Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Why they designed Windows 8 the way they did

  1. #51


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    Quote Originally Posted by nick View Post
    Touch can be successfully applied to the desktop / laptop using a multitouch pad. Apple has proved this very successfully. Applying a good touchpad to Windows 8 makes it much more usable on the desktop.
    That's fine. o.k. ...but I have been using a Logitech multitouch pad for about 2 months and have currently decided to shelve it in favor of a Logitech performance mx (mouse). I find the mouse to be perhaps a little better as a device to use in any Windows OS.

    Quote Originally Posted by nick View Post
    I do think eliminating any hierarchical containment in Metro was a huge mistake. I also think the jarring transition between Metro, Desktop and Full Screen Apps is confusing and shows poor UI design.
    Your POV is yours. That's fine. o.k. I am sooooo glad MS has eliminated the annoyance of nesting hierarchies.
    Also, I find nothing jarring about metro and desktop. Not confusing. .... and it is amusing to me that thousands of engineers and hundreds of millions of dollars were spent to design Windows 8, that anyone can say it shows poor UI design. Each to their own POV.

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  2. #52


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by nick View Post
    Touch can be successfully applied to the desktop / laptop using a multitouch pad. Apple has proved this very successfully. Applying a good touchpad to Win8 makes it much more usable on the desktop. I do think eliminating any hierarchical containment in Metro was a huge mistake. I also think the jarring transition between Metro, Desktop and Full Screen Apps is confusing and shows poor UI design.
    If the touchpads work like that on laptops, they'd be completely useless for me, as they never seem to work with my fingers, too dry or something.

    Actually, your last point is raises another issue that completely baffles me about the Modern interface. You have a large (or two in my case) monitor and you always have to use the applications full screen. Why on earth didn't Microsoft allow the apps to open at any (or at least selective) sizes, so that you could open a number of them at once on a single/multiple screen?

    How good would it have been if you could open apps to a size to suit your needs, place them where you want them and retain that size and location every time you started Windows. Olso, once the apps are in those positions, you could use them without them filling the screen (in case anyone misunderstands what I'm suggesting). And if you wanted to open up a lesser use app, you just went to another start screen, just like you do now (or something like a start button).

    There's been such a focus on touch, where one applciation is open, that there really doesn't seem to have been much focus on functionality where one wants to do things with many applications.
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  3. #53


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by mdmd View Post
    .... and it is amusing to me that thousands of engineers and hundreds of millions of dollars were spent to design Windows 8, that anyone can say it shows poor UI design. Each to their own POV.
    .

    No product that has had thousands of engineers and hundreds of millons of dollars spent on it has ever failed in the marketplace. Oh, wait...
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  4. #54


    Posts : 1,320
    Server 2012 / 8.0


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mdmd View Post
    .... and it is amusing to me that thousands of engineers and hundreds of millions of dollars were spent to design Windows 8, that anyone can say it shows poor UI design. Each to their own POV.
    .

    No product that has had thousands of engineers and hundreds of millons of dollars spent on it has ever failed in the marketplace. Oh, wait...
    It might fail. 8 certainly does not have the numbers 7 had at this point. You are correct. The marketplace has shown less than enthusiastic response to 8. My POV is that, it is not poor UI design, but rather a shock to what people are used to. People are used to the Windows 95 and NT paradigm and most, it would seem, are having some difficulty with 8. They don't like the apps, the metro, the tiles, the apparent duality and hidden features. Anyone could hold the POV that 8 has a poor UI design, but that view makes no sense to me. From watching the OP video about UX week, the presentation did, IMO, lack some UI details. The MS rep should have addressed the start menu vs the apps area rather than focus on metro apps. They do have a right to be commercial in their approach to UI design but the backlash from dedicated traditionalists will probably damage their profitability. Who knows? I do not. I haven't heard of any major marketplace disaster for Windows 8 to date except for the endless hostile reviews of article writers and commentators whose job it is to create controversy. So far, millions of downloads have occurred, and millions of devices will be running Windows 8.
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  5. #55


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    I'm not so sure that people find it a shock. I certainly didn't, as it's been publicised for ages and I tried the preview releases, before I bought two licences, but it still boils down to functionality. Windows 8 Modern interface isn't completely functional. It certainly works to the extent that it was designed to work, but as I pointed out in my earlier post, it seems only half baked. There is so much more that could have been done.

    Firstly, cater to the traditional users, at least in the first few iterations, by retaining the full desktop experience as an alternative to the Modern interface. People would have tried the Modern interface, if for no other reason than curiosity and the fact that there are some useful apps, like the weather one. That would have let them get used to what lay on the other side.

    Secondly, as I suggested, the Modern interface should have allowed for the apps to be sized, displayed and used in a far more versatile way; that's innovation. All that has really been achieved is a desktop full of icons that do nothing more than open full screen to be able to be used. Why can't you open, size, move and use the apps any way that you want? You couldn't do that on a mobile phone screen, effectively anyway, but you could on a tablet or a PC with one, two or as many screens as you have. Why can't I select an icon and swipe it to one screen and open it (to any size) and then do the same with two or three others?

    Or am I being a little too far out there with my radical ideas?
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  6. #56


    Posts : 5,360
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin


    Not far out at all.

    Poor product management.

    MS deserve a bloody nose.

    Win8 really should fail.
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  7. #57


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by SIW2 View Post
    Win8 really should fail.
    I personally don't want Windows 8 to fail, but Microsoft needs to be more flexible and imaginative (think outside the square). When I first saw this (and that's just about all you ever saw of Windows 8 in ads, even now) - note: this is not a screen shot of my tablet:

    Click image for larger version

    I actually thought that you could interract with the icons as you saw them on the screen and when you wanted to do something, you'd touch or hover over one of the icons with a mouse and it would expand something like a pop-up and you'd do whatever, or go full screen if you chose. I never envisaged that the icons would just be a button (though some show changing results etc) that took you to a full page and everything else would disappear.

    My fault in some respects for not playing fully with them when I tried the pre-release versions briefly, but I also thought that the exciting and obvious features like that were going to arrive in the full version, that is, keep the really interesting stuff quiet for a time.

    If this really is all that Windows 8 is going to offer, it's not going to excite the mainstream greatly at all and the complaints will keep rolling in and sales will go no where.
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  8. #58


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Attachment 12828




    This slapped my eyeballs. Rather busy to me... and a little distracting...
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  9. #59


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    I'm not so sure that people find it a shock. I certainly didn't, as it's been publicised for ages and I tried the preview releases, before I bought two licences, but it still boils down to functionality. Windows 8 Modern interface isn't completely functional. It certainly works to the extent that it was designed to work, but as I pointed out in my earlier post, it seems only half baked. There is so much more that could have been done.

    Firstly, cater to the traditional users, at least in the first few iterations, by retaining the full desktop experience as an alternative to the Modern interface. People would have tried the Modern interface, if for no other reason than curiosity and the fact that there are some useful apps, like the weather one. That would have let them get used to what lay on the other side.

    Secondly, as I suggested, the Modern interface should have allowed for the apps to be sized, displayed and used in a far more versatile way; that's innovation. All that has really been achieved is a desktop full of icons that do nothing more than open full screen to be able to be used. Why can't you open, size, move and use the apps any way that you want? You couldn't do that on a mobile phone screen, effectively anyway, but you could on a tablet or a PC with one, two or as many screens as you have. Why can't I select an icon and swipe it to one screen and open it (to any size) and then do the same with two or three others?

    Or am I being a little too far out there with my radical ideas?
    I think as you said insinuated, the Desktop and All Apps aren't too radically different, just that All Apps is neater.

    The Start Screen and start menu aren't really radically different when you break it down. Yes, there may be a few useful apps to have, the rest may not be depending on who you are.

    I say first, learn the new was of Windows 8. There is a full Desktop experience, NOTHING is legitimately taken away other than a few features that weren't being used too much to justify keeping them, like DVD Maker. If anything, Windows 8 makes the Windows 7 Desktop more refined and with a few better useful features, like Hybrid Boot, Defender, and Storage Spaces. I think honestly, if given the use of familiar over not really tested and used, people will default to familiar and it would take too long in the long run to fully adopt the new. The Start Screen has a neat thing, if you're on the Desktop and need Libraries easily accessed from Start, you right click on them and hit Pin to Start. A tile is made!

    Having windowed apps is something I'd like to see happen, but if Windows Phone has anything to say, it's that Live Tiles are what make Windows 8 the new Windows. On Windows Phone, you can have small, medium, or large tiles, all of which are live. So effectively, a small tile is a small window to show a little bit of info, like a missed call or new email. A medium tile gives a bit larger window to peer into to show some new feeds and such. A large tile is a large window that shows more detail to content, like a new email that shows who it's from, and some lines of the email as well as how many you have. That's just a simple mundane example, Windows 8 has a new app platform that has developers that are kind of using Live Tiles. Once more apps have useful Live Tiles, having to open app and resize them won't happen too often. I'd rather open and resize app windows like OneNote or Word or IE and such over having to resize an internet browser window to check into sites every so often.

    I don't think you're too radical, just not radical enough.
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  10. #60


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. Time will tell who is closer to the mark.
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Why they designed Windows 8 the way they did
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