Partitions. Unable to shrink. And what is this ?

I'm trialling W8.1 Enterprise and have run into something I don't understand regarding partitions.... here is what I did.

1/ I run the W8.1 installation and decide to format ALL partitions from the install disc.

2/ This seemed a good opportunity to rearrange things so I then went on to DELETE all the partitions so that I had 300Gb unallocated space showing.

3/ I install W8.1 onto this single unallocated space and all seemed OK. I have W8.1 on a C drive of 300Gb.

My plan was to then shrink the partition using the disk management console to something round about 70 or 80 Gb but I find it won't let me. The most it said I could shrink was down to a value that gave a 50:50 split. I'm guessing some unmovable files are the problem but I don't understand why they would be there in such a location. The install disc showed the full 300Gb as unallocated before the install commenced.

Also, there is the small partition at the start of the drive. What is that ? and what and why has it been created ? What lives on there ?

This shows the drive as it stands now. This is all a learning exercise (for me anyway ) and if/when I install W8.1 for real, then I would like to understand where I've gone wrong a bit better.

If you wanted to make whole disk available, you should have deleted all the partitions at the beginning of the installation and then lett windows install. You would be left with only a small "System reserved" partition (no letter) and one large C: partition which you can shrink later and make another after it. D: partition is your old one and so is Recovery partition. Windows puts System reserved partition in the beginning of disk so it would not interfere with partitions you create later. That "Recovery partition" was from computer manufacturer so you can restore computer to factory state.
Cleanest state of disk you can make is to repartition, erase and format disk by booting with another bootable disk or USB, or by placing drive in another computer and do it from there. You could use a Live Linux on USB or cd/dvd, Hiree'ns boot disk or anything that has some kind of OS on it.

Hi Mike,

I've created and named all of the partitions that you can see from using the disk management console in W8.1 after installing W8.1 The recovery files are my own Acronis images. All the original manufacturer partitions are long gone from when I clean installed W7 a couple of years back.

I did delete all the partitions (my W7 layout) using the install media right at the very start. It looked like this but said 300Gb unallocated.

In that case you did everything right, Windows made that System partition for it's own use.

Yes, I can't really understand why its not allowing me to do the shrink to below 150Gb. Just trying to glean bits of info and I realise I didn't attempt the shrink from <administrative tools> <disk management> but rather I just right clicked "This PC" and then "manage". Not sure if that would make the difference or not.


What I'll do I think is make sure when I install again (because this trial expires anyway in 90 days) is to make the partition smaller than I want using the install media, and then hopefully I can expand it afterwards.


Thanks.

System partition is always easier to expand than to shrink, just have to work with two partitions next to each other.

there is the small partition at the start of the drive. What is that ? and what and why has it been created ? What lives on there ?

Click to expand...

The 350MB hidden reserved partition serves two functions. First, it holds the Boot Manager code and the Boot Configuration Database. Second, it reserves space for the startup files required by the BitLocker Drive Encryption feature. Without it, your system won't boot. If you will never use the Bitlocker feature then you can install Windows without it, in that case Windows will put the Boot Manager and the BCD together within C: drive.

My plan was to then shrink the partition using the disk management console to something round about 70 or 80 Gb but I find it won't let me. The most it said I could shrink was down to a value that gave a 50:50 split

Click to expand...

Your guess is right. When you install Windows, it does not install everything sequencially, so data is scattered all over the disk. What you could do is before shrinking it, turn off hibernation, and defrag your C Drive, so that it will consolidate all the free spaces then you can shrink further more.

EDIT: In addition, You could also temporarily set Pagefile.sys to no pagefile before running defrag.

Or use third party partition SW, like EAsus Partition master, it transfers files that are in the way to the partition you are trying to shrink. Just got to watch which partition is which, I always give them distinctive names to differentiate between them.

CountMike said:

System partition is always easier to expand than to shrink, just have to work with two partitions next to each other.

Click to expand...

I'm beginning to see that I'll probably make the partition small, say 30Gb when I next install and then expand it.

topgundcp said:

The 350MB hidden reserved partition serves two functions. First, it holds the Boot Manager code and the Boot Configuration Database. Second, it reserves space for the startup files required by the BitLocker Drive Encryption feature. Without it, your system won't boot. If you will never use the Bitlocker feature then you can install Windows without it, in that case Windows will put the Boot Manager and the BCD together within C: drive.

Click to expand...

Ah... bitlocker. I never thought of that ! Now that is something I will never use tbh.

Your guess is right. When you install Windows, it does not install everything sequencially, so data is scattered all over the disk. What you could do is before shrinking it, turn off hibernation, and defrag your C Drive, so that it will consolidate all the free spaces then you can shrink further more.

EDIT: In addition, You could also temporarily set Pagefile.sys to no pagefile before running defrag.

Click to expand...

I'll remember that, thanks.

(I'm actually quite liking W8.1, more than I thought I would if I'm honest although I've a couple of minor issues to solve yet)

You might have some problems with a partition that small, just Hibernate and swap file will fill that up in a hurry, ad to that restore points, updated system files and other hidden stuff and needing 5 - 10 GB empty. I wouldn't go under 60 - 80 GB partition.

Thanks Mike appreciate that, its really sound advice.

(I have my own unique (lol) way of setting up a clean install... that goes something like... turn off system restore (I use Acronis) turn off defrag, set Windows Update to notify only. Only go online for updates only when I'm ready and all drivers installed. Then Windows updates only, and make a recovery image from all that lot. You get one clean install doing that I find)

Mooly said:

Thanks Mike appreciate that, its really sound advice.

(I have my own unique (lol) way of setting up a clean install... that goes something like... turn off system restore (I use Acronis) turn off defrag, set Windows Update to notify only. Only go online for updates only when I'm ready and all drivers installed. Then Windows updates only, and make a recovery image from all that lot. You get one clean install doing that I find)

Click to expand...

Similar here, Just using Macrium Reflect free and make system restore big enough for about two points for system drive/ partition only. Deleted files do not go to recycle bin and after updating system, as soon as I'm sure that I'm not going to reverse them, they go bye-bye too. Only tools I use for cleaning is windows own disk cleaner and eventually a duplicate finder program but mostly for other drives. All other stuff (like Downloads, music, pictures etc.) that can be made to to automatically go to other drives in their respective folders are set accordingly. Whole system drive with just most needed programs is fairly regularly backed up by Reflect to another drive. I also keep a backup of first, pristine windows setup, it is pretty small like that and saves a lot of time and nerves if disaster strikes. As I am a "packratt" when it comes to programs and files, I keep everything important backed up to removable drive/s, some data even twice.
Right now my system's 120GB (111 GB formatted) SSD has 80 GB free together with Linux in a VM. I like a clean system/boot drive. When I'm in a hurry I might drop some files on it because of its speed but clean them up as soon as possible. All safe, sound and fist like that.

Seems like we think alike !

I'm just trying the free trial of Macrium (I've always used Acronis before, TI10 on Vista and TI2012 on W7) but found the 2012 a bit buggy although it does the basics OK. And Acronis is a bit expensive too. I do daily running incrementals, new sequence weekly. I'm just finding my way around Macrium at the moment, done a restore OK from a four set incremental but found I had to use bootable media rather than running from within Windows like Acronis. Seems it can be done though, just not with the trial version. We shall see.

Yeah, cleanliness next to..... my grandmother would say 10 times a day (together with that thing about apples and doctors of course), just one more thing I use "Revo uninstaller" to uninstall programs so they do not leave any "tails" behind like regular, windows one does.
I actually prefer restoring with removable boot media on Macrium Reflect, made a CD and a USB drive for it. Like that it can be used on any computer, not only one it's made on. I think that with pro version it has Windows PE on it.

CountMike said:

Yeah, cleanliness next to..................

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Absolutely ! Hmmm Revo. Never tried that one, I know lots of folk recommend it. One to put on the "to do and investigate" list.

Mooly said:

CountMike said:

Yeah, cleanliness next to..................

Click to expand...

Absolutely ! Hmmm Revo. Never tried that one, I know lots of folk recommend it. One to put on the "to do and investigate" list.

Click to expand...

Do that, I'm using it for quite long time. Free version is "close enough for a hand grenade". I would be rifling thru registry for years without it. Quite a few programs go thru my system all the time.

I might just do that because my time with W8.1 Enterprise is "play time" really and where I can try stuff and experiment.