Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.

  1. #1181


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


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    Did you expect no hoop jumping? Since When? Application installers have not been properly written for Windows 8 yet. MS has been through all this during their engineering conferences. They disagree with the legacy concept as a better option. It is not all about app sales (they are optional)

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    (( "search and destroy" mission to find Control Panel items))
    Really? Winx > too difficult to find?

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    The all apps group blocks is the new organization scheme.
    It is very neat and you don't have to go through multi layers of menuing.
    If a user can't figure out which are the primary executables, Do you really think they know what they are doing?

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    If most want to see the desktop automatically, what you are saying is they want to do nothing essentially. Pressing the desktop tile (or not) does nothing except take you to another screen. Then you have to do something else to get going. You have to punch a taskbar icon or run your start button. If you did that from the start screen, you would already be there.

    Now there are complaints about the drab look. I thought you were a serious desktop professional. And you want fancy visuals? Pretty edges? Transparency? Do you really believe the start screen is just a splash screen? Really? Did you really believe (or anyone else) that the start screen was Microsoft's version of a trashed desktop? Really? There is nothing wrong with using a start menu but Microsoft believes the start screen and the all apps area combined with the edge UI and hot corners to be a better option.
    Metro Apps are optional.
    Last edited by mdmd; 08 Sep 2012 at 23:33.

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  2. #1182


    Quote Originally Posted by R0Br
    Advanced users have been using 3rd party apps to get Windows to do what they want for ages but now it's an issue?
    Yes, And maybe Microsoft should meditate on it: Why is it an issue now? Something's wrong maybe? And check out on the forums what the complaining poeple are writing about it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave76
    We do have to remember that they are making a OS for about a billion people.
    3% of one billion is 30 million. If they have 30 million poeple seriousely complaining because they don't know how to configure or disable Metro UI, Microsoft will face serious problems managing the situation. Now I'm being very generous with 3%, if it turns out ot be 15% I can't imagine the mess. I also expect a very large number of poeple who will like Metro UI but will complain that they don't find things in the Chrams and corners.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave76
    If they don't make enough changes then some say it's just a SP to the previous version.
    Yes and so what? If they continue a successful product line, they keep on being successful and everybody is happy. Change for the sake of change (or because of Apple market share paranoia) is stupid and that's exactely what we see in W8. When couturiers designs new clothest hey are trendy but they are not always more confortable. Same with Microsoft's OS Haute Couture. The business suit has been unchanged for 100 years. So will be the business version of Windows.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave76
    When there aren't enough options to make the changes each individual would like to see then we can usually find third party apps to fill in the gaps.
    Why isn't Microsoft not giving an option to disable the Metro (Modern -LOL-)Start Screen and return to the classic Start Menu? Because there are other companies and programmers doing so?
    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie
    I believe MS knows very well about your desire of choice of UI, but they canít allow that. I think they want to introduce 8 and teach the general public on how to use it. If they left a choice for the general public, most would probably remain to do things the old way, therefore no progression.
    It means that it's already assumed by Microsoft that the Metro UI will fail (if they let the users a choice). That's why they force it. That's against all commercial wisdom. Anybody with a brain would let the choice to the users and then see how well it's accepted and adopted by the mass before betting the farm on it. Instead they launch a product they know will faill. Ironicaly their decision to force Metro UI on W8 is making its failure even more likely.
    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie
    Is it morally or ethically correct for them to excercise this?
    Of course it's ethical and moral! Every company is entitled to its own decision. It may not be fair from an investor point of view, thought. Investors in Microsoft corp. may file a complain or even sue them if they take bad decisions or concealed some of their decisions or informations.
    Night Hawk, I have seen your Start Screen snapshop. How is it that much different from a desktop? Ok, I know the difference, but my point is, why did they make a Start Screen the size of a desktop while it's not a desktop? Why just not using the dektop instead?
    Quote Originally Posted by mdmd
    "search and destroy" mission to find Control Panel items
    At the risk of portraying the Metro UI as useless, I have a shortcut to the Control Panel straight on my desktop. Why would I want to open a Start Screen to reach this shortcut?
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  3. #1183


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    That was Night Hawk's assertion that users would have to go on a "search and destroy" mission to find Control Panel items Fred, not mine. The Control Panel can be had from almost anywhere. That was my (mdmd) start screen snap shot, not Night Hawk's. I am the one advocating for the Modern UI. (mdmd) They are not giving an option to go to the desktop legacy start menu because the engineering teams at Microsoft have concluded that the ORB is not as efficient as the start screen, the all apps area, the edge UI and the hot corners. It would be illogical for them to offer something that is inefficient in the view of the engineering teams. Can you imagine a group of high level professionals with PHD's and other expertise sitting around a conference table discussing a start menu? It is typical and expected that many will believe the old ways to be better than the new. The engineering department disagrees. Instead of a flop, I think it will be an anti-flop.
    Last edited by mdmd; 08 Sep 2012 at 05:14.
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  4. #1184


    Quote Originally Posted by mdmd View Post
    If most want to see the desktop automatically, what you are saying is they want to do nothing essentially. Pressing the desktop tile (or not) does nothing except take you to another screen. Then you have to do something else to get going. You have to punch a taskbar icon or run your start button. If you did that from the start screen, you would already be there.
    And just like pressing the desktop tile does nothing but take you to another screen, that's what I maintain that going to start or pressing the Windows key is doing. So, if i'm using classic desktop apps and already on the desktop, why would I want to have to press a key to get back to start, and then click a button to launch an app, when I could simply punch a button on the taskbar in the desktop and be right there already.

    Quote Originally Posted by mdmd View Post
    Now there are complaints about the drab look. I thought you were a serious desktop professional. And you want fancy visuals? Pretty edges? Transparency?
    It's a personal preference I guess. While I don't ever leave transparency enabled in Windows 7, I find that Windows 8 looks meh. It does feel like a step backwards from the direction that we were going.
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  5. #1185


    Posts : 248
    Windows 8 RTM (Retinas taking damage...)


    Just saying, the easiest way to get to the control panel items is to open charms, settings, tiles, then show administrative tools. This doesn't get the whole control panel, but it gets all of the most used ones. Also, the WinX menu is insanely well hidden. I don't think anyone can find out about it without someone else telling them.
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  6. #1186


    Posts : 534
    Windows 7, Windows 8 RP


    Quote Originally Posted by phailyoor View Post
    Just saying, the easiest way to get to the control panel items is to open charms, settings, tiles, then show administrative tools. This doesn't get the whole control panel, but it gets all of the most used ones. Also, the WinX menu is insanely well hidden. I don't think anyone can find out about it without someone else telling them.
    Disagree, the easiest is right clicking the bottom left corner and selecting Control Panel, works from anywhere. It's really no different than current left clicking the Orb in 7 and selecting Control Panel.
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  7. #1187


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    There is nothing wrong with having pinned links to the taskbar and doing everything on the classic desktop. Some never use the start menu. Some might not need to use the start screen. It's fine to pin stuff to the classic desktop window. It's fine to use dock launchers. The start screen, all apps, edge UI, and hot corners are there to use if needed. It has nothing to do with metro apps. You don't need to use a key to get back. That's what hot corners are for. Don't know why I am on this thread. It is extremely quick to run the mouse to the left bottom corner, click, then click tile and you're back. (.05 second). Launch from taskbar > great! Or from the desktop, top right to charms, search > 1 click to all apps > everything is there for the non administrative user. Administrative Tools folder has to be pinned to the start screen or elsewhere. Part of the problem that will develop with all these coming disablers, is that disenchanted folks are going to try to turn Windows 8 into Windows 7 with a service pack. Disabling the edge UI and hot corners is a partial disable of Windows 8. If a user wants a more pleasing appearance on the desktop, I am sure someone will satisfy that need down the road. As discussed elsewhere, the start screen is more than a launcher, and is available to use if you want to. One does not have to. Again though, if a disabler takes out the edge UI, then a start menu must be installed. It's all about the edges, the thumbnailing, snapping, and corners (right and left clicking). It's a little like playing a musical instrument. I went back to 7 and Vista for a while to reminiscence and found myself missing the corners and edges. As for the control panel > from the desktop > again it's 1 click to all apps (search). All apps is very important if one is going to use it as designed. If folks want to edit the registry to make 8 something else or disable features of 8 to make it more comfortable, they can but they no longer have the system as it was designed. And it was designed to be better than before. I feel like I am beating a dead horse here. If one does not like Windows 8, then, oh well... Windows 7, ur, ... get a disabler. I still think instead of a flop, Windows 8 will be an anti-flop.
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  8. #1188


    Posts : 2
    windows8


    Really don't know why you don't like W8 and I don't care! But I personally think W8 it's the best Microsoft has ever developed!
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  9. #1189


    USA/Tenn/Oak Ridge
    Posts : 245
    Win 8.1 Pro 64 Bit


    Quote Originally Posted by klauspabst View Post
    Really don't know why you don't like W8 and I don't care! But I personally think W8 it's the best Microsoft has ever developed!
    I agree... It's really up to each person to decide if they want to use Win 8 or not. I'm using Win7 and I plan on upgrading to Win8 at the end of Oct. For me Win8 does just what I want it to do and that's all that matters.. and yes I've tested it a lot.

    Is it the best OS from MS... hard to say right now.. time will tell. It's got to do a lot to beat Win7, IMO. I've read quite a bit on what people don't like and like in Win8 and at the end of the day it's up to me to decide if it's something I want to use as my primary OS. I figure that for 40$ it's worth a shot and the worst is I just re-install Win7.

    Just my 2c,, as usual YMMV.
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  10. #1190


    Posts : 2
    windows8


    Quote Originally Posted by BunnyJ View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by klauspabst View Post
    Really don't know why you don't like W8 and I don't care! But I personally think W8 it's the best Microsoft has ever developed!
    I agree... It's really up to each person to decide if they want to use Win 8 or not. I'm using Win7 and I plan on upgrading to Win8 at the end of Oct. For me Win8 does just what I want it to do and that's all that matters.. and yes I've tested it a lot.

    Is it the best OS from MS... hard to say right now.. time will tell. It's got to do a lot to beat Win7, IMO. I've read quite a bit on what people don't like and like in Win8 and at the end of the day it's up to me to decide if it's something I want to use as my primary OS. I figure that for 40$ it's worth a shot and the worst is I just re-install Win7.

    Just my 2c,, as usual YMMV.
    I agree 100 % with you!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

This will be Microsofts biggest ever flop, far bigger than Vista.
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