Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


My logic behind Microsoft's controversial decision: Removal of Start

  1. #31


    Posts : 158
    Windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by Pixel Eater View Post
    The Start Menu is inferior at today's resolutions and in terms of visual elements that draw you in. This implementation encourages people to finally execute things the Start Menu has always been capable of, but were oft neglected.
    Are you saying you need an incentive to click on some program? Are you saying you won't use Notepad or Photoshop or Outlook if there is no in-your-face colorful icon to "draw you in and encourage you"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pixel Eater View Post
    This would be pertinent if it weren't for Win+Q/All Apps being an even better version of what you're stuck on.

    Sub menus are a great example of clutter that should be discouraged.
    Beg to disagree on this one. Having everything on one screen is the definition of clutter. I bet you use sub-folders to orgnaize your documents instead of dumping everything in My Documents. The sub-menus are the menu equivalent to sub-folders.

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  2. #32


    Posts : 454
    Windows 8.1 Pro with Media Center


    Quote Originally Posted by Ivo View Post
    Beg to disagree on this one. Having everything on one screen is the definition of clutter. I bet you use sub-folders to orgnaize your documents instead of dumping everything in My Documents. The sub-menus are the menu equivalent to sub-folders.
    The Start Menu has always been horrible because it's laborious to navigate, and it GOES AWAY when you select something from it, forcing you to do the navigation all over again the next time.

    The desktop has always been horrible because it's usually covered by windows, obscuring the things it contains. Also, Windows has always been horrible about remembering where you placed icons.

    The Metro Start Screen is horrible because it's an infinitely scrolling roll, a full-screen, modal monstrosity, that depends upon things like "The 4 Corners", which are certain to appear in the next edition of "GUI Bloopers". The "live tiles" are worthless because they aren't visible when I'm actually using my computer, and they're too small to convey much useful information anyway. Metro would never have been invented if Microsoft wasn't so desperate over losing the mobile market and so lacking in confidence in their mobile efforts they're trying to leverage their success on the desktop to make mobile happen. I think it's going to backfire in a big way.

    The Windows 7 taskbar is brilliant because it combines the original taskbar purpose of helping one locate and activate windows with program launching. By pinning programs, you always know where to look for a program to launch it, activate its window, check on its progress indicator, access its jump list, etc. Programs stay exactly where you pin them, which improves efficiency over time through familiarity and muscle memory. On a relatively small 1680x1050 monitor, it's possible to fit 18 icons on a single row, taking up about 70% of the horizontal area, leaving room for some folder shortcuts and the notification area. The taskbar really comes into its own when you use multiple rows, like I described in this message. I use a lot of different programs, and people who use fewer will easily get by with 1 or 2 rows.
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  3. #33


    Posts : 1
    Windows 7


    I have been running 8 on my main laptop for a month now and at one time or another I have agreed with every post on this thread. At first I was so frustrated I hated the start screen and the metro ui. I've learned and adapted and now I love it. First, I have the programs (or files) that I use most often pinned to the task bar. I then customized the start screen so that 99% of what I need is either pinned to the task bar, given a shortcut on the desktop or found on the start screen. Now I rarely have to go to the All Apps screen. I find the start screen much faster than the old start menu. I'm glad they forced the change. I went through all the XP years with the start set up as "classic" and if MS didn't force me I'd probably set up 8 like Win7 and never learn the advantages.
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  4. #34


    India
    Posts : 1,184
    Windows 8.1, Windows 7, Linux Mint 14


    Quote Originally Posted by Dok View Post
    I have been running 8 on my main laptop for a month now and at one time or another I have agreed with every post on this thread. At first I was so frustrated I hated the start screen and the metro ui. I've learned and adapted and now I love it. First, I have the programs (or files) that I use most often pinned to the task bar. I then customized the start screen so that 99% of what I need is either pinned to the task bar, given a shortcut on the desktop or found on the start screen. Now I rarely have to go to the All Apps screen. I find the start screen much faster than the old start menu. I'm glad they forced the change. I went through all the XP years with the start set up as "classic" and if MS didn't force me I'd probably set up 8 like Win7 and never learn the advantages.
    :thumbup: You are absolutely right, Dok. Those who are complaining about the start screen are those who don't have the attitude of embracing the new. They are those being unreasonably stubborn. I have read posts where some say, to invest little time to learn the new os is 'loss of productivity'. I had taken less than two hours to get used to windows 8.
    You are a brilliant example of people having positive attitude being the one benefited. Take some time to at least get the very basics of the new os.
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  5. #35


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by Arpan View Post
    You are absolutely right, Dok. Those who are complaining about the start screen are those who don't have the attitude of embracing the new. They are those being unreasonably stubborn. I have read posts where some say, to invest little time to learn the new os is 'loss of productivity'. I had taken less than two hours to get used to windows 8.
    You are a brilliant example of people having positive attitude being the one benefited. Take some time to at least get the very basics of the new os.
    Have you seen anyone complain about the reduced RAM usage in W8?

    Can you guess why?
    I'll spell it out for you, reduced RAM usage is a worthwhile change.

    Like all Metro fans, you assume that people that don't like it, just haven't used it enough.

    It's like saying that if you don't like drinking sump oil, you just haven't drunk enough of it.
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  6. #36


    I think the fact of the matter is to compete in todays market MS needs to make one software that will work with all your devices and I think MS has got it right with the new metro start menu. I think the desktop days are soon to be over. Just think about it, how fast windows will load up once the desktop is gone!
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  7. #37


    India
    Posts : 1,184
    Windows 8.1, Windows 7, Linux Mint 14


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Arpan View Post
    You are absolutely right, Dok. Those who are complaining about the start screen are those who don't have the attitude of embracing the new. They are those being unreasonably stubborn. I have read posts where some say, to invest little time to learn the new os is 'loss of productivity'. I had taken less than two hours to get used to windows 8.
    You are a brilliant example of people having positive attitude being the one benefited. Take some time to at least get the very basics of the new os.
    Have you seen anyone complain about the reduced RAM usage in W8?

    Can you guess why?
    I'll spell it out for you, reduced RAM usage is a worthwhile change.

    Like all Metro fans, you assume that people that don't like it, just haven't used it enough.

    It's like saying that if you don't like drinking sump oil, you just haven't drunk enough of it.
    I'll spell it out for you, reduced RAM usage is a worthwhile change.
    I hope you know the difference between change and improvement. Reduction in RAM usage isn't a "change" its an "improvement". It means the computer is performing faster. Why would anybody complain about that? Metro is something that "changes" the way a user uses his/her computer. So, those who are not willing change, are the ones complaining. Do you think microsoft is paying me or people like me for liking metro? If there was nothing in metro, why would I like it? I am not the only one liking metro.

    But yes, I agree that microsoft should give users the option of booting directly into desktop mode.
    Last edited by Arpan; 23 Jul 2012 at 04:25.
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  8. #38


    India
    Posts : 1,184
    Windows 8.1, Windows 7, Linux Mint 14


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post

    Like all Metro fans, you assume that people that don't like it, just haven't used it enough.

    It's like saying that if you don't like drinking sump oil, you just haven't drunk enough of it.
    You couldn't get me because I put that line without any reference. Its my mistake. I don't assume that people haven't used metro enough.
    Actually, I had said that its a bit of a problem for organisations because they have to train thousands of employees to use win8. But microsoft has said it would include a 'Get Started' assistant software with the stable windows 8 release so that, the problem is solved to some extent. And the reply I got was, this change was 'loss of productivity'.
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  9. #39


    Posts : 299
    win 7 home premium 64 bit


    The question is if MS is so confident in the new configuration why not allow a default selection that allows the user to have a CHOICE of the traditional start menu?


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  10. #40


    Posts : 239
    Win7 & 8 64bit / Linux Mint 14


    Quote Originally Posted by bridges View Post
    I think the fact of the matter is to compete in todays market MS needs to make one software that will work with all your devices and I think MS has got it right with the new metro start menu. I think the desktop days are soon to be over. Just think about it, how fast windows will load up once the desktop is gone!
    I doubt if the desktop days are going to be over any time soon especially with corporate. Cannot see any company investing potentially expensive training time in Win8 to achieve what they could already do with Win7.

    Boot times are IMO largely academic especially if you're operating with a SSD. I personally did not experience any improvement with my short time experimenting with Win8 and a few seconds here and there at boot time is really of no significance.
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My logic behind Microsoft's controversial decision: Removal of Start
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