Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Windows 8 thoughts & opinions: incomplete?

  1. #141


    Harrisonburg, Va.
    Posts : 10,488
    Windows 8.1.1 Pro with Media Center


    Either you like it or you don't.
    I have Pro version.
    I have tweaked it to suit my needs.
    I did the same with XP Pro.
    Something out of the box is going to need tweaking.
    Why ----- about it ?
    Go to work on it & alter it to please you.
    Unless you are a newby to computers, this tweaking is not that difficult.
    I'm happy with the changes I made to mine.
    Then again, I'm no newby.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #142


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by HippsieGypsie View Post
    I think we all need to be patient with what is to come from MS.
    OK, tone is always difficult to measure on forums.

    I'm not in IT, my main occupation has been in a very wide range of projects, including IT. My most unpleasant projects have always been IT projects, especially when it comes to developmental ones. There seems to be an attitude in IT projects that is experienced almost no where in any other industry; on time, on budget and on spec are almost unheard of in the IT industry. It's not always the complete fault of the IT industry, but usually 99.9%. The IT industry operates more on promises and wishful thinking and I think everyone has seen examples of that.

    I actually have no issues with Windows 8 being designed for touch, I've never said that, I use touch now with Windows 7 on my tablet when it's of use. The only things that I find as significant marketing decision flaws are:

    1. Removing the desktop start menu and thus the comfort and familiarity that generations of Windows users know and like.
    2. Not making the apps more versatile and able to be re-sized and moved around anywhere on one or more screens, and for the apps to able to be used at the user's chosen size without the apps sizing to full screen.


    The Windows users are important, Microsoft exists because they have been able to provide a service and a product that people like. Yes, people are in the main used to touch screens on mobile phones and tablets, but the desktop space is entirely different. And the desktop space may have flattened out over the years, but it is still a venerable cash cow for Microsoft. It doesn't pay to disrupt that cash cow. Cash cows can be vulnerable to new technology etc, but in this instance it's in a different market space and will be safe for a very long time.

    I've been using touch screen phones for a number of years and people with big mitts generally find navigation somewhat awkward. Large screen phones that are coming out now are much better, but not if they try to cram more icons and menus on the screen, especially because of increasing screen resolutions. I have actually retired my current touch screen mobile phone and bought an older design one that has an actual keypad and mechanical cursor buttons etc. My main decision was predicated on the fact that this phone was the cheapest around that also had the best reception for our area (country).

    It's a full blown smartphone that allows internet access etc, but lacks some smart features of my previous phone and has a much smaller screen. However, it's the easiest phone that I have used for a long time, other than the home phone. Being able to dial numbers with mechanical keys and navigate through the menus with a cursor, actually a four way tab with a central OK key (something like you see on DSLRs), is a real joy. I can also tether the phone to my tablet and send/receive SMS/MMS messages on the tablet (and use the tablet keyboard), as well as get full internet on the larger screen. When I don't need the tablet, this little phone will slip into any pocket, I don't need cargo pants to house the latest 5"-6' monstrosities.

    So partly to answer your question, cascading menus of sorts already exist on devices such as smartphones, they are in places such as contacts etc, your seriously can't have a separate icon for each contact. The same applies for many other functions. But how easy they are to use depends on your eyesight and dexterity, it's not always a great experience. Now let's take tablets; the current thinking is that you can do everything via apps, an app icon for each task. So what's happening is that many service providers such as banks, eBay, Facebook etc are all providing access to their web sites via an app. Lets say that we now have an app for the Windows 8 forum, the Windows 7 forum, every news site that you may visit, every tech site that you may visit and so on. How long will it be before your entire screen is a mass of apps which could be just as easily have provided on a web browser with drop down links ie a cascading menu? Those apps are in reality nothing more than hyperlinks to a web site. Apps are in some ways trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist.

    I don't understand what you mean by updating personal information, that's a function of the software associated with the program that your using, the permissions that you have allowed and what the updates involve. I'm not suggesting that the apps should not exist, they have a place, even on a desktop, if properly implemented and designed, as I've already explained. Microsoft may be targeting a particular segment of the market, but the desktop environment is also still part of their current market, unless they are no longer interested in the desktop.

    I have no idea what the next iterations of Windows will bring, who knows, maybe Microsoft will remove the desktop entirely from users and only enterprise users (who they can't abandon - yet) will be the only ones with a traditional desktop. However, your premise that Windows 8 is primarily designed for touch is in error. If that was the case, Microsoft would not be providing keyboards with the Surface, third party manufacturers would not be making Windows 8 laptops etc (with keyboards, touch pads etc). There wold be no desktop whatsoever in Windows 8.

    Also, others are not trending towards touch only. No one is denying that touch functionality will be a common facility on pretty much all devices, I already have it on my 7" car head unit running Windows CE, there it works quite well on the lower resolution screen. However, touch is always going to be an adjunct to other interface options, it will not supplant peripherals like keyboards and mice. To think otherwise is very narrow minded.

    I also use Windows 8 for what it's designed for, but on a desktop, and therefore use a keyboard and mouse. People who have valid criticisms of Windows 8 are not trolls, every single criticism has been clearly enunciated, yet the 'fanboiz' seem not to acknowledge these very valid points. They may not be valid to you, but clearly they are valid to many others. Also, there's no point in saying what might happen in future with what follows Windows 8, no one knows, or if you do, please tell. I am discussing what is now, not what might be , and if everyone just sings the praises of Windows 8, we may well not get anything different in future. You may be happy with that, I and many others will not.

    And my God I could imagine the pain of having to type this response on a touch screen!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #143


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by medab1 View Post
    Unless you are a newby to computers, this tweaking is not that difficult.
    And what is the proportion of computer literate vs illiterate people in the world?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4. #144


    Harrisonburg, Va.
    Posts : 10,488
    Windows 8.1.1 Pro with Media Center


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by medab1 View Post
    Unless you are a newby to computers, this tweaking is not that difficult.
    And what is the proportion of computer literate vs illiterate people in the world?
    That is why forums like this one exist.
    I'm not a newby because I spent 10 years in forums like this learning & helping.
    There are LOTS of newbys.
    That is what WE are for.
    To help them.
    Sometimes even long term computer users can only "suggest" solutions.
    Sometimes they can actually GIVE an exact solution.
    At least trying to point someone in the right direction is helpful.
    Trying different things to fix a problem is a good learning experience.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #145


    UK
    Posts : 177
    Win 8


    Fundamental mistake. MS solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

    A tablet does not need to be a full blown PC, that's the beauty, light weight and simple that's why they are selling. PC still has a big market but needs to be heavyweight full function with no need for touch, MS have sacrificed that.

    The OS for each can have common elements but no need for replication of interface between the two, they have different purposes and need different functionality.

    MS decided the problem was they needed to be the same and created a solution no one needed. Big mistake, neither option then becomes attractive.

    If you want bacon you need a pig, if you want a girlfriend don't buy lipstick for the pig.

    MS have smothered their pig with lipstick nothing could be less attractive. If you wipe the lipstick off you have a tasty bacon sandwich.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #146


    Posts : 1,770
    Windows Phone 6, Windows CE 5, Windows Vista x32, Windows 7 x32/x64, Windows 8 x64


    Quote Originally Posted by medab1 View Post
    [
    That is why forums like this one exist.
    The number of people that are on forums of any type are pretty small overall. Many don't even know that forums exist.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #147


    Harrisonburg, Va.
    Posts : 10,488
    Windows 8.1.1 Pro with Media Center


    Quote Originally Posted by Ray8 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by medab1 View Post
    [
    That is why forums like this one exist.
    The number of people that are on forums of any type are pretty small overall. Many don't even know that forums exist.
    There are optimists & pessimests.
    I prefer to be an optomist.

    Some people look at a problem & say why it cannot be solved.

    Some people look at a problem & say, "How can we fix it ?"

    Looking for a solution is better.

    You can only deal with people who belong to a forum.
    Those who have no clue about forums are without help from a family of dedicated helpers.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #148


    Posts : 308
    64-bit Windows 8


    Some good points on both sides in this thread, I guess. I have little use for the Metro apps and Start screen, but their presence doesn't bother me, I just ignore them.

    But I have to agree with what Mystere said before: There's no need to give reasons why you do or don't personally like something. Whenever someone says "I like (or dislike) this actor" or "this baseball player" or whatever -- they always have to give a reason (or, worse, a list of 20 reasons) and then act like that "proves" that they're right and if you don't agree with them you're wrong. There's nothing wrong with pointing out what's bad (or good) about Windows 8, but you should do it with the realization that most people are still going to keep their opinion, and when they do it shouldn't bother you.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Windows 8 thoughts & opinions: incomplete?
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