Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Petition to Microsoft addressing 8

View Poll Results: Should Microsoft do much better with 8 than it is now?

Voters
52. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, it needs to be better

    46 88.46%
  • No, I really like how it is turning out

    6 11.54%
  1. #31


    Victoria, BC, Canada
    Posts : 10
    Win8.1 Pro 64 bit


    Just wanted to say, I tried, but I just couldn't wrap myself around Windows 8 like I did with 7. The start page is just plain UGLY!!!, apps kept dissappearing, and I found myself almost exclusively using the desktop. So, I have (with a little sadness) changed back to Windows 7 and I think I will be staying with it for at least the near future.
    I think that Microsoft should make 2 OS's. Metro style for touch-screens and tablets, and desktop style for home and office use. I think that the few real improvements could have probably just been incorporated into a win7 service pack instead of a brand new OS.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #32


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Yeah, because you're a Desktop user. That's where the main complaints are coming from. Do you really think a college student or a family really need more RAM, HDDs, SSDs, Graphics cards, and NICs or server boards? Really? Every person I know that has a laptop has 4 gigs of RAM and a 2GHz dual core processor and they're fine, some even use PhotoShop on that.
    That's fine if all you ever do is type up the occasional Word doc and login to Facebook.

    You can use Photoshop on XP machines too.
    The spectacular/tricky filters like lots of RAM and CPU power.
    If you don't mind waiting for the transformations to execute, you don't need any power.

    It's the same thing that people say about SSDs; once you've tried the speed you can't live with HDDs.

    Lots of people need more RAM and storage.
    I've got 4.5 TB installed in my PC and it's not enough.
    I haven't seen any laptops with 4.5 TB (yet).

    Quote Originally Posted by severedsolo View Post
    So that means we don't get a say? Because we are in the minority, does our opinion not count?
    Minority compared to what? Smart phones?
    I have no doubt that Windows is installed in more desktops, than any other form factor.

    Quote Originally Posted by IceFire View Post

    And people say that being behind a monitor all day makes you unfit.
    This is true about what you say about desktops, but seriously, honestly, do you think the typical person really cares for that? I know more people concerned with music than video since they haven't discovered digital media in full. Many people don't PhotoShop, and are fine with what they have. Heck, even look at the sales of desktops, they're stagnant. More people are preferring mobile over not. That's what they like and that's what being innovated a lot more than desktops. A tower today appears basically the same as one 10 years ago. A laptop today or even a tablet today looks not like one 10 years ago. That's what killing desktops in my eyes: the genuine lack of true innovation. Sure, things are smaller and faster, but that's it. Until Windows 8, no one even thought of actually using gesture as an input or even touch.

    Times are changing. People are choosing mobile options more than ever. Yes, here on this forum, we may like to bash on those options because WE, we are desktop form factor users because we know more about computer technology than the typical person. We like to dig around our box and optimize it for the best performance as it can go. Most people settle with what they have because their needs are different. We have terabytes of video and music and tell everyone we know to get a SSD or more RAM because they help our needs, but most people could live without the plethora of RAM and the super fast speed.

    But even then, there will be the Windows Slate options that have a lot of RAM and a large SSD and a fast processor because some poeple will want the flexibility of having desktop-like power, the efficiency of a laptop, having a natural input of touch, and the convenience of choosing how to use their device. That in a nutshell is what I think Windows 8 is about, flexibility in changing times.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #33


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    Market Saturation


    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Say what you will say about MS, but they never set you up to fail.
    How about releasing on OS with the firewall turned off?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Heck, even look at the sales of desktops, they're stagnant.
    Ever heard of market saturation?

    Most people who want a desktop already have one.
    Most desktops last longer than 6 months.

    The mobile phone market is saturated too.
    They have a high turnover, because Apple says, "iPhone X is "the new black". You must be a loser if you are using anything else."

    The only unsaturated market is Tablets.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    A tower today appears basically the same as one 10 years ago. A laptop today or even a tablet today looks not like one 10 years ago. That's what killing desktops in my eyes: the genuine lack of true innovation. Sure, things are smaller and faster, but that's it.
    Cars are still boxes with wheels.
    We'd better get rid of them.

    Towers are unchanged, because they actually work.

    If someone slapped a mirror ball on a tower, you'd rush out and buy it then?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Until Windows 8, no one even thought of actually using gesture as an input or even touch.
    You've obviously never seen a HP All-in-one Touch PC with Windows 7 (not that I'd buy one, especially at the prices they want).

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    We have terabytes of video and music and tell everyone we know to get a SSD or more RAM because they help our needs, but most people could live without the plethora of RAM and the super fast speed.
    Fair enough, if all you ever do is read email, use OneNote and/or Word, Twit and listen to some music.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    But even then, there will be the Windows Slate options that have a lot of RAM and a large SSD and a fast processor because some poeple will want the flexibility of having desktop-like power, the efficiency of a laptop, having a natural input of touch, and the convenience of choosing how to use their device. That in a nutshell is what I think Windows 8 is about, flexibility in changing times.
    They won't have desktop-type power.

    My friend spent $3K on a laptop, so that he could spend 30 minutes/day (possibly) editing video on the bus.
    It's more likely that he is just reading emails.
    He can't use its full power without being plugged into the mains (it throttles itself down to save the battery).

    He could have got a $2K monster desktop and monitor and a $1K laptop.
    I have no doubt that combination would outperform his laptop.

    I could have built 3 desktop systems, each much more powerful than my current set up, for that sort of money.
    I can't even conceive of how powerful a $3K desktop PC would be.

    BTW, I've never said that W8 isn't suitable for Phone and Tablet users.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #34


    Posts : 1,851
    8250 x86 + 7 SP1 x86 + Ubuntu 12.04 LTS x86


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Say what you will say about MS, but they never set you up to fail.
    How about releasing on OS with the firewall turned off?
    When was this?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #35


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    The original XP release (and SP1)


    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Say what you will say about MS, but they never set you up to fail.
    How about releasing on OS with the firewall turned off?
    When was this?
    Surely you've read claims stating that if you connect Windows to the Internet, it will be riddled with Worms within minutes?
    That reference is actually about XP.

    Microsoft’s record on security is far from perfect. In Windows XP, for example, it introduced an effective firewall and then chose to leave it turned off by default. That mistake was corrected in XP Service Pack 2.
    ZDNet
    Windows malware: are you safer today than you were 10 years ago? | ZDNet

    Note:
    They didn't fix it in XP SP1!

    Also, Windows still has "Hide extensions for known files types" selected by default, despite all the problems that caused.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #36


    Posts : 28
    Windows 8 Pro x64


    I agree with Gman windows 7 was very stable while in beta. Infact it was better than Vista with service pack 1 imho.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #37


    Posts : 1,851
    8250 x86 + 7 SP1 x86 + Ubuntu 12.04 LTS x86


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post

    How about releasing on OS with the firewall turned off?
    When was this?
    Surely you've read claims stating that if you connect Windows to the Internet, it will be riddled with Worms within minutes?
    That reference is actually about XP.
    XP didn't even come with a firewall so a non-existing one can not even possibly be turned off. That fact did not set up anyone to fail, despite your attempt to pick something out here. Operating systems are intended as a working link between hardware and the end user. The only reason Microsoft started including a firewall at all with XP SP2 and subsequent releases is because the general population did not know any better on their own and NAT routers were not extremely popular yet like today. Most connected their nics straight to the broadband modem, without the use of NAT.

    So to Microsoft's credit, which you would rather put them down for and also use it as a fault in something I've said, they did start including a firewall.

    And besides all this at all, my response about Microsoft not setting anyone up to fail was about bugs or not bugs. I have no idea how a non-existent firewall came into the conversation here.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #38


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    Marketing Decision


    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    XP didn't even come with a firewall so a non-existing one can not even possibly be turned off. That fact did not set up anyone to fail, despite your attempt to pick something out here. Operating systems are intended as a working link between hardware and the end user. The only reason Microsoft started including a firewall at all with XP SP2 and subsequent releases is because the general population did not know any better on their own and NAT routers were not extremely popular yet like today.
    ...
    And besides all this at all, my response about Microsoft not setting anyone up to fail was about bugs or not bugs. I have no idea how a non-existent firewall came into the conversation here.
    Did you even read the link?

    Microsoft’s record on security is far from perfect. In Windows XP, for example, it introduced an effective firewall and then chose to leave it turned off by default. That mistake was corrected in XP Service Pack 2.
    ZDNet
    Windows malware: are you safer today than you were 10 years ago? | ZDNet

    Maybe you don't like Ed Bott.

    Here's another link:
    Windows XP introduced several new features to the Windows line, including:
    ...
    New networking features including Windows Firewall, Internet Connection Sharing integration with UPnP, NAT traversal APIs, Quality of Service features, IPv6 and Teredo tunneling, Background Intelligent Transfer Service, extended fax features, network bridging, peer to peer networking, support for most DSL modems, IEEE 802.11 (Wi-Fi) connections with auto configuration and roaming, TAPI 3.1, Bluetooth and networking over FireWire.
    Wikipedia
    Windows XP - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Leaving the Firewall turned off was not a bug, it was a design/marketing decision!
    Do realise that a Firewall is supposed to prevent unauthorised network intrusions (e.g. Worms, hackers/crackers)?

    Despite knowing that Worms could get into Windows MS chose to leave the Firewall turned off.

    Here are some notable events:


    • May 2000: The ILOVEYOU worm, also known as VBS/Loveletter and Love Bug worm, is a computer worm written in Vb-script. It infected millions of computers worldwide within a few hours of its release. It is considered to be one of the most damaging worms ever.
    • July 2001: The Code Red worm attacking the Index Server ISAPI Extension in Microsoft Internet Information Services is released.
    • August 2001: A complete re-write of the Code Red worm, Code Red II begins aggressively spreading onto Microsoft systems
    • XP released to computer manufacturers on August 24, 2001
    • October 2001: The Klez worm is first identified. It exploits a vulnerability in Microsoft Internet Explorer and Microsoft Outlook and Outlook Express.
    • XP Service Pack 1 (SP1) was released on September 9, 2002
    • August 2003: The Blaster worm, aka the Lovesan worm, rapidly spreads by exploiting a vulnerability in system services present on Windows computers.
    • May 2004: The Sasser worm emerges by exploiting a vulnerability in LSASS and causes problems in networks, while removing MyDoom and Bagle variants, even interrupting business.
    • XP Service Pack 2 (SP2) was released on August 25, 2004 (Firewall turned on by default)
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #39


    Posts : 1,851
    8250 x86 + 7 SP1 x86 + Ubuntu 12.04 LTS x86


    There was nothing called Windows Firewall in XP. It was called "Internet Connection Firewall".

    Just because someone wants to deem something a mistake does not make it so.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #40


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GMan View Post
    Say what you will say about MS, but they never set you up to fail.
    How about releasing on OS with the firewall turned off?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Heck, even look at the sales of desktops, they're stagnant.
    Ever heard of market saturation?

    Most people who want a desktop already have one.
    Most desktops last longer than 6 months.

    The mobile phone market is saturated too.
    They have a high turnover, because Apple says, "iPhone X is "the new black". You must be a loser if you are using anything else."

    The only unsaturated market is Tablets.



    Cars are still boxes with wheels.
    We'd better get rid of them.

    Towers are unchanged, because they actually work.

    If someone slapped a mirror ball on a tower, you'd rush out and buy it then?



    You've obviously never seen a HP All-in-one Touch PC with Windows 7 (not that I'd buy one, especially at the prices they want).

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    We have terabytes of video and music and tell everyone we know to get a SSD or more RAM because they help our needs, but most people could live without the plethora of RAM and the super fast speed.
    Fair enough, if all you ever do is read email, use OneNote and/or Word, Twit and listen to some music.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    But even then, there will be the Windows Slate options that have a lot of RAM and a large SSD and a fast processor because some poeple will want the flexibility of having desktop-like power, the efficiency of a laptop, having a natural input of touch, and the convenience of choosing how to use their device. That in a nutshell is what I think Windows 8 is about, flexibility in changing times.
    They won't have desktop-type power.

    My friend spent $3K on a laptop, so that he could spend 30 minutes/day (possibly) editing video on the bus.
    It's more likely that he is just reading emails.
    He can't use its full power without being plugged into the mains (it throttles itself down to save the battery).

    He could have got a $2K monster desktop and monitor and a $1K laptop.
    I have no doubt that combination would outperform his laptop.

    I could have built 3 desktop systems, each much more powerful than my current set up, for that sort of money.
    I can't even conceive of how powerful a $3K desktop PC would be.

    BTW, I've never said that W8 isn't suitable for Phone and Tablet users.
    You could say the desktop market is saturated, but that could be one of many things causing it. I find it's the lack of innovation and design, I know some people that oogle, myself included, at new laptops because they're being innovated design wise, with incredible thinness and speed and soon, new inputs. Sure, there are the desktops that are cool like the Alienware systems, but most people don't realize them and don't want to spend that much on a puter.

    And yes, cars are still boxes with wheels, but they were horseless carriages at first, had fins, were fuel efficient, were gas guzzlers, and now they're turning into swoppy boxes running on electric power and alternate sources of fuel and still have high fuel mileage. That there is innovation.

    I've seen and played with touch AIOs, but how many people actually have one and/or actually use the touch input?

    I think you seem to define desktop power as something that is really high. Yes, you can overclock, get the fastest everything for less than a laptop equivalent more-or-less, but that's not the typical desktop power most people seek. Desktop power is at least, at the very least, a dual core processor at 2.8-3.0 GHz. Some mobile processors are getting to the point of that and will continue, as time progresses, at meeting that. One must consider they're low energy chips and the full throttle. And one must consider that people aren't buying desktops much anymore. Walk into your local best buy, walmart, or any electronic retailer and you'll see some tablets running crapdroid or crapOS, laptops up the butt, maybe some touch AIOs, but not a lot of desktops. Sure, they last, this is true, but so do laptops and potentially slates and tablets. Some may want a slate or a tablet to complement their desktop PC, or some may want one to be their only PC. It's a matter of choice.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Petition to Microsoft addressing 8
Related Threads
Source: How we're addressing misleading apps in Windows Store
addressing reset and recovery options in Installation & Setup
My problem is as follows. i installed monitoring and filtering software on the computer. my kids just restarted the computer and choose refresh and it was gone. in win 7 i set a new restore point and deleted the previous ones solving that problem. i know that there is a way to not allow using...
Read more at: How the 'One Microsoft' mission is changing Microsoft Research | ZDNet
Read more at: Microsoft to rebrand 'Windows Azure' as 'Microsoft Azure' | ZDNet
Eight Forums Android App Eight Forums IOS App Follow us on Facebook