Metro Whining and Other Windows 8 Madness

I don't care much about the Metro name change brouhaha. I couldn't care less except for the fact that I have to change some of the Metro references in some writing I've done for upcoming pieces on Windows Server 2012. Frankly, I don't care much about the Metro interface at all—I've been using Windows 8 client and Server 2012 extensively now, for almost six months.

There is nothing in Metro I can find that impedes the Windows user experience with which I am familiar. I have not had any device driver issues as of yet (either on the Windows 2012 Server side or the Windows 8 client side) and, if anything, I feel that the Metro-ish UI lends to a greater desktop customization than ever before, and I mean serious customization that goes well beyond placing an image of cute kittens on the desktop.

But people care about Metro very much and not in a care because they love it way, a care more as if Metro is akin to the village Frankenstein people would hunt down and kill if it could walk way.

Even here, in the typically peaceful PCMag Labs, there are two clear cut sides: anti-Metro and while I wouldn't exactly say pro-Metro there are those of who feel that the Metro UI is being irrationally demonized. Even Sascha Segan, my colleague who I am usually pretty much in lock-step agreement with on technology matters, outlined his grievances against Metro in a recent column.

Here's why I think a lot of the Metro criticism is just hysteria.....

Read more at:
Metro Whining and Other Windows 8 Madness | News & Opinion | PCMag.com
 
I have to say , her colleague is spot on:

If Microsoft continues down this path, the strategy will backfire, and PC owners with a choice will likely skip this version of Windows, much as they did with ME and Vista.

Agreed, that is my plan. Stick with Windows 7. No real benefit for me of 8.
 

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I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:
 

My Computer

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    Windows 7 HP 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center 64BIT
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    ASUS - Home Built
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    AMD Phenom II X6 1100T
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I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

One could ask, why did Microsoft ruin such a great OS upgrade with the metro crap then. Metro is SO BAD (for a certain section of people, you know, those people that USE their computers) that almost nothing else matters. If you can't use your machine any more, who cares what other more subtle improvements there are?!?

MICROSOFT did that, not the users...

Yeah if it weren't for Metro destroying the interface (Customisable my you-know-what, that guy doesn't even begin to understand what a customised desktop is to have said that) we'd all be jumping for joy!
 

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    Windows 7/8
I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

Agree on that, Jim...............Well, Guys and Gals?
 

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    8.1 Pro X64
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    Acer/Intel E946GZ
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    350 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10
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    Standard 250 watt
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    Desktop 7.2" (183mm) W x 17.5" (445mm) L x 14.5"
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I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

One could ask, why did Microsoft ruin such a great OS upgrade with the metro crap then. Metro is SO BAD (for a certain section of people, you know, those people that USE their computers) that almost nothing else matters. If you can't use your machine any more, who cares what other more subtle improvements there are?!?

MICROSOFT did that, not the users...

Yeah if it weren't for Metro destroying the interface (Customisable my you-know-what, that guy doesn't even begin to understand what a customised desktop is to have said that) we'd all be jumping for joy!

You just proved her point.

Jim :cool:
 

My Computer

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    Windows 7 HP 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center 64BIT
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
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    ASUS - Home Built
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    AMD Phenom II X6 1100T
    Motherboard
    ASUS M5A99X EVO
    Memory
    Crucial Balistic DDR-3 1866 CL 9 (8 GB)
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    Monitor(s) Displays
    ASUS VE258Q 25" LED with DVI-HDMI-DisplayPort
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    Seasonic X650 80 Plus GOLD Modular
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Jim :cool:
One could ask, why did Microsoft ruin such a great OS upgrade with the metro crap then. Metro is SO BAD (for a certain section of people, you know, those people that USE their computers) that almost nothing else matters. If you can't use your machine any more, who cares what other more subtle improvements there are?!?

MICROSOFT did that, not the users...

Yeah if it weren't for Metro destroying the interface (Customisable my you-know-what, that guy doesn't even begin to understand what a customised desktop is to have said that) we'd all be jumping for joy!

I don't understand the problem. 1 click and the Whatever (Metro) screen is gone. You can do everything on the desktop to USE your computer just like you have for years. Fast booting, task manager, and some other features are nice additions. No strong reason to upgrade from windows 7 but no harm in doing it either.
 
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Well said.

Jim :cool:

One could ask, why did Microsoft ruin such a great OS upgrade with the metro crap then. Metro is SO BAD (for a certain section of people, you know, those people that USE their computers) that almost nothing else matters. If you can't use your machine any more, who cares what other more subtle improvements there are?!?

MICROSOFT did that, not the users...

Yeah if it weren't for Metro destroying the interface (Customisable my you-know-what, that guy doesn't even begin to understand what a customised desktop is to have said that) we'd all be jumping for joy!

You just proved her point.

Jim :cool:

All I proved was that Windows is suffering the Tragedy of the Commons. As well as YOU and her.

Yeah were all saying the same thing. Only difference is, apparenly most people don't /care/ that their productivity is being demolished because they never had any to start with!
 

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    Windows 7/8
I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

Agree on that, Jim...............Well, Guys and Gals?


Ok, as a person who really has no intention to switch over my machine to Windows 8, I will comment on the other areas. I'm not a fan of the new UI, and I don't really like going back and forth between the desktop and the new UI. My reason for not moving is that Windows 8 doesn't make much of anything really better for me, and the lack of aero makes it a big ugly, not having a start menu makes it just annoying to use, and the Metro apps are just a complete loss for me.

There are other things that I like about it, but they aren't so awesome that I want to deal with the interface stuff
1). iso mounting (nice to not need 3rd party)
2). faster startup (I have an SSD with hibernation off to save space, it doesn't amount to much)
3). Included Hyper-V for VM's. (I'm a vmware guy, and use vmware extensively at work)
4). Ribbon interface on Windows explorer (yeah, it's there, but I have been fine without it for years)
5). File history option (nice enough, but cannot configure folders, I use a file server and I use Chrome and not IE and favs are synced via Chrome)
6). Drive pooling feature (nice, but again I use file server and don't keep anything important on desktop)
7). Windows to go feature (only in enterprise, which I won't have at home since consumers cannot purchase it)
8). Syncing of data and apps across multiple Windows 8 boxes is nice (but I wont' have multiples at home, most likely would use a local account or domain account (at work), and you need to use @live account to use this feature).
9). App History feature of Task Manager. (nice addition, can see which apps historically have hogged system.)
10). Better multimonitor support ( I only use 1 monitor at home, and while I use dual monitors at work, don't thin corporate will be putting us on 8...since we don't have a current enterprise agreement and aren't licensed for it)

So, there you have it. I've contemplated most of the other features, and it's just a lack of whiz-bang changes and the forced inclusion of some things I don't want which make this a non-appealing spend of $40.
 

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    Windows 7
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    ABS M1 Mechanical
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    15/2 cable modem
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    Windows and Linux enthusiast. Logitech G35 Headset.
I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

Hi there

If only it were that simple.

The mega problem is that a lot of people STILL use computers as Computers and not as a tablet or smartphone where all people have to do is read emails, surf the internet or watch a video or two - probably from YouTube

Fine if this is what you want -- but loads of us need computers to do REAL work - often using multiple monitors -- this makes the whole Metro concept totally NONSENSE.

I don't have too many issues with the lack of the start menu -- but to get applications in a convenient way to launch them is just ridiculous -- I don't need or WANT to scroll rightwards about 2 Olympic Marathon amounts (2 * 42 km) to find my application on those little hideous tiles.

Just try installing the whole Adobe CS5.5 package on your computer -- this must create about 15 - 25 tiles !!!!..

Hi E.T --anybody out there -- listening.

Cheers
jimbo
 

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I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

This is ridiculous. How many Metro squawkers are setting up servers? I don't even know what ReFS means. I'm gonna go look it up, hold on...

This is what MS says it is:

Windows customers want a cost-effective platform that maximizes data availability, scales efficiently to very large data sets across diverse workloads, and guarantees data integrity via resiliency to corruption (regardless of software or hardware failures). ReFS is a new file system that targets these customer needs while providing a foundation for significant future innovations. By utilizing an integrated storage stack comprising ReFS and the new Storage Spaces feature in Windows Server 2012, customers can now deploy the most cost-effective platform for available and scalable data access using commodity storage.

Oh OK, yeah. Clear as a bell now. I'll email my mom this paragraph so she'll get a heads-up before 8 hits the shelves. Way down the page someone who understands normal English described it better in one sentence: "ReFS stores data in a way that protects it from many of the common errors that can normally cause data loss."

Wonderful. I'm all for that. Now what do we do about all those stupid @#$%! colored boxes? The author totally ignores this (and every other Metro criticism) and can't even answer her own hypothesis: "Here's why I think a lot of the Metro criticism is just hysteria." She gives three alleged reasons why.

1.) Metro is not designed for the desktop - Yeah, OK. Still missing the point, and tell that to the nearly 2 billion desktop users around the world. I'm going to go out on a limb and predict most of them are going to assume that this newest iteration of Windows is for them since every past iteration of Windows has been for them.

2.) The enterprise is not going to Windows 8 anytime soon - Gee, I wonder why? Maybe it has something to do with your first reason? Regardless, this doesn't explain why people don't like Metro but, in a way, it reinforces why they don't.

3.) Windows 8 gives unprecedented customization and an incredible easy way to open apps and utilities - Ah, yes. Well the squawkers don't agree with you. That's why they're squawking. "Unprecedented customization" is just BS, pure and simple. If you actually listened to the squawkers instead of ridicule them, you would get this. But you don't and you don't.

Yet another who thinks anyone who doesn't think like they do is an idiot.
 

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Your Turn

I would love it if those squawking the loudest about Metro could also offer their thoughts on other features of Windows 8 client and Windows Server 2012: such as QoS management, ReFS and Storage Spaces, Windows To Go…..or are they too stuck on a start screen?

Well said.

Jim :cool:

Agree on that, Jim...............Well, Guys and Gals?

Point out comments where people have complained about actual improvements:

  • RAM usage
  • Speed
  • QoS management
  • ReFS
  • Storage Spaces
  • Windows To Go
  • etc.

In fact a lot have people have said, "If they had just added the actual windows improvements to W7, W8 would be a no-brainer purchase/upgrade."

IT Administrators would be running to Management screaming, "We must have this." :party:
 

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    Monitor Upgraded - 2012-04-20
    System Upgraded - 2011-05-21, 2010-07-14
    HDD Upgraded - 2010-08-11, 2011-08-24,
Point out comments where people have complained about actual improvements:

  • RAM usage
  • Speed
  • QoS management
  • ReFS
  • Storage Spaces
  • Windows To Go
  • etc.

RAM usage. I guess it's a bit lower in Windows 8, but with 4GB or more or RAM in Windows 7, it's not like I was really running out. And running on 5% less RAM with Windows 8 is not likely going to make it or break it.

Speed. Not seeing much difference, like I said before, I run with an 80GB SSD for my OS, I turn off hibernate to save disk space. The Hybrid boot is lost on me. No tangible gains.

Storage Space. In theory I like the concept. but I'm leary that if my OS were to crash, would I be able to take my 2-3-4 drive collection, plug it into another machine and be able to mount it, and get access to my data. This is something I actually plan to test soon with a VM.

Windows To Go: Enterprise only, not useful for the consumer.
 

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    Windows 7
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    Self-Built in July 2009
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    Intel Q9550 2.83Ghz OC'd to 3.40Ghz
    Motherboard
    Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R rev. 1.1, F12 BIOS
    Memory
    8GB G.Skill PI DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 timings
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    EVGA 1280MB Nvidia GeForce GTX570
    Sound Card
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    Screen Resolution
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    Intel X25-M 80GB Gen 2 SSD
    Western Digital 1TB Caviar Black, 32MB cache. WD1001FALS
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    ABS M1 Mechanical
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    Logitech G9 Laser Mouse
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    15/2 cable modem
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    Windows and Linux enthusiast. Logitech G35 Headset.
Speed. Not seeing much difference, like I said before, I run with an 80GB SSD for my OS, I turn off hibernate to save disk space. The Hybrid boot is lost on me. No tangible gains.

I read somewhere the other day (don't remember where) that Hybrid boot uses the hibernate function to store the boot information in the hiberfil.sys file so that may be why you show no gains.

Jim :cool:
 

My Computer

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  • OS
    Windows 7 HP 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center 64BIT
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
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    ASUS - Home Built
    CPU
    AMD Phenom II X6 1100T
    Motherboard
    ASUS M5A99X EVO
    Memory
    Crucial Balistic DDR-3 1866 CL 9 (8 GB)
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    MSI R6850 Cyclone IGD5 PE
    Sound Card
    On Chip
    Monitor(s) Displays
    ASUS VE258Q 25" LED with DVI-HDMI-DisplayPort
    Screen Resolution
    1920 x 1080
    Hard Drives
    Two WD Cavier Black 2TB Sata 6gbs
    WD My Book Essential 2TB USB 3.0
    PSU
    Seasonic X650 80 Plus GOLD Modular
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    Corsair 400R
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    Antec Kuhler H2O 620, Two 120mm and four 140mm
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    AVS Gear Blue LED Backlight
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    APC UPS ES 750, Netgear WNR3500L Gigabit & Wireless N Router with SamKnows Test Program,
    Motorola SB6120 Gigabit Cable Modem.
    Brother HL-2170W Laser Printer,
    Epson V300 Scanner
^ I know, that's why I said that Hybrid boot is lost on me, as I turn off hibernate, so no tangible gains for me.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Self-Built in July 2009
    CPU
    Intel Q9550 2.83Ghz OC'd to 3.40Ghz
    Motherboard
    Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R rev. 1.1, F12 BIOS
    Memory
    8GB G.Skill PI DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 timings
    Graphics Card(s)
    EVGA 1280MB Nvidia GeForce GTX570
    Sound Card
    Realtek ALC899A 8 channel onboard audio
    Monitor(s) Displays
    23" Acer x233H
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    Intel X25-M 80GB Gen 2 SSD
    Western Digital 1TB Caviar Black, 32MB cache. WD1001FALS
    PSU
    Corsair 620HX modular
    Case
    Antec P182
    Cooling
    stock
    Keyboard
    ABS M1 Mechanical
    Mouse
    Logitech G9 Laser Mouse
    Internet Speed
    15/2 cable modem
    Other Info
    Windows and Linux enthusiast. Logitech G35 Headset.
^ I know, that's why I said that Hybrid boot is lost on me, as I turn off hibernate, so no tangible gains for me.

I assumed you may have known that already, but mentioned it just in case. I rather have too much information than not enough. I don't have a SSD (yet) so I have seen an improvement in Windows 8 boot over my Windows 7.

Jim :cool:
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7 HP 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro w/Media Center 64BIT
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    ASUS - Home Built
    CPU
    AMD Phenom II X6 1100T
    Motherboard
    ASUS M5A99X EVO
    Memory
    Crucial Balistic DDR-3 1866 CL 9 (8 GB)
    Graphics Card(s)
    MSI R6850 Cyclone IGD5 PE
    Sound Card
    On Chip
    Monitor(s) Displays
    ASUS VE258Q 25" LED with DVI-HDMI-DisplayPort
    Screen Resolution
    1920 x 1080
    Hard Drives
    Two WD Cavier Black 2TB Sata 6gbs
    WD My Book Essential 2TB USB 3.0
    PSU
    Seasonic X650 80 Plus GOLD Modular
    Case
    Corsair 400R
    Cooling
    Antec Kuhler H2O 620, Two 120mm and four 140mm
    Keyboard
    AVS Gear Blue LED Backlight
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    Logitech Marble Mouse USB, Logitech Precision Game Pad
    Internet Speed
    15MB
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    NIS, Malwarebytes Premium 2
    Other Info
    APC UPS ES 750, Netgear WNR3500L Gigabit & Wireless N Router with SamKnows Test Program,
    Motorola SB6120 Gigabit Cable Modem.
    Brother HL-2170W Laser Printer,
    Epson V300 Scanner
Yeah, I'm testing Windows 8 on a desktop and laptop, neither of which have an SSD. Windows 8 is a big faster, but certainly not something that blows me away faster.
 

My Computer

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  • OS
    Windows 7
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Self-Built in July 2009
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    Intel Q9550 2.83Ghz OC'd to 3.40Ghz
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    Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R rev. 1.1, F12 BIOS
    Memory
    8GB G.Skill PI DDR2-800, 4-4-4-12 timings
    Graphics Card(s)
    EVGA 1280MB Nvidia GeForce GTX570
    Sound Card
    Realtek ALC899A 8 channel onboard audio
    Monitor(s) Displays
    23" Acer x233H
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    Intel X25-M 80GB Gen 2 SSD
    Western Digital 1TB Caviar Black, 32MB cache. WD1001FALS
    PSU
    Corsair 620HX modular
    Case
    Antec P182
    Cooling
    stock
    Keyboard
    ABS M1 Mechanical
    Mouse
    Logitech G9 Laser Mouse
    Internet Speed
    15/2 cable modem
    Other Info
    Windows and Linux enthusiast. Logitech G35 Headset.
Metro whiners ... I don't think so.


A month ago, I built a new rig with Win7 Ult retail. I was offered Win8 Upgrade free. I said no. Why would I pollute a good OS with a hybrid smartfone/tablet/pseudo desktop OS?

And why would anyone pay $39 for an upgrade to get features they don't want and will never use? It's like paying the extra money for a multi-function pocket knife when all you ever use is a straight blade.

Win7 Ult Retail still costs $429 in Aussie. So what are you getting for $69 with Win8 pro? You're simply adding a smartfone/tablet GUI and losing the traditional start menu and direct boot to desktop ... with a few improvements to the functionality of Window OS.

THE IMPROVEMENTS IN THE ACTUAL OS IN WIN8 ARE WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN OFFERED AS A FREE SP2 TO WIN7!!!

With throwaway prices for Win8 upgrades, and in my case a freebie, Win8 is simply a promotional push by Microsoft into the smartfone/tablet market; with a pseudo desktop GUI thrown in as an after thought to appease the army of traditional desktop users of Windows.

It's not a case of being able to do everything on Win8 that you can on Win7. The question is: Why bother when you've already got it all in Win7? And with a SATA3 SSD HD, 12GB RAM, and decent mobo/CPU ... Win 7 flies.

If you like a tile format start menu, go for it. But don't accuse others of whining because they prefer: An alpha numeric start menu, occupying minimal space on the desktop, with the desktop visible when you open multiple programs; and a direct boot to desktop. And not having to pay the M$ research costs for adding a smartfone/tablet GUI you'll never use; and their promotional advertising costs to push into the smartfone/tablet market; for what should have been a free SP2 to Win7.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7 Ult Reatil & Win 8 Pro OEM
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Built as DIY
    CPU
    6 core 12 thread & 4 core
    Motherboard
    Inel Extreme & Intel standard
    Memory
    12GB & 8GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    3 top end SLI linked & onboard
    Sound Card
    In built in graphics card & onboard
    Monitor(s) Displays
    24 & 23 inch Samsung LED backlit
    Screen Resolution
    High def
    Hard Drives
    Corsair Force 128GB SATA3 SSDs in each machine. Plus several external USB3 and eSATA spinner HDs
Observations are not complaints

Point out comments where people have complained about actual improvements:

  • RAM usage
  • Speed
  • QoS management
  • ReFS
  • Storage Spaces
  • Windows To Go
  • etc.

RAM usage. I guess it's a bit lower in Windows 8, but with 4GB or more or RAM in Windows 7, it's not like I was really running out. And running on 5% less RAM with Windows 8 is not likely going to make it or break it.

On my PC the difference is ~33% (~400MB).
That's equivalent to another Firefox instance or another Linux VM.

You're not complaining about it, even though its a change. :)

Metro fans claim that people are only complaining because things have changed (not the quality of the changes).
It's the only argument they can mount in defence of it, in the face of massive criticism.

Speed. Not seeing much difference, like I said before, I run with an 80GB SSD for my OS, I turn off hibernate to save disk space. The Hybrid boot is lost on me. No tangible gains.

The improved Boot speed doesn't impress me, but I'm not complaining about it.

I meant that comparing W7 to W8, isn't like comparing XP to Vista (i.e. there is no noticeable improvement or degradation in operating speed).

You're not complaining about it, even though its a change. :)

Metro fans claim that people are only complaining because things have changed (not the quality of the changes).

Storage Space. In theory I like the concept. but I'm leary that if my OS were to crash, would I be able to take my 2-3-4 drive collection, plug it into another machine and be able to mount it, and get access to my data. This is something I actually plan to test soon with a VM.

Windows To Go: Enterprise only, not useful for the consumer.

I'm not likely to use those features either, but I'm not complaining about MS deciding to include them.

You're not complaining about it, even though its a change. :)

Metro fans claim that people are only complaining because things have changed (not the quality of the changes).
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), Linux Mint 18.3 MATE (64 bit)
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    n/a
    CPU
    AMD Phenom II x6 1055T, 2.8 GHz
    Motherboard
    ASRock 880GMH-LE/USB3
    Memory
    8GB DDR3 1333 G-Skill Ares F3-1333C9D-8GAO (4GB x 2)
    Graphics Card(s)
    ATI Radeon HD6450
    Sound Card
    Realtek?
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Samsung S23B350
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    Western Digital 1.5 TB (SATA), Western Digital 2 TB (SATA), Western Digital 3 TB (SATA)
    Case
    Tower
    Mouse
    Wired Optical
    Other Info
    Linux Mint 16 MATE (64 bit) replaced with Linux Mint 17 MATE (64 bit) - 2014-05-17
    Linux Mint 14 MATE (64 bit) replaced with Linux Mint 16 MATE (64 bit) - 2013-11-13
    Ubuntu 10.04 (64 bit) replaced with Linux Mint 14 MATE (64 bit) - 2013-01-14
    RAM & Graphics Card Upgraded - 2013-01-13
    Monitor Upgraded - 2012-04-20
    System Upgraded - 2011-05-21, 2010-07-14
    HDD Upgraded - 2010-08-11, 2011-08-24,
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