Windows 8 and 8.1 Forums


Will they get away with Defender?

  1. #1


    Posts : 5,357
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin

    Will they get away with Defender?


    There is vast amount of money at stake.

    Not sure how MS is going to try and get away with this one.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  2. #2


    Posts : 520
    Windows 8, x64, DP8102 - Win7 Ultimate x64, Dual Boot


    Indeed, this should be interesting, SIW.

    Still, MS is already giving away MSE (renamed Defender in Win 8) for free so I think the course of action that will eventually be taken will be to allow an uninstall of defender and an install of an AV of one's choice.

    I'm glad MS is building Defender in on the pre-beta builds though.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3. #3


    I doubt. MS's burnt its fingers with WMP and IE bundled. So after N and E versions we might see D (without defender).
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  4. #4


    Posts : 5,357
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin


    McAffee, Norton and the oem's in particular could be seriously out of pocket.

    The oem's argue their take from selling pre installed trials ( largely the a/v S ) helps keep the unit price down.

    If people realise they don't need to buy McAffe when it pops up after 30 days saying the trial is up - that is tens of millions of dollars.

    I understand the oem's get most of it - don't know the precise figure , could be 75-80% , plus the same on renewals.

    Do the math - Michael Dell alone sells 30 million machines a year.

    If only 1 in 10 buy the a/v at $30 , then renew at $20 - you get the picture.

    I have a suspicion it much more than 1 in 10 .
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5. #5


    Posts : 520
    Windows 8, x64, DP8102 - Win7 Ultimate x64, Dual Boot


    Hi, Aaron.

    Can't say I've ever used MSE on my own machine (until now with Win 8 8102) but I have installed it on many other machines for others.

    To me, the incarnation of Defender looks the same.

    As far as disabling it, other than going into services, just as many here didn't realize it was even installed, I don't see an obvious way to fully disable it.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  6. #6


    Posts : 5,357
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin


    Doesn't matter if it can be done.

    Fact is - it is included .

    That is MS using it's dominance to erect barriers to competition.

    I am not sure it is the competition authorities that will be the difficulty here - oem's and the a/v makers are more likely to scupper it.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7. #7


    Posts : 520
    Windows 8, x64, DP8102 - Win7 Ultimate x64, Dual Boot


    I never used Vista, Aaron. I skipped over it and went to Win7.

    Still, is that any more obvious than understanding Defender is now MSE in Win 8 8102?

    One has to go to "Program Files\Defender\MSASCui.exe" to get to the interface. Otherwise, it's all automatic.

    Really, what's the difference between MSE and the new incarnation of Defender in 8102?

    I'm not attempting to start a fight here, just seeking clarification, Aaron.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8. #8


    How does one define a monopoly? Suppose MS decided to beef up its disk management console so it started doing all (or most) of the things now possible only with partition wizard/paragon and such like. Would that be monopolistic? It can be argued that creating/formatting/resizing/shrinking/extending/merging partitions is an inherent part of OS installation and maintenance.

    I suspect it depends on who the affected 3rd parties are. Partition wizard/paragon chaps probably have neither the financial muscle nor the financial stakes to chase the issue. AV vendors are a different category.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  9. #9


    Posts : 520
    Windows 8, x64, DP8102 - Win7 Ultimate x64, Dual Boot


    Still, what's the difference with Defender, as it is in Win 8102 as compared to MSE in Win 7 and earlier?

    I still have seen no real clarification.

    As far as I can tell Defender in Win 8 8102 is nearly identical to MSE in Win 7.

    Aaron brought up something about "network" something or other but that appears to be covered in other areas of Win 8 8102.

    Again, I'm not attempting to start a fight, just seeking clarification on Aaron's previous posts related to this matter and his uncharacteristic Super Mod way of going about it.
    Last edited by mikedl; 20 Sep 2011 at 04:18.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10. #10


    Well, one way the new Defender is different from and would probably NOT be removable completely is that it is supposed to interface with secure boot on UEFI systems. Secure boot is MS's way of authenticating boot components which will apparently ensure that only signed and validated code makes it way upto the OS loading.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

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Will they get away with Defender?

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