Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


W8 could be better by REMOVING the desktop APP

  1. #41


    Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Although many factors involved as to why MS is heading in their certain direction, I think it boils down to the processor and the battery. It's about energy consumption with the technology we have today.

    RT is written for a companion to the Windows phone 8 OS, which the phone being the lowest form factor. This is what Jimbo and others are stressing. In addition MS is developing an OS to work across and to be familiar across multiple devices for users. Win32 does not meet this scenario. Metro/Modern RT does. I think that's why the big change.

    The desktop portal will be included for awhile in this transition until all software is written in the Metro/Modern RT interface. The way I understand it is that this software is less resource demanding which meets the lowest common denominator of devices -> the battery. We need batteries because we as societies desire and are becoming ever so more mobile.

    I will commit to researching and writing a thread on batteries and another energy storage device that a man developed a few years ago which is a super capacitor similar to what is found in an electric motor to start up. I haven't heard anything about it since. Probably one of those inventions that got squashed by the battery industry. We all know about these kinds of things.

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  2. #42


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    @ HippsieGypsie> The big difference between a Windows RT device and a Windows 8 device is that Windows RT is written for and runs on devices using ARM processors. There is a big difference between that and Windows 8 or 8 Pro running on a tablet with an x86 based processor. They look the same but RT devices can't run your regular x86 Windows Programs. They would have to be rewritten as Windows RT is effectively a totally different operating system from Windows 8. At least that's my understanding.
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  3. #43


    Yes, that's my understanding. Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro runs both RT and Win32. As I mentioned, when all software is written in the Metro/Modern RT interface the desktop will go bye bye. So will Win32 and x86 processors. At least in mobile devices. To me it boils down to a lower end processor eating up less battery. So it's about the battery if we choose to be more mobile. Isn't this the age we have arrived at? Why would I want to sit behind my PC when I could be outside enjoying nature as well? I am more a part of nature than a machine. I do not desire a machine to control me. I want to control it.

    Take a drink. Take a drive. Go out and see what you can find.
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  4. #44


    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 6,490
    Windows 10 Education 64 Bit


    Windows RT and Windows 8 are two different operating systems. They both run Metro apps but 8 and 8 Pro don't run any RT anything. It's my understanding that Metro is an API and RT is an operating system. I hope that makes sense.
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  5. #45


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Actually, the metro apps are WinRT coded, which is basically a pretty layer on top of the elder Win32 coding. Basically, new plumbing in an old but stable apartment building. Windows RT is a compiled version of Windows for the RISC instruction set.
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  6. #46


    Orbiting the Moon
    Posts : 2,975
    Windows 10 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post
    Yes, that's my understanding. Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro runs both RT and Win32. As I mentioned, when all software is written in the Metro/Modern RT interface the desktop will go bye bye. So will Win32 and x86 processors. At least in mobile devices. To me it boils down to a lower end processor eating up less battery. So it's about the battery if we choose to be more mobile. Isn't this the age we have arrived at? Why would I want to sit behind my PC when I could be outside enjoying nature as well? I am more a part of nature than a machine. I do not desire a machine to control me. I want to control it.
    Don't forget what Win32 stands for. It simply cannot be removed this soon because a lot of software is based on it.
    I think even 32bit metro apps rely on Win32 on the PC.

    Take a drink. Take a drive. Go out and see what you can find.
    In the Summertime, right?
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  7. #47


    Orbiting the Moon
    Posts : 2,975
    Windows 10 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by Coke Robot View Post
    Actually, the metro apps are WinRT coded, which is basically a pretty layer on top of the elder Win32 coding. Basically, new plumbing in an old but stable apartment building. Windows RT is a compiled version of Windows for the RISC instruction set.
    A layer on top of Win32. For those who want the base layer gone, the top will not run anymore.
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  8. #48


    For me, the best way to remove desktop while maintaining support for old programs is by moving all system components to Metro, then replacing desktop with a Win32 emulator.

    Basically the Win32 emulator is an app for Metro, which basically converts Desktop programs to a Metro app (No multiple program windows in one instance while the program being run can have resizeable windows)
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  9. #49


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)

    Doesn't seem likely to be acceptable to business


    Quote Originally Posted by woot332 View Post
    If M$ will ditch the desktop in future they might as well ditch legacy win32 api too.
    Forcing developers to develop windows store apps only and either distibute apps in store or sideloading.
    And rewrite the rest of the OS making it fully "metro" or whatever they call it now lol.
    That been said im not a windows 8 hater in fact I like it.
    There are a lot of businesses (allegedly) that still run XP (and IE6) because they can't replace the software they have and it won't run properly on later versions of Windows.

    If businesses aren't buying W8, despite the fact that all of their old software (allegedly) runs on it, what makes you think they will buy a new OS, which will require the replacement of all of their software (and probably their hardware too)?

    I suppose that they could force their employees to buy the necessary hardware and software (BYOD).
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  10. #50


    Posts : 835
    Win 8.1 Pro


    Actually, you will be seeing a lot of BYOD, but you are also going to see a lot more virtualization via cloud services, both public and private. Remote Desktop Environments and Dumb Terminals (terminal Services), we are going to make a loop back to the 80's and early 90's.

    But I will say this, IF, they implement Metro apps in the way you can using Stardock MetroMix, ONLY Then could i see getting rid of the desktop on some devices,,, MAYbe.......

    Sorry, but having full screen apps or 33/66 apps running is a real pain, especially when you can't actually resize them
    Not all apps require all that space to be dedicated. they just don't.

    I have 3 monitors running Win7, I have 7+ apps going at any one time. On one screen I have 3 apps (Notepad scratch space, the app I use for recording data, and another app) To do the job I have, there is no way in hell that I could be at all efficient with 8 Metro Apps only, no way, can't be done, it would literally suck the life out of me.

    I like what they are trying to do with the underlying code of integration between devices and synch, but they should have done a MetroMix out of the box with better scaling for the apps in windowed mode.

    Sorry, but if the Desktop goes away from Windows Completely, it really will be the end of Microsoft.

    Desktop is essential to true multitask computing.

    Again, without the ability to have some way of making apps be almost any size feasible (like we do have in most desktop apps), that true multitasking will disappear, we will be back where we started 20 years ago. How simply stupid is that?
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W8 could be better by REMOVING the desktop APP
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