Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.

  1. #941


    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tully View Post
    I am the oldest member on the Forum - 83!

    By the way, my first car was a "T" bought at auction during WWII for $25!

    The way to test how old someone is, ask to explain how the Ford planetary transmission worked.

    Tully
    Awesome
    You can read Tully's story here: Personal Computer Related Memories - I Remember:

    It would be nice to see you post yours.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #942


    Palm Coast FLorida
    Posts : 370
    Windows 8 Pro ($39.99 upgrade)


    I like things big and floppy
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #943


    Posts : 636
    Windows 7/8


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tully View Post
    I am the oldest member on the Forum - 83!

    By the way, my first car was a "T" bought at auction during WWII for $25!

    The way to test how old someone is, ask to explain how the Ford planetary transmission worked.

    Tully
    Awesome
    You can read Tully's story here: Personal Computer Related Memories - I Remember:

    It would be nice to see you post yours.
    I did! You even thanked me for it.. :P
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #944


    Hafnarfjörður IS
    Posts : 4,376
    Linux Centos 7, W8.1, W7, W2K3 Server W10


    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by lilsting10 View Post
    Where exactly has it been said (other than people possibly over-reacting) that everything will be funneled through the Microsoft Store. As I understand it both the ARM/Pro versions of Win8 have the Desktop area, so anyone can use whichever regular non-metro browser they perfer to download and install whatever program they want from whichever download location they want to.

    Why isn't there this same hysteria with Androids and the Android Marketplace/Google Play? Or iWhatevers and the Apple Store? I would say that Microsoft are giving you more choices than either of those platforms.
    All METRO apps will have to go through the Microsoft store according to Microsoft. Desktop apps which may come from the app store in the future, can at least be installed outside of it for now. If you want o use Metro and use a Metro app, it has to come from Microsoft's store.

    This is one of the reasons people Hate Apple BTW.

    On Android you can at least sideload apps without going through the store. (Maybe there is a hacky way to do this on Win 8, I don't know yet)

    But the big deal with this over the iPad/iPhone and Android is, those ecosystems started out with an app store from the get go whereas MS is slowly changing an age old independent platform OVER to their own total control. A lot of future apps may NOT be available on the desktop, but ONLY through the Metro app store and that'll suck for people that don;t want to have anything to do with it. MS is splitting the windows developer camp in two and putting that burdon on the users.

    Forcing metro apps through the app store is a dodgy definition of an additional "choice". It's wrapped in a serious concern for the future of app distribution on windows. No serious app developer (i.e. Adobe) is going to give MS 30% of their cut! (Without raising their price by 30% anyway). You think photoshop is expensive now... wait till you have to buy it through the MS store in Windows 9!

    The time to start fighting against that "hysterical" outcome is NOW, not after there is no longer any choice.
    Hi there
    The whole "App store" idea for Windows is a total waste of time -- apart from the fact that even a company of Ms's size won't have the infrastructure and payment procedures in place to pay x million developers a few cents every week - each invoice plus tax would probably cost Ms 3 - 5 dollars to start with so they'd lose on every download even if they could satisfy the demand.

    Also most small developers won't believe or put up with for an instant some of the large corporation B/S that invoices are only paid every 90 or in extreme cases 180 days - either. Even 30 days after invoice submission can be a problem for the small developer.

    I've worked on enough Freelance projects where I've always rejected any contract unless I get paid within 7 days of invoice -- it's actually not the client but the agency who trots out 30 / 60 days b/s -- I just refuse and the agency comes back and we agree on 7 days.

    I know many Freelance contractors who have trouble with these long payment times from agencies (and say at 900 - 1000 EUR a day or even 500 - 600 EUR -- if you have to wait 60 days and something goes wrong that's a HUGE amount of money to have at risk - and of course if you haven't any other income meantime --- your imagination can do the rest).

    There's still a HUGE difference in typical commercial applications like Adobe Photoshop or CS5 and a "Micky Mouse" type of application giving you train or London Bus times on a mobile phone (useful though this type of stuff can be).

    On Android anyway most of the decent apps are free and the whole thing was designed like this from the outset -- plus you can install apps from anywhere if you want to.

    Windows software comes from loads of different organisations -- some HUGE like ORACLE, ADOBE and SAP. Do you for ONE MICRO SECOND think these organisations will allow some cheap off shored "Cheech and Chong" outfit to run quality control and code inspection before the stuff goes on to an "approved" Ms app store.

    Seriously forget the whole deal here. Ms you are wasting your time --don't try and "Out Apple" Apple -- Apple will soon be in a problem anyway -- Ipods -- who needs to use any more, Iphones look positively clunky against modern newcomers like Samsung Galaxy III s and HTC's phones. All they have now is the ITunes stuff and some diehard Mac fanboys who will continue to buy mac books whatever they cost.

    Cheers
    jimbo
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #945


    Posts : 993
    Windows 8 pro Retail


    Quote Originally Posted by tcman50 View Post
    I like things big and floppy
    Hands tcman50 a 5 1/4 floppy disk, you get the drive
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #946


    Posts : 738
    1st W10 Professional x64/W7 Ultimate x64 - 2nd Remote system: W10 Insider Builds/W7 Professional


    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tully View Post
    A simple keyboard shortcut (Win+C) brings up the "Charms Bar". What is all the "FUSS" about!

    Tully
    Because it's 100% unintuitive (like 90% of the Metro UI).

    99.9999999% of the users will NEVER know that works. They will just be completely stymied by the missing functionality or annoyed by the rightfully annoying "magic" hot corners.

    To this day, YEARS after it was implemented, ANYONE that sees me press Win+E to bring up explorer /invariably/ says "How did you do that?"

    Shortcut keys are ok for the pros but completely useless to everyone else. It's a BAD USER PARADIGM to be considered the primary way of getting to it. Hot corners are pretty much just as bad. All that stuff used to be on the much more intuitive and easy to find and use start menu.

    Start menu traded away for hidden, hard to find, hard to use menu == not an improvement in any way.
    One ZDNet blog writer summed it up as a "convoluted process" requiring extra steps to move around as well as find and use things like the shutdown options. Even if you had a touchscreen monitor on right now and were just now looking at 8 you would be lost wondering "where do I press?".

    I'm aware of numerous keyboard shortcuts for 3rd party apps as well as seen in Windows but hardly use any! What then happens to all those "one finger typers"?! I actually remove the Windows sybol key from the keyboard used on the main system here to avoid bumping that while running a full screen app.

    As far as opening up a second WE or IE windows simply holding the shift key and once again clicking on the shortcut of either will bring up a new window. Yet I still keep a second short on a Quick Launch type addon tool bar. The keys most often used would be the ctrl-alt-del, del or other for entering the bios setup, and the assigned F for bringing up the boot device menu at post time. The rest of the time it's "point and click" for all those 99.999999999%!
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  7. #947


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    Indeed


    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    To this day, YEARS after it was implemented, ANYONE that sees me press Win+E to bring up explorer /invariably/ says "How did you do that?"
    Same here. I find nobody but my fellow IT staffers using the keyboard shortcuts.
    I still meet people who don't know about:

    • "Ctrl + A" (Select All)
    • "Ctrl + C" (Copy)
    • "Ctrl + X" (Cut)
    • "Ctrl + V" (Paste)
    • "Ctrl + Y" (Redo)
    • "Ctrl + Z" (Undo)


    Quote Originally Posted by phailyoor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FSeal View Post
    To this day, YEARS after it was implemented, ANYONE that sees me press Win+E to bring up explorer /invariably/ says "How did you do that?"
    I never knew that. I guess I learn a new keyboard shortcut every day.
    Windows 7 - Shortcut Keys for Windows 7
    Shortcut Keys for Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums
    Last edited by lehnerus2000; 31 Jul 2012 at 21:18. Reason: Additional
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #948


    Posts : 738
    1st W10 Professional x64/W7 Ultimate x64 - 2nd Remote system: W10 Insider Builds/W7 Professional


    How many people I know on a personal level even know about keyboard shortcuts to start with unless they read the installation and user guide for a program that mentioned having any? Not too many! And some of these people having running Windows since the 9x Legacy days!

    You can also work your way around the desktop and run programs without a mouse if you would like! How many will run any OS without a "point and clicker" however? Again not too many! A keyboard only OS wouldn't be too user friendly for the majority of users regardless of what their experience levels are. 2+2 doesn't equal 5!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #949


    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post

    I still meet people who don't know about:

    • "Ctrl + A" (Select All)
    • "Ctrl + C" (Copy)
    • "Ctrl + X" (Cut)
    • "Ctrl + V" (Paste)
    • "Ctrl + Y" (Redo)
    • "Ctrl + Z" (Undo)
    These are the ones that I use;

    • "Ctrl + A" (Select All)
    • "Ctrl + C" (Copy)
    • "Ctrl + X" (Cut)
    • "Ctrl + V" (Paste)
    • "Ctrl + Z" (Undo)
    • "WIN + E" (Explorer)
    • "WIN + R" (Run)
    • "ALT -F4" (Close Window)
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #950


    Posts : 738
    1st W10 Professional x64/W7 Ultimate x64 - 2nd Remote system: W10 Insider Builds/W7 Professional


    I haven't been in any rush to reinstall the RP onto the second OS drive here simply being busy putting another 7 build together lately! As I was mentioning on another thread over at SF MS seems to be trying to grab the Linux "Geek's OS" labeling away and applying it to what comes after 7!

    Another question I posed was how do you recommend 8 to the novice user who now needs to move up from XP or even Vista into a newer version? W8 is a hard one for that! People will rather chance it with malwares running a version that suits them over running something they get lost with in a heart beat despite any improvements in security.

    Here if I need something to work I'll find a way to make it do just that. But the people you make any recommendations to you have to go by their own needs and levels of experience not simply slap a Geeks Only type OS in their faces. As far as any VM you expect to be limited on just what you can do there anyways.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.
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