Windows 8 — Disappointing Usability

Windows 8 — Disappointing Usability for Both Novice and Power Users

Summary:
Hidden features, reduced discoverability, cognitive overhead from dual environments, and reduced power from a single-window UI and low information density. Too bad.

Windows 8 — Disappointing Usability for Both Novice & Power Users (Jakob Nielsen's Alertbox)
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[BillWindows]

It would be a shame to lose someone who tells the truth and hopefully if enough people complain Microsoft will again make a functional desktop OS.

So you think someone saying it took two days of upgrading and lost $15 is the truth, I'd say its just sarcasm , but that's just me.

 

[labeeman]

Bought a laptop in late November turned it on and booted it for the first time set it up and every thing then did a windows update and the first time the download was over 150 mb the second time it was 250+ mb I do not remember what it was the third time. NOT a good omen for a system just released less than thirty days tells me not enough testing was done. Then to find out there will be in six months a major service pack (windows blue) NOT a good omen either. This tells me it was really rushed out the door half baked.

If this was rushed out the door what were all the beta testers doing for 12 months or whatever. Instead of worrying about what's coming, why don't you try to get used to what's here. Not that it takes much getting used to, it's almost child's play really.

You are right it is child's play.The UI is designed for a TOY.

 

[BillWindows]

Bought a laptop in late November turned it on and booted it for the first time set it up and every thing then did a windows update and the first time the download was over 150 mb the second time it was 250+ mb I do not remember what it was the third time. NOT a good omen for a system just released less than thirty days tells me not enough testing was done. Then to find out there will be in six months a major service pack (windows blue) NOT a good omen either. This tells me it was really rushed out the door half baked.

If this was rushed out the door what were all the beta testers doing for 12 months or whatever. Instead of worrying about what's coming, why don't you try to get used to what's here. Not that it takes much getting used to, it's almost child's play really.

You are right it is child's play.The UI is designed for a TOY.

if you knew anything about computers and graphics you'd know it's designed for speed, but you already knew that.

 

[labeeman]

If this was rushed out the door what were all the beta testers doing for 12 months or whatever. Instead of worrying about what's coming, why don't you try to get used to what's here. Not that it takes much getting used to, it's almost child's play really.

You are right it is child's play.The UI is designed for a TOY.

if you knew anything about computers and graphics you'd know it's designed for speed, but you already knew that.

Pure HOG WASH. I and Millions of Microsoft customers know it is one of the Slowest UI to come out of Microsoft. Even Microsoft thinks it is a toy from all the commercials showing it as a TOY.

 

[BillWindows]

You are right it is child's play.The UI is designed for a TOY.

if you knew anything about computers and graphics you'd know it's designed for speed, but you already knew that.

Pure HOG WASH. I and Millions of Microsoft customers know it is one of the Slowest UI to come out of Microsoft. Even Microsoft thinks it is a toy from all the commercials showing it as a TOY.

I bow to your superior knowledge.

 

[steveb]

Spot on LabeeMan. I made this point about the adverts before.
Recent Mac advert showed people doing creative productive stuff.
The old I'm a PC showed people doing clever productive, creative stuff.
The Windows8 ads show a bunch of idiots dancing around waving their kiddy toys at each other, no indication that you can actually do anything with it.

Those of use that use it know there is a good OS lurking under there it's just that MS doesn't want anyone to know it so they hid it behind the Metro toy UI! You just need to loose Metro before you can do anything worthwhile with it unless you are on a tablet.

 

[dweebken]

I lost $15 and two days of my life upgrading to Windows 8. I didn't run into any problems with important drivers or software but I mean does the market really need Windows 8? Is there a demand from consumers for such an operating system from Microsoft? I think for the time being the world is not ready for Windows 8 which makes me a part of that, I'll be re-installing Windows 7 and taking my leave from this forum.

and lose another two days or more of your life reinstalling all the apps and data. Good luck with that. Really, I found W8 pretty good once I got past those first few days of learning (in my own time, admittedly). I certainly wouldn't want to waste more time going back to the old stuff when this is now working perfectly well and in many ways much better, like 30 second cold boots (instead of several minutes)!

This kind of complaint happens every time there's a new version of an OS. Everyone wants a new OS but so many people don't want it to drive differently. So why bother buying it if you don't want to change? If you want the same-old, then please stick with the same-old and don't complain you weren't spoon-fed. And good luck buying your next computer. It'll have W8 by default I guess, like mine will.

 

[HippsieGypsie]

Yes but I don't agree that this is a mistake, it's just going to take a while for people to understand that the world is changing and Microsoft has to change with it.

I like the idea of one operating system across multiple devices, less confusing.

This may be off topic for a bit, but I will attempt to show that it is not, so please bear with me.

"Show me a sane man and I will cure him". ~ Carl Jung

I learned this statement while taking psychology as a senior in high school way back in '68/'69. Jung was a young contemporary of the elder Sigmund Freud. These are men that laid down certain basic principles in human thinking and behavior. While running into some trouble in my human development later in life, I learned what Jung was saying in his statement -> Every human is insane in one way or another. To take it a little farther in layman's terms -> We are "goofy" in our own little way.

I'm not ashamed to say that my wife at the time and I went to counseling while struggling to keep a marriage alive. We were in our young thirties. I learned quite a lot about myself (my "goofyness") and my partner. I think anyone that's involved romantically for a time will understand that every now and then we look at our partner as if they were a total stranger only to find that we are just seeing and realizing another facet of their personality or of a change due to their development. It catches us off guard somewhat for we see them acting "abnormally" to us. Please keep in mind that the scenario could be reversed.

I learned that either I or we accept the change and move forward or take a different stance or direction within the situation. It may be any situation in life. Unfortunately (or rather fortunately in long term) we both would not accept the direction each of us desired to go in life, so we decided it best to part ways. We grew apart so much so that we were no longer happy in the marriage. Overall I learned that just because two individuals love one another doesn't necessarily mean they're compatible in a marriage. It was difficult at first, but in the long run we realized it was for the best for both.

So to get back on topic along with what BillWindows stated -> Change is a constant in the universe. Companies decide to go in a different direction. Markets change. Technology changes. People change. Even the time factor of change changes in that it seems they/we have to keep up in a exponentially faster pace of change when it comes to technology. "Don't miss the bus" so to speak. In relation to that the electronic computer was invented in the 1940's we are now seeing change at almost what I would estimate is at a biannual pace.

People need time to adjust to change. Yes, 8 is a great change in relationship to what MS has developed before. It seems "abnormal" to us. I think if one steps back to look at the "big picture" of what MS is trying to accomplish, one might see things in a different light.

It is of my opinion that 8 is targeted for the general population to gain market share of what others are winning at. Call it a toy if you will, but that is exactly what that particular market is demanding. Ok -> A toy for the general population to use to check communications of email, IM, Facebook, Twitter, shopping, or what have you if that's what tickles your fancy. They are not power users as many of us are or what enterprise demands of an OS.

Who here really thinks that MS is so stupid or ignorant to leave us or enterprise in the dust?! I think you will see and time will tell that eventually they will develop on OS or an addon to 8 that will appease and satisfy that market. I think some businesses will adopt it, but most won't. They'll stick to past OSs for time is really on MS's side while trying to take another market share.

I lost $15 and two days of my life upgrading to Windows 8. I didn't run into any problems with important drivers or software but I mean does the market really need Windows 8? Is there a demand from consumers for such an operating system from Microsoft? I think for the time being the world is not ready for Windows 8 which makes me a part of that, I'll be re-installing Windows 7 and taking my leave from this forum.

I feel that you learned fast at what I was referring to above. You may be the smartest amongst us. If 8 doesn't fit your needs, then stick with what works for you. You couldn't accept the change for what it is and you're not wasting your valuable time to make it what it is not. Perfectly understandable IMO. My hat off to you, Nemix!

My only disagreement with your statement is that some of the world is ready for 8, not all. I sincerely dislike to see you go as a fellow member, but if that's what you decide, so be it. Good luck to you in your every endeavour.

 

[Max Peck]

and lose another two days or more of your life reinstalling all the apps and data. Good luck with that. Really, I found W8 pretty good once I got past those first few days of learning (in my own time, admittedly). I certainly wouldn't want to waste more time going back to the old stuff when this is now working perfectly well and in many ways much better, like 30 second cold boots (instead of several minutes)!

W8 is fine, but let's dispense with the 30-second cold-boot right now. The 30-second cold boot will get you to the login screen and the Metro interface. However if you will watch closely, Windows continues to initialize the desktop system in the background as it would have under Win7. The overhead of loading drivers, etc, renders even the Metro front-end useless until the desktop initialization is complete. Oh yeah, you can click on a tile (and some of the live ones may start updating onscreen) but notice that any Metro app loads extremely slow because of the background load. On a complex system like mine it still takes a minute or two before things settle down and the machine is useful.

On a system where you have not installed any desktop applications (primarily a tablet) then a 30-second boot is "real" but only to the extent that you haven't got much in the Windows Desktop loading. The 30-second cold-boot is an illusion.

This isn't a negative thing, really ... I'm used to a cold boot taking a couple of minutes before everything settles down. That's why I put the machine to sleep rather than cold boot it most of the time. (Returning from sleep IS fast - just as it was under Win7). During the cold boot I just go get a cup of coffee or something. I honestly don't know why people get so upset about the system taking a couple minutes from cold boot. We used to refer to a "boot" as the re-IPL (Initial Program Load) of the system. It always takes longer to initial load an O/S and always will. Even an iPad (or iPhone) takes a long time to re-IPL, they (and other tablets) are only "instant-on" because they're in sleep mode most of the time. This is just the nature of the beast. Loading O/S services just takes time. I won't bother explaining why - it just does.

The overall system is still the same. It's still a Windows NT kernel with all its subsystems. The desktop system doesn't wait for you to click the desktop tile to set up - it's doing this anyway. Windows 8 isn't as much different as everybody thinks it is. Metro is simply (well, maybe not simply​) another display and execution engine that's bolted on top of Windows NT. Microsoft is presenting an ILLUSION of quick start-up, but in actuality it's the same as it always has been - they just put some pretty stuff front-and-center to make you think your system is up and running. It ain't ... not until desktop is completely initialized. Most GUI applications have components that, as developers, we call "keep user busy" components - parts of the program that display stuff and give the user something to do while the real work is getting done. The Login Screen and Metro "Start" screen are all low-overhead items that are given front-facing execution priority to keep the user busy while the system initializes. Everybody is being fooled into thinking the system started faster when, in actuality, it hasn't changed at all - they just put one of the display subsystems up sooner so you think​ the start up is faster.

Again, this isn't negative, really ... but it's smoke and mirrors on Microsoft's part. Pure marketing.

-Max

 

[azasadny]

I'm getting more than a little frustrated with Win8 as I use it on my main PC at home. Formerly simple tasks are more difficult and require me to "think", which I hate to do! Win8 seems to be several steps backward in terms of usability as Win7 was vey efficient and useful to me. I'll stick with Win8, but only because it's part of my job to be thoroughly familiar with the current operating systems.

 

[Max Peck]

I'm getting more than a little frustrated with Win8 as I use it on my main PC at home. Formerly simple tasks are more difficult and require me to "think", which I hate to do! Win8 seems to be several steps backward in terms of usability as Win7 was vey efficient and useful to me. I'll stick with Win8, but only because it's part of my job to be thoroughly familiar with the current operating systems.

Hmm. Seems like you've come full circle. Weren't you just crowing about how terrific Win8 was a couple of weeks ago?

Seems like a lot of us have gone back-and-forth over this one.

-Max

 

[dweebken]

W8 is fine, but let's dispense with the 30-second cold-boot right now. The 30-second cold boot will get you to the login screen and the Metro interface. However if you will watch closely, Windows continues to initialize the desktop system in the background as it would have under Win7. The overhead of loading drivers, etc, renders even the Metro front-end useless until the desktop initialization is complete. Oh yeah, you can click on a tile (and some of the live ones may start updating onscreen) but notice that any Metro app loads extremely slow because of the background load. On a complex system like mine it still takes a minute or two before things settle down and the machine is useful.

On a system where you have not installed any desktop applications (primarily a tablet) then a 30-second boot is "real" but only to the extent that you haven't got much in the Windows Desktop loading. The 30-second cold-boot is an illusion.

This isn't a negative thing, really ... I'm used to a cold boot taking a couple of minutes before everything settles down. That's why I put the machine to sleep rather than cold boot it most of the time. (Returning from sleep IS fast - just as it was under Win7). During the cold boot I just go get a cup of coffee or something. I honestly don't know why people get so upset about the system taking a couple minutes from cold boot. We used to refer to a "boot" as the re-IPL (Initial Program Load) of the system. It always takes longer to initial load an O/S and always will. Even an iPad (or iPhone) takes a long time to re-IPL, they (and other tablets) are only "instant-on" because they're in sleep mode most of the time. This is just the nature of the beast. Loading O/S services just takes time. I won't bother explaining why - it just does.

The overall system is still the same. It's still a Windows NT kernel with all its subsystems. The desktop system doesn't wait for you to click the desktop tile to set up - it's doing this anyway. Windows 8 isn't as much different as everybody thinks it is. Metro is simply (well, maybe not simply​) another display and execution engine that's bolted on top of Windows NT. Microsoft is presenting an ILLUSION of quick start-up, but in actuality it's the same as it always has been - they just put some pretty stuff front-and-center to make you think your system is up and running. It ain't ... not until desktop is completely initialized. Most GUI applications have components that, as developers, we call "keep user busy" components - parts of the program that display stuff and give the user something to do while the real work is getting done. The Login Screen and Metro "Start" screen are all low-overhead items that are given front-facing execution priority to keep the user busy while the system initializes. Everybody is being fooled into thinking the system started faster when, in actuality, it hasn't changed at all - they just put one of the display subsystems up sooner so you think​ the start up is faster.

Again, this isn't negative, really ... but it's smoke and mirrors on Microsoft's part. Pure marketing.

-Max

I understand your frustration, however that's not been my experience. My 30 second cold boot takes me through the login and to the Metro interface tiles, AND clicking on the Firefox tile gets me to the internet in about 2-3 seconds flat after Metro is presented. Yes, there's other things loading in the background, but I've found that whatever I click on to actually run straight after getting to the Metro tiles actually works pretty well straight away (with just a few seconds lag at worst). I do have a 480 GB SSD, which makes all the difference.

So for me, Windows 8 is faster every which way, but spinning disk drives will seriously slow you down no matter what OS you're using. I've tried 7200 RPM drives and they were only marginally faster than the slow, tortoise-like 5400 rpm drives. I've also tried Hybrid SSD/7200 rpm drives and they were somewhat faster again than the 7200 rpm spindle-only drives but still tardy. However a full SSD drive was about 5-6 times faster than the Hybrid drive (I measured these with the free ATTO Disk Benchmark). And the SSD wasn't too expensive on eBay (and getting cheaper all the time).

 

[Max Peck]

I understand your frustration, however that's not been my experience. My 30 second cold boot takes me through the login and to the Metro interface tiles, AND clicking on the Firefox tile gets me to the internet in about 2-3 seconds flat after Metro is presented. Yes, there's other things loading in the background, but I've found that whatever I click on to actually run straight after getting to the Metro tiles actually works pretty well straight away (with just a few seconds lag at worst). I do have a 480 GB SSD, which makes all the difference.

So for me, Windows 8 is faster every which way, but spinning disk drives will seriously slow you down no matter what OS you're using. I've tried 7200 RPM drives and they were only marginally faster than the slow, tortoise-like 5400 rpm drives. I've also tried Hybrid SSD/7200 rpm drives and they were somewhat faster again than the 7200 rpm spindle-only drives but still tardy. However a full SSD drive was about 5-6 times faster than the Hybrid drive (I measured these with the free ATTO Disk Benchmark). And the SSD wasn't too expensive on eBay (and getting cheaper all the time).

You misread me. I'm not frustrated at all. I'm speaking in point-of-fact.

My system is very complex, a lot of development tools and services which take time to start up. Win8 does not boot any faster overall, just the Metro subsystems load first. That you can get to Firefox quickly is irrelevant. Try loading SQL Server and a bunch of other utilities that require start-up processes and you'll see what I'm talking about. A development box like mine is simply going to take more time to cold start, that's all.

Once Win8 is up and running and all services have settled down, yes, it's quite fast. Whether it's faster than Win7 I'm not sure but it doesn't really matter; it's plenty fast enough running on an i5 with 8GB of main.

Sure, SSD's are going to speed the process up - of course: they're memory based instead of rotating storage. When they come out with a SSD that can replace my 1TB hard drive without breaking the bank then maybe I'll think about it. In the meantime this one is fine.

-Max

 

[Ray8]

I find that the Windows 8 start menu comes up very fast after login, but nothing is usable until all the background processes have completed, so the actual start-up time is really no shorter than for Windows 7.

 

[azasadny]

I'm getting more than a little frustrated with Win8 as I use it on my main PC at home. Formerly simple tasks are more difficult and require me to "think", which I hate to do! Win8 seems to be several steps backward in terms of usability as Win7 was vey efficient and useful to me. I'll stick with Win8, but only because it's part of my job to be thoroughly familiar with the current operating systems.

Hmm. Seems like you've come full circle. Weren't you just crowing about how terrific Win8 was a couple of weeks ago?

Seems like a lot of us have gone back-and-forth over this one.

-Max

Max,
Yes, I can see how you would remember that as the OS was new and I had not hit the little parts that frustrate me yet. To be fair, there are a few things about Win8 that I love (file transfer interface, integration with my Windows Home Server and Windows Phone 8, etc... I just get a little frustrated at the things that M$ missed... I vent at times, just ignore me...

 

[dweebken]

Sure, SSD's are going to speed the process up - of course: they're memory based instead of rotating storage. When they come out with a SSD that can replace my 1TB hard drive without breaking the bank then maybe I'll think about it. In the meantime this one is fine.
-Max

A lot of people are using an SSD for the system drive and a separate bulk hard drive for their application data. I do this too. I have a second drive - a 1.5 TB hard drive on my machine for bulk data storage. It's pretty trivial to configure the applications to point their data storage to the secondary drive in most cases. But of course if you're developing software for a specific configuration of hardware you'd have to model that for your customer.

Lotus Notes 8.5.3 also starts up very quickly for me, yet it has a large startup overhead under the Eclipse framework, but of course YMMV.

Try loading SQL Server and a bunch of other utilities that require start-up processes and you'll see what I'm talking about.
-Max

More reason to get an SSD for these applications to start up faster, but to be fair, this is not *Windows* starting up, it's the applications starting up. Windows is so often blamed for Applications wait times...

 

[Max Peck]

More reason to get an SSD for these applications to start up faster, but to be fair, this is not *Windows* starting up, it's the applications starting up. Windows is so often blamed for Applications wait times...

Agreed, it is the applications. However, as I said earlier, the O/S being configured the same way it was before the upgrade takes an almost identical amount of time to "settle" as it did before.

I'm not concerned about the performance of the hard drive in this box. Once the system has settled down everything performs fine. My primary machine is a notebook (Inspiron 17R). I don't think there's a drive bay in there for a primary SSD and secondary hard drive. I have a 2TB external USB drive for backups and offline storage. A SSD would be a luxury at this point that I really don't need.

-Max

 

[Dave76]

I think the 17R has one drive bay, the Special Edition may have two. The XPS 17 has two.
My old Studio 1737 (C2Duo) has two drive bays, SSD in one and HDD in the other. The SSD made me hold off on an upgrade, it's very fast now and have been getting up to 7 hrs battery life.

 

[Max Peck]

I think the 17R has one drive bay, the Special Edition may have two. The XPS 17 has two.
My old Studio 1737 (C2Duo) has two drive bays, SSD in one and HDD in the other. The SSD made me hold off on an upgrade, it's very fast now and have been getting up to 7 hrs battery life.

Seven hours, eh? That's excellent. Mine is getting close to 3 which is fine for me, I'm never far from a power outlet. The 17R is more like a desktop replacement than a "laptop" anyway. Good box. I just got this one around last June. Ought to last many moons.

If they'd just come out with a 1TB SSD that I could swap this one out with (and not break the bank in the process) I'd probably consider it. However ... it's fine as it is.

-Max

 

[sec]

I am by no means a PC expert. I have been using PC's since Windows 95 and have used every version of Windows with the exception of Windows Vista. The bad press concerning Vista (at the time) kept me away from it and in hindsight, I'm glad I stayed away. I was reluctant to give Windows 8 a try because of the bad press again; however I wanted to take advantage of the 'upgrade before Jan. 31, 2013' deal for such a great price, and I am glad I did. With a few minimal steps (i.e. getting a third party START button), I say I am using Windows 7 (formerly my favorite version) that has so much more power, options, and versatility and it is called Windows 8. I won't post anything negative about it in here because it seems everyone else has that covered. I like it, I'll use it, and it works for me!