Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


What we are REALLY getting with Windows 8

  1. #11


    Posts : 162
    windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Lonewolf View Post
    ADRz, no one is telling you that. BUT from what I am seeing, it SEEMS as though MS is heading to the tablet arena. (To myself as least) I agree with you, if you are currently happy with your current tablet O/S then stay with it. With the 2 tablets I mention,
    it appears that Windows 8 would be at home on them. I see this as being a better fit for Windows 8 than a desktop/laptop enviroment.
    Yes, it may be a better fit for Win8. My point was that any comparisons of Win8 in that area should be with iOS and Android (their current versions), not with the desktop version of Win7.

    Thus, if anybody wants potential users to gravitate to Win8 tablets, then one must provide solid reasons as to why Win8 is a superior value to iOS or Android. To be honest, I just do not see it. So, it is not only users who are happy with the current mobile OS. As Win users in the mobile area are virtually non-existent, Microsoft must present good reasons as to why Win8 is a better proposition than iOS or Android. Nobody has fleshed out such a rationale, as far as I know.

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  2. #12


    Posts : 993
    Windows 8 pro Retail


    ADRz said [quote] Microsoft must present good reasons as to why Win8 is a better proposition than iOS or Android.[end-quote]

    Why? They didn't for IBM, nor Apple, nor did they do it for Sony, or Nintendo. As well as not for Osbourne, nor Atari! They JUST took those markets, and steamed rolled thru the competition, and EVEN now they have the Linux camp sweating heavily. Seriously ADRz Do you believe in your heart if Microsoft wants the Tablet market, they won't crush Android, and iOS? I still say THIS is their move onto that market. And with the announcement on the message boards at MSDN that 2500 Couriers will be going to beta testers this upcoming February I'm starting to feel the BULLDOZER (Microsoft) coming down on them!
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  3. #13


    Posts : 162
    windows 7


    [QUOTE=Mike Lonewolf;52029]ADRz said
    Microsoft must present good reasons as to why Win8 is a better proposition than iOS or Android.[end-quote]

    Why? They didn't for IBM, nor Apple, nor did they do it for Sony, or Nintendo. As well as not for Osbourne, nor Atari! They JUST took those markets, and steamed rolled thru the competition, and EVEN now they have the Linux camp sweating heavily. Seriously ADRz Do you believe in your heart if Microsoft wants the Tablet market, they won't crush Android, and iOS? I still say THIS is their move onto that market. And with the announcement on the message boards at MSDN that 2500 Couriers will be going to beta testers this upcoming February I'm starting to feel the BULLDOZER (Microsoft) coming down on them!
    Well, I am not sure that most have the sense of a Microsoft "bulldozer" effect in the mobile space. In fact, most analysts in the area believe that Microsoft would do well to make it into 3rd place in this area. Personally, I do not believe that Microsoft would make an impression in this market segment.

    You have not told me as yet as to why you believe that consumers will pick up MS tablets vs iOS or Android. What do you think that these tablets would be able to do that the competition cannot do?

    No, I do not feel any "bulldozer" coming in any shape or form. I think that MS would not be able to compete against the iPad and the various Kindles because it cannot even come close to their pricing point and because it cannot offer anything comparable in terms of ecosystem.

    Microsoft would be offering tablets through 3rd party vendors. So, let's assume that HP, Dell and Lenovo start selling Win8 tablets. Now, what can these companies offer that it would be in any way similar to the Apple and Amazon offerings??? They cannot even come close, right? Amazon and Apple can afford to give away the hardware at cost (or even take a small loss) because they can make so much money from books, films and music. What would be Dell's motivation to offer a cheap tablet???? Why would Lenovo put out a $200 tablet??? I do not see it happening, sorry!!!

    Then, you have Windows Phone that had the Metro UI for a year or more and has a tiny market share. Where was the "bulldozer" here???? I think that you have it all upside down!!!
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  4. #14


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Well, there is another thread where I've posted quite a bit about new desktop usable features of Windows 8.

    Wow, this is ridiculous. It's like people think A DEVELOPER PREVIEW BUILD OF A NEW WINDOWS OPERATING SYSTEM IS THE FINAL VERSION. It's not! Microsoft has said themselves that they've included a working Start Screen for developers to build in. It's a shell of a final version. The DP of 8 is only focused for developing in the Start Screen. Of course there aren't many significant benefits or features of 8 in the Desktop because Microsoft needs working apps for the beta build for tablet users and metro app users. It's a whole new interface to build in. The Desktop benefits will probably come in the beta where we'll see what Windows 8 will do for the Desktop computing experience. Until then, all those naysayers need to sod off from major judgments of a non-matured OS. Geez.....
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  5. #15


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    [QUOTE=ADRz;52033]
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Lonewolf View Post
    ADRz said
    Microsoft must present good reasons as to why Win8 is a better proposition than iOS or Android.[end-quote]

    Why? They didn't for IBM, nor Apple, nor did they do it for Sony, or Nintendo. As well as not for Osbourne, nor Atari! They JUST took those markets, and steamed rolled thru the competition, and EVEN now they have the Linux camp sweating heavily. Seriously ADRz Do you believe in your heart if Microsoft wants the Tablet market, they won't crush Android, and iOS? I still say THIS is their move onto that market. And with the announcement on the message boards at MSDN that 2500 Couriers will be going to beta testers this upcoming February I'm starting to feel the BULLDOZER (Microsoft) coming down on them!
    Well, I am not sure that most have the sense of a Microsoft "bulldozer" effect in the mobile space. In fact, most analysts in the area believe that Microsoft would do well to make it into 3rd place in this area. Personally, I do not believe that Microsoft would make an impression in this market segment.

    You have not told me as yet as to why you believe that consumers will pick up MS tablets vs iOS or Android. What do you think that these tablets would be able to do that the competition cannot do?

    No, I do not feel any "bulldozer" coming in any shape or form. I think that MS would not be able to compete against the iPad and the various Kindles because it cannot even come close to their pricing point and because it cannot offer anything comparable in terms of ecosystem.

    Microsoft would be offering tablets through 3rd party vendors. So, let's assume that HP, Dell and Lenovo start selling Win8 tablets. Now, what can these companies offer that it would be in any way similar to the Apple and Amazon offerings??? They cannot even come close, right? Amazon and Apple can afford to give away the hardware at cost (or even take a small loss) because they can make so much money from books, films and music. What would be Dell's motivation to offer a cheap tablet???? Why would Lenovo put out a $200 tablet??? I do not see it happening, sorry!!!

    Then, you have Windows Phone that had the Metro UI for a year or more and has a tiny market share. Where was the "bulldozer" here???? I think that you have it all upside down!!!
    Don't underestimate manufacturers. Ever. Don't underestimate Microsoft's competitiveness. Ever.

    Why do you believe that the Windows Phone 7 hasn't made an impact on consumers out of curiosity?
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  6. #16


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by ADRz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Lonewolf View Post
    ADRz, no one is telling you that. BUT from what I am seeing, it SEEMS as though MS is heading to the tablet arena. (To myself as least) I agree with you, if you are currently happy with your current tablet O/S then stay with it. With the 2 tablets I mention,
    it appears that Windows 8 would be at home on them. I see this as being a better fit for Windows 8 than a desktop/laptop enviroment.
    Yes, it may be a better fit for Win8. My point was that any comparisons of Win8 in that area should be with iOS and Android (their current versions), not with the desktop version of Win7.

    Thus, if anybody wants potential users to gravitate to Win8 tablets, then one must provide solid reasons as to why Win8 is a superior value to iOS or Android. To be honest, I just do not see it. So, it is not only users who are happy with the current mobile OS. As Win users in the mobile area are virtually non-existent, Microsoft must present good reasons as to why Win8 is a better proposition than iOS or Android. Nobody has fleshed out such a rationale, as far as I know.
    It's the same reason as the Windows Phone argument, it's purely different. It can go against the android and win in the major categories of practicality and design. With an android, you get a jailbroken iphone with a crap ton of apps and crap ton of questionable apps that might be trying to get your banking info. With an iphone, you get something that hasn't geneuinly changed since 2006 OTHER than the app store. You still get the main basic apps, and you have a store to buy apps that make up for the lack of features. With a Windows Phone 7, you get something that is truly original, not a copycat build, not something that won't change. You get a device that is actually smart at keeping you connected with people. You'd think by now that would be obvious with smartphones, but not so. You also get the fastest growing app marketplace among them. In 15 or so months of the Windows Phone Marketplace, there are over 50,000 apps. It took iOS 12, it took android 18 months. Better proposition in my rational opinion.
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  7. #17


    You'd think by now that would be obvious with smartphones, but not so. You also get the fastest growing app marketplace among them. In 15 or so months of the Windows Phone Marketplace, there are over 50,000 apps. It took iOS 12, it took android 18 months. Better proposition in my rational opinion.
    Good point
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  8. #18


    Posts : 993
    Windows 8 pro Retail


    Coke Robot I would like to subscribe to your newsletter <g>
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  9. #19


    Posts : 162
    windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post

    Don't underestimate manufacturers. Ever. Don't underestimate Microsoft's competitiveness. Ever.

    Why do you believe that the Windows Phone 7 hasn't made an impact on consumers out of curiosity?
    I do not underestimate anything. But none of the major manufacturers has any proven record of selling tablets and for a good reason. They are in the hardware business, they are not in the content provision business. They are neither Apple nor Amazon. They can only appeal to businesses which are the major purchasers of their products. Thus, their tablets are and will be targeted to businesses (if they need them), not consumers. Neither Lenovo, Dell or HP have any ecosystem to support consumer-oriented tablets. Nor can they offer tablets at $200 because they have no way of making money through content. Dell had a 7'' inch tablet out there for quite some time until it finally killed for poor sales. Amazon, on the other hand, sold untold millions of Kindle Fires. At $199, they are an impulse buy. At over $500, it gets to be a different proposition. At that level, nothing beats the iPad.

    Why do you even ask about the impact of Windows Phone 7 with the consumers. It even trails Symbian for market share!!!! Even in the US, it has a 5% market share and it is actually declining. Despite "Mango", it had an underwhelming performance during the holidays. So, despite lots of advertising, it has been a commercial flop. None of the WP phones even offer LTE speeds nor do they support multi-core processors. WP may get to be competitive at some time, but it would not be any time soon.

    In November, I had to get a new phone. I examined very carefully WP7.5 and Android phones and decided to buy an Android (The Galaxy SII Skyrocket). In fact, I believe that you would have reached the same decision. If you are presented with a phone with very limited customization capability, no expandability, no access to the file system versus one that has all these and much more (almost infinite customization capability, additional storage, true multitasking, LTE speeds, dual-core processor, etc, etc) why pick up the first? It makes no sense. WP7 is not Windows, it is a new and very closed OS.
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  10. #20


    Posts : 162
    windows 7


    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post

    It's the same reason as the Windows Phone argument, it's purely different. It can go against the android and win in the major categories of practicality and design. With an android, you get a jailbroken iphone with a crap ton of apps and crap ton of questionable apps that might be trying to get your banking info. With an iphone, you get something that hasn't geneuinly changed since 2006 OTHER than the app store. You still get the main basic apps, and you have a store to buy apps that make up for the lack of features. With a Windows Phone 7, you get something that is truly original, not a copycat build, not something that won't change. You get a device that is actually smart at keeping you connected with people. You'd think by now that would be obvious with smartphones, but not so. You also get the fastest growing app marketplace among them. In 15 or so months of the Windows Phone Marketplace, there are over 50,000 apps. It took iOS 12, it took android 18 months. Better proposition in my rational opinion.

    Sorry, but the above indicates total ignorance of iOS 5.0 and Android. I doubt that you have used these OSes at all. If you knew even the basics about Android, you would have known that it can do much of the same thing as WP7 through widgets and hubs. It so happens that it is up to the user to select what to run. iOS has also a certain level of integration.

    On the other hand, WP7 is visually uninteresting. Have you ever used it? I have. Beyond the opening screen of squares, there is nothing, just a long list of apps. In fact, any integration is just skin-deep and some is not even there. There is very limited customisability and there is no access to the file system or capability of attaching more storage. Nor can you "sideload" apps (which you can easily do in Android). It does not support most modern hardware. So, if you are such a great supporter, why would you choose it over Android?

    In addition, let me inform you that you need to "root" Android phones as you "jailbreak" an iPhone.
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