Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Automatic shutdown disables Fast Startup?

  1. #11


    Posts : 1,093
    Windows 8 Pro Windows 8.1 Preview


    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by JustATest View Post
    Now I'm not getting it again. Doesn't an offered option have to be acknowledged? If its a tickbox in the application somewhere, uncheck it. However, if you are in the middle of running a program (and you know it executing), then shame on anyone who tries to shutdown during a known running process. I'm not talking about background processes. I'm talking about shutting down while Adobe Photoshop is in the middle of a 100mb image conversion (or similar function).
    I think you are making things more complicated than they are! Nothing/no one is forcing a shutdown. Take utorrent for example. It's crammed with such options in its autoshutdown menu. Other applications, mostly video encoders, just have a "switch" that you can change any time, while they are working. They don't "acknowledge" it, they just check the state of the switch when their job is done. Yes, you might run into problems if you program an application to shutdown Windows, when you also have other ones working, but there is no reason a user should do that and it's not what I describe anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vadikan View Post
    AmigaRoots, it's possible that these applications invoke full shutdown, the same way this command does (note the /f switch).
    Code:
    shutdown /s /f /t 0
    This sounds quite likely. I don't know the technical differences between a full shutdown and a "user" shutdown, but obviously the full one disables Fast Startup (or enables other stuff that significantly increase boot-time). Maybe all these applications need to update their auto-shutdown method, because things have changed from Windows 7 (Fast Startup), and what in Win 7 was a "normal" shutdown, in 8 is a shutdown without Fast Startup.
    Sounds like you already know more than I do so just go fix it. Then tell us how you did it and I'll rep you for the fix. Fair enough? goodbye...

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  2. #12


    Posts : 480
    Windows 8 Pro x64


    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    This sounds quite likely. I don't know the technical differences between a full shutdown and a "user" shutdown, but obviously the full one disables Fast Startup (or enables other stuff that significantly increase boot-time). Maybe all these applications need to update their auto-shutdown method, because things have changed from Windows 7 (Fast Startup), and what in Win 7 was a "normal" shutdown, in 8 is a shutdown without Fast Startup.
    I think you got it the other way around. It's incorrect to say "disables", I'd rather say that full shutdown or restart bypass fast startup for the reasons outlined above.

    1. In Windows 7, when you shut down or restart, you log off the user and shut down the system. When you turn on your PC, system restarts and user logs on.

    2. In Windows 8, when you shut down, you log off the user and hibernate the system. When you turn on your PC, system resumes from hibernate and user logs on.

    3. In Windows 8, when you do full shutdown (/f switch) or restart, you get the same result as in point 1.

    The whole thing is for people who can't drop a habit of turning off their PCs at EOD instead of letting it sleep or hibernate. For technical details, refer to Delivering fast boot times in Windows 8 - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #13


    Posts : 47
    Windows 8.1 Pro x64


    Quote Originally Posted by JustATest View Post
    Sounds like you already know more than I do so just go fix it. Then tell us how you did it and I'll rep you for the fix. Fair enough? goodbye...


    Quote Originally Posted by Vadikan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    This sounds quite likely. I don't know the technical differences between a full shutdown and a "user" shutdown, but obviously the full one disables Fast Startup (or enables other stuff that significantly increase boot-time). Maybe all these applications need to update their auto-shutdown method, because things have changed from Windows 7 (Fast Startup), and what in Win 7 was a "normal" shutdown, in 8 is a shutdown without Fast Startup.
    I think you got it the other way around. It's incorrect to say "disables", I'd rather say that full shutdown or restart bypass fast startup for the reasons outlined above.

    1. In Windows 7, when you shut down or restart, you log off the user and shut down the system. When you turn on your PC, system restarts and user logs on.

    2. In Windows 8, when you shut down, you log off the user and hibernate the system. When you turn on your PC, system resumes from hibernate and user logs on.

    3. In Windows 8, when you do full shutdown (/f switch) or restart, you get the same result as in point 1.

    The whole thing is for people who can't drop a habit of turning off their PCs at EOD instead of letting it sleep or hibernate. For technical details, refer to Delivering fast boot times in Windows 8 - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs
    Thanks, it's more clear now. It's then up to each application to perform a "Windows 8 shutdown" (log off+hibernate) instead of a "Windows 7 shutdown". I haven't tested yet but it's most probable these applications perform the full shutdown, which yields different results between W8 and the rest.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #14


    Posts : 480
    Windows 8 Pro x64


    I really don't see a reason for applications to perform full shutdown, especially since it requires code changes and doesn't benefit the user. Why don't you test, review event logs and post the results? That way we can put the thread to rest properly
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #15


    Posts : 47
    Windows 8.1 Pro x64


    I don't know where to look for this log... Also, the Powershell code gives me the attached error.
    Other indications: with the 'User' shutdown, I can turn the pc on with a keyboard press. Also, the monitor switches off first and the pc follows after writing its hibernation file for about 5 seconds. Just tried an auto-shutdown, and the pc will not turn on from the keyboard. The monitor and pc switched off almost simultaneously.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails PowerShell error.jpg  
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #16


    Posts : 480
    Windows 8 Pro x64


    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    I don't know where to look for this log...
    Open eventvwr.msc and navigate to Application and Services Logs - Microsoft - Windows - Diagnostics-Performance - Operational

    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    Also, the Powershell code gives me the attached error.
    It's not an error, it says there are no events that match the criteria (meaning it can't find event 100 for some reason).

    Quote Originally Posted by AmigaRoots View Post
    Other indications: with the 'User' shutdown, I can turn the pc on with a keyboard press. Also, the monitor switches off first and the pc follows after writing its hibernation file for about 5 seconds. Just tried an auto-shutdown, and the pc will not turn on from the keyboard. The monitor and pc switched off almost simultaneously.
    Honestly, I have no idea how you configured your power options / keyboard. If you send your PC to hibernation by pressing the keyboard key, it's not a shutdown. See also Sleep and hibernation: frequently asked questions

    Please don't introduce unknown variables while you're testing things and use the menu in Win+I to shutdown or reboot.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #17


    Posts : 47
    Windows 8.1 Pro x64


    Quote Originally Posted by Vadikan View Post
    Honestly, I have no idea how you configured your power options / keyboard. If you send your PC to hibernation by pressing the keyboard key, it's not a shutdown...
    Please don't introduce unknown variables while you're testing things and use the menu in Win+I to shutdown or reboot.
    No, I didn't say I turn off/hibernate the pc with a button. I said that when I shutdown the pc normally myself, the pc will turn on with the press of a keyboard button (the space bar does it, for example, but I think any key will do - haven't tested). It will not turn on with a keyboard button, if it was auto-shutdown (which is most probably the full-shutdown, as you pointed out).

    Ok, I will try to confirm all this from the logs, thanks for the links.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #18


    Posts : 47
    Windows 8.1 Pro x64


    Quote Originally Posted by Vadikan View Post
    If it was a full shutdown, the TimeCreated value will correspond to the time you turned the system on. Otherwise, it was not a full shutdown, because this event is not written to the log when system comes back from the fast startup. Event 300 corresponds to fast startup, because the OS technically resumes from hibernation.
    Just booted from an auto-shutdown and found 1 error entry with Event ID 100 and the current date/time. There was only one more (warning) entry with the current date/time (Event 101).
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Automatic shutdown disables Fast Startup?
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