Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Is Windows 8 a failure ? Time to say bye, bye MSFT ?

  1. #121


    Posts : 162
    Windows 8 Pro


    I'm not a big fan for a OS for all devices. It would make it easy to move from device to device with out a learning curve but I think a touch OS for tablets/phones and a OS for desktops would be just fine. I don't ever see myself using a touch screen on a desktop. Reaching over the desk would not last long. I could do things just as fast or faster with a mouse and my arm won't get tired. Touch doesn't seem to make much sense for a desktop. It's great for tablets. I wouldn't buy a laptop with a touch screen either. This is my preference.

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  2. #122


    Posts : 1,925
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    Why does this straw man keep coming up?

    Windows 8 does not *REQUIRE* touch. It's not a touch screen OS. It works perfectly fine with a mouse and keyboard. Nobody is forcing you to buy a touch screen monitor and reach across your desk.

    As such, this entire straw man of an argument is pointless. Great, you don't want touch. You don't have to have touch. Touch is not required.

    Windows 8 works great with a mouse and keyboard AND it works great with a touch screen (or other touch device like a touch pad). You can use it with either.
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  3. #123


    Posts : 5,707
    Windows 8.1 Pro


    But Windows 8 works great with touch.
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  4. #124


    DeLand, FL
    Posts : 380
    Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by legacy7955 View Post
    I'm not against Windows 8 per se, I am against being forced as the consumer to not have a choice between booting to the Metro UI or to the desktop.
    It's NOT that big a deal! The desktop tile is the first one listed on the default Metro screen. Tap it and you're there. If you put your machine to sleep it returns to the desktop when it wakes up. C'mon ... let's give this one (and the missing Start Button) a rest, shall we. It ain't a problem!

    -Max
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  5. #125


    DeLand, FL
    Posts : 380
    Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by legacy7955 View Post
    Sinofsky don't have a job anymore

    Ding, dong, the witch is dead!

    Good bye, fairwell, adieu, Auf Wiedersehen!

    Now to allow the CHOICE of metro or desktop UI at boot. Let's get to it MS.
    Your machine will come up from sleep into wherever you left it. As for where it comes up after boot, who cares? You tap "Desktop" and you're done. You only have to do that again if you cold start again. BIG DEAL! What's REALLY wrong with the thing, eh?

    -Max
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  6. #126


    DeLand, FL
    Posts : 380
    Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by legacy7955 View Post
    Even IF MS would like to see the "desktop" UI disappear, it is NOT going to happen anytime soon, my guess is that it will still be with us in a fairly similar form for at least another decade or more.
    I would be really surprised if MS wanted the desktop to "disappear". Despite all the nonsense going on out there it's still their bread-and-butter. There are huge industries that base their software on the desktop. You're not going to see highly complex software systems just roll over and die to go to a touch-based front-end. The touch-based front-end will augment the desktop metaphor, not replace it.

    The firm I work with (you would know who it is if I told you) is developing in the tablet and smart-phone space. Those things are, however, intended as field-use extensions of a huge web/desktop based system. You're not going to see support for the legacy side (desktop) vanish. We're looking at a shift in balance between the types of equipment, folks. This is not a simple replacement of one technology with another, it is an expansion of the types of user-interface available.

    -Max
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  7. #127


    Australia
    Posts : 716
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM


    If the tile concept of indexing is taken to it's logical conclusion, lets have a full page picture of each chapter of a written book so that adds 30,40 or more pages to the book, as opposed to an alpha numeric index taking one or two.

    Furthermore, do away with "List" view in arranging contents of folders and force everyone to use large icons/tiles, so in one pane of a medium sized window I can only fit 8 instead of 144. Yep, that's really efficient ... in ya dreams!
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  8. #128


    DeLand, FL
    Posts : 380
    Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang View Post
    If the tile concept of indexing is taken to it's logical conclusion, lets have a full page picture of each chapter of a written book so that adds 30,40 or more pages to the book, as opposed to an alpha numeric index taking one or two.

    Furthermore, do away with "List" view in arranging contents of folders and force everyone to use large icons/tiles, so in one pane of a medium sized window I can only fit 8 instead of 144. Yep, that's really efficient ... in ya dreams!
    You know ... I saw it the same way until I used it for awhile. Know what? My Start Screen only has a couple dozen items on it. I thought it would become an unwieldy beast with hundreds of tiles that I have to scroll through on a daily basis. Not so. In practice you only keep what you use frequently on the Start screen. All the hundreds of other things are located in the "All Apps" section that you can access and/or search at any time, easily. When I first set the thing up I discovered that the tiles I don't use I simply unpin from the Start screen, that's all. The Start Screen is like another desktop ... you only leave on there what you use frequently.

    The Start Screen is not supposed​ to be a hierarchical menu system any more than the desktop is. It is a most-frequently-used list that you customize and modify as you use it. True, when you first install a new program (I.E. desktop app like Office or something) all the icons for it get tossed onto the Start Menu. Just go unpin the ones you don't use. They will then still live in the All Apps section where you can go find the unpinned ones later.

    Until I used it for a little while, though, I didn't realize that. The system as I have it set up now is as easy to use as "7" was. It's not as different in the desktop environment as I originally thought. Takes very little effort to customize it the way you want it and then it just works.

    Besides ... it plays one heck of a good game of solitaire!

    -Max
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #129


    Australia
    Posts : 716
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM


    Hi Max,

    But why would I want to do that when I can do it all on my desktop without ever having to leave it?

    As stated in another post, my set up is:

    • Frequent use: 44 Small desktop shortcut icons arranged in 4 groups which occupy about 17% of available space.
    • Less frequent use: 6 Icons in Jump Start menu hidden but at my fingertips.
    • Seldom used: Alphanumberic start menu which occupies about 6% of desktop space, and also neatly hidden away but at my fingertips. In which I can rename files/folders, drag/drop items up/down between main menu and sub-menu, send items to desktop as shortcuts.
    • Orb Start Menu & Jump Start all avialable in case my desktop is totally filled with open windows.
    • Desktop toolbar in taskbar to access desktop shortcuts when open windows are totally obscuring them.
    • By clicking User Name: Access Documents, Favorites, Contacts, etc ... as well as AppData.
    • Right panel of Start menu: Access Computer, Control Panel, etc.


    And aside from creating desktop icons, I don't have to delete, group, or rearrange anything. It's all set up in alphabetical order. So why create extra work? And furthemore, most apps when first loaded have option ticked to create desktop shortcut. So 80% are already done.

    My desktop icons include shortcuts to: Storage partition, optical drives, eSATA & eUSB hard drives, internal storage HD, Office, Inet browser, Mail, Scanner, Run command, Gadgets if I want them, etc, etc.

    On a 24 inch wide screen with high res, I'll have up to 5 or even 6 windows open simultaneously on desktop, and never need to leave. Show me how metro is more efficient than that?

    I get enough of going crazy with my Sony Ericsson smartfone Android tile GUI without adding it to my desktop PC. Metro can be made to do all the same things traditional W7 does. And is a nice toy for social networking, etc. But for serious desktop work ... No way Hosea! Not in a million years.

    In all sincerity, I have never met one hands-on PC techo who does not use alpha-numeric cascaded menus ... and I know quite a few. My son is one, and he did his "apprenticeship" for a full year, 40 hours/week, in a Goverment run department dedicated to training PC technicians with hands on experience, and he mirrored my feelings on it.

    Not that I ape his every move. In fact when I ask him for help he usually tells me to stop being lazy and do my own research! lol! Unless I'm really in a tight spot ... which is often!

    Getting back to main topic. I wouldn't call W8 a failure. But I would guess that's very largely due to third party hacks enabling restore of traditional desktop. I bought W8 Pro OEM on disk from a computer shopfor $149, to be up to speed with the latest technology, but much more so because of the improved OS kernel. However, if it were not for the hack Ex7ForW8 to restore Win7 Start Orb/menu in it's fully functional original state, and remove the need to see Metro at all, I never would have touched it.
    Last edited by Mustang; 23 Nov 2012 at 08:17.
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  10. #130


    I don't think the start menu needs to be put back in exactly. Having both a start menu AND a start screen could be confusing since we can't choose between the two but there definitely should be a menu that contains what the start menu had maybe it can be called something else.

    The reason for this is there is no program folder or list. While going into the start screen is an option it gets confusing because both desktop AND metro apps are put together. A division inside the desktop would help users separate what can only be used in the desktop environment it will also help to find those programs easily to pin to the taskbar. Also easy access would be good.

    The hidden menu is first and foremost unseen by users which is a bad decision. Also it will appear always on the left side of the screen. This becomes confusing when you have an app on the left side because you still would be clicking in the corner of the screen and not in the corner of the desktop as one might possibly think. I'm not looking for a fancy menu but a visible one would be good.
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Is Windows 8 a failure ? Time to say bye, bye MSFT ?
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