Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Here's what I think would fix Windows 8:

  1. #1


    Posts : 11
    Windows 7 Professional SP1 64bit

    Here's what I think would have worked with Windows 8:


    Instead of replacing the Start menu with "Metro" (or whatever they're calling it now), I think they should have replaced the desktop background and icons with it as a customizable active desktop, where you could still have your app icons, only they could be these more active icons as in "Metro," and they should have left the Start menu alone.

    I think this would have gone over a lot better, and I might have eventually updated to it instead of deciding to skip Windows 8 altogether whenever I can, waiting for what's next and hopefully better.

    So this is what I think might have helped Windows 8 be accepted. Let me know what you think. (But this isn't a discussion about the validity of my opinion one way or the other. Windows 8 isn't something "I need to get used to;" it unfortunately is something "I don't want to use.")
    Last edited by Wrend; 03 Feb 2013 at 16:55.

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  2. #2


    Posts : 1,925
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    All these ideas people express about how to make Windows 8 better are all based on a single misunderstanding.

    Metro is *NOT* Win32. It's not just a new UI. It's an entirely different operating system that runs side-by-side the old Win32 operating system. You can't just make Win32 and Metro work together in the same application (the desktop). This is the reason that Metro is full screen, because the only way to "share" the two OS's is to have one of them control the monitor. In the case of Windows 8, Metro (it's real name is WinRT for Windows RunTime) owns the monitor it is currently on. If you see a desktop on that monitor, it's actually a metro application that views the desktop, sort of like Remote Desktop. This is why you can "close" the desktop window by using alt-f4, or moving the mouse cursor to the top and dragging it to the bottom. (if you have multiple displays, you will notice that you can't do that with the other monitors)

    Metro apps are physically separate from Win32/Desktop apps. They are different OS's and they cannot really work together very well, other than some really terrible hacks (such as how IE is able to display in Metro mode).

    Keeping this simple concept in mind, you will find you have a greater understanding of why Windows 8 works the way it does.
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  3. #3


    Posts : 11
    Windows 7 Professional SP1 64bit


    This thread isn't so much about how Windows 8 works as it is about how Windows 8 should work (in my and your guys' opinions).

    So, for clarity, title changed to: "Here's what I think would have worked with Windows 8:"
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  4. #4


    Posts : 1,925
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    And my point is that it's more or less impossible for it to work that way, given what it is.
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  5. #5


    Posts : 835
    Win 8.1 Pro


    I have contended that they took what should have been done through Gadgets and replaced it with Metro.
    However, there was no real control over gadgets, this I think they could have worked on more.

    Apps that would have run like Gadgets from the desktop (not full screen, but windowed) with a Store App that opened on the desktop (similar to Pokki) would have been much more accepted I think.

    But, the control that MS has now over Apps that are submitted to the App Store are much better and safer than Gadgets were.
    The Metro environment is designed for running apps safely. However, there are some apps that I really don't want to run full screen, it's not a deal killer for me. Windows 8 is a pretty nice OS over all. Even with Metro the way it is.

    So, coulda been, shoulda been done better? Sure.
    Works great as it is? Yes.
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  6. #6


    Posts : 11
    Windows 7 Professional SP1 64bit


    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    And my point is that it's more or less impossible for it to work that way, given what it is.
    I see what I'm describing more as just a GUI issue. Surly displaying and scrolling through gridded icons and active rectangular pictures on a screen that also has a pop up menu in the bottom left corner and a task bar along the bottom isn't that hard to accomplish for a world class OS designer.

    Nothing runs on the screen. It's just displayed there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tepid View Post
    ...
    Yeah, that's along the lines of what I'm talking about. Thanks for sharing your opinion.
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  7. #7


    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    All these ideas people express about how to make Windows 8 better are all based on a single misunderstanding.

    Metro is *NOT* Win32. It's not just a new UI. It's an entirely different operating system that runs side-by-side the old Win32 operating system. You can't just make Win32 and Metro work together in the same application (the desktop). This is the reason that Metro is full screen, because the only way to "share" the two OS's is to have one of them control the monitor. In the case of Windows 8, Metro (it's real name is WinRT for Windows RunTime) owns the monitor it is currently on. If you see a desktop on that monitor, it's actually a metro application that views the desktop, sort of like Remote Desktop. This is why you can "close" the desktop window by using alt-f4, or moving the mouse cursor to the top and dragging it to the bottom. (if you have multiple displays, you will notice that you can't do that with the other monitors)

    Metro apps are physically separate from Win32/Desktop apps. They are different OS's and they cannot really work together very well, other than some really terrible hacks (such as how IE is able to display in Metro mode).

    Keeping this simple concept in mind, you will find you have a greater understanding of why Windows 8 works the way it does.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    And my point is that it's more or less impossible for it to work that way, given what it is.

    Mystere ▬ Thanks for great answers around these forums. They are usually simple & clear enough so that even those of us with only some pc knowledge can actually understand. Without going to google for definition of unpopular word.

    I've actually had no problems with 8. I knew it works the way it does. Now I know why.

    You make a great teacher.

    Ron
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  8. #8


    Wrend, now that you have written that the Microsoft team will redesign Windows 8 the way you wrote. LOL. I mean they did it that way because they decided to do it that way. They wanted the mobile phone design on your computer.
    Mystere, If Metro can launch Win32 apps what prevented Microsoft from making it look like a real desktop? ...other than ideology?
    Anyway running two OSes at the same time is terribly complicated and ineffective. At least they should have allowed Metro apps to run into DOS Prompt windows, or allocating only part of the screen while the rest of the screen is being used by Windows. I can imagine Metro apps running in a division of the monitor screen equal to 25% of its width.
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  9. #9


    Quote Originally Posted by Fredledingue View Post
    Wrend, now that you have written that the Microsoft team will redesign Windows 8 the way you wrote. LOL. I mean they did it that way because they decided to do it that way. They wanted the mobile phone design on your computer.
    Mystere, If Metro can launch Win32 apps what prevented Microsoft from making it look like a real desktop? ...other than ideology?
    Anyway running two OSes at the same time is terribly complicated and ineffective. At least they should have allowed Metro apps to run into DOS Prompt windows, or allocating only part of the screen while the rest of the screen is being used by Windows. I can imagine Metro apps running in a division of the monitor screen equal to 25% of its width.
    Are you sure about 25%?
    Have you tried opening
    1. Weather app from start screen
    2. Grab it at top & drag it to left or right edge
    3. Press Widows key
    4. Open another app


    Sometimes we just have to accept things as they are.
    I have a kitchen stove that burns Natural gas or LP gas.
    But I cannot run the oven off LP gas while using Natural gas for the top burners.
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  10. #10


    Adelaide
    Posts : 1,338
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 17.1 MATE (64 bit)


    Quote Originally Posted by Fredledingue View Post

    Mystere, If Metro can launch Win32 apps what prevented Microsoft from making it look like a real desktop? ...other than ideology?
    Indeed.
    They could have written Metro to run in 100x100 windows if they had felt like it.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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