desktop as well. I don't use many icons and I never got along with gadgets and clutter. For me though, the start screen is like a secondary desktop and I don't want the clutter their either

    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    but, for newcomers, or those who only occasionally visit, it certainly gives an impression of a general hate session for Windows 8 - a rather remarkable impression, none the less, for a Forum which is calling itself a Windows 8 forum!
    Well, many people who come in search of forums, will likely be here due to confusion about how to accomplish something in Windows 8. They may find relief to see they are not alone when they see the ardent fans of the system complaining.

    Those of us who are against/dislike Metro don't want to see MS fail or everybody to leave Windows...we want to see a system that is very well liked (just like Windows 7...it was such a relief to have a release with very little bashing). We are obviously concerned that a lack of choice in this matter might be detrimental to the success of the OS.


    Quote Originally Posted by davehc View Post
    There are several other aspects of Windows 8, which seem to have slipped through the cracks, here and on other forums. Here is one of several, for example, on performance. Small improvements for the general user, but surely a move forward?
    While I think there are posts praising these small changes, they are often overshadowed by the things that are far more apparent and not universally liked.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #10


    Australia
    Posts : 716
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM


    To claim that persons who do not like W8 are moaning is another way of saying they should like what the supporters of W8 like. And they are disparagingly branded for daring to have a different preference and opinon.

    Win8 is great if you like a tile start menu instead of an alpha-numeric cascaded one. The thing is, many people do not. And they don't have to jusitfy why not!

    This latter group are not moaning, but using this forum to express their stong censure of M$ for refusing to cater to their preferences.

    In the View options of Windows folders for every version, there has always been the ability to personalise with a choice of tiles, icons, list, etc. Yet this option is missisng for the start menu in W8. Instead the tile menu is summarily forced on all users, unless third party programs are used.

    This is seen by many as an arrogant disregard by M$ for their traditional desktop users.

    So the answer to the thread topic is NO! We will not stop lodging our protests to M$ via this forum.

    Many feel so strongly about it that they are willing to skip this version of Windows and stick with W7, or even go to Mac or Linux.

    We could start a thread entitled: "Why don't the supporters of W8 stop moaning and whinging at persons who don't like W8?' And they should also stop denigrating us for disagreeing.

    Even if M$ stick with a tile start menu over succeeding versions of Windows, in 7 or 8 years they will suddenly announce a revolutionary new improved space age concept ... An alpha-numeric Start Menu!

    I mean, first it was bell-bottom trousers, then flared, then stove pipes, and eventually it goes back to where it all started! And simply begins the cycle over again; from blue suede shoes to hip hop pink!
    Last edited by Mustang; 24 Aug 2012 at 10:08.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Let's stop moaning
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