Is 8 and 8.1 creating OS illiterate smartphone users?

popeye

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Appears to me with many recent posts that new 8/8.1 users are kind of Windows illiterate. Is it because of the smartphone/tile/android generation?
 

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Not very flattering description, although quite a few posters have described themselves that way.

Maybe it has something to do with the tileworld/little squares to jab at.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
Appears to me with many recent posts that new 8/8.1 users are kind of Windows illiterate. Is it because of the smartphone/tile/android generation?
No. It is that users want to be spoon fed all of the time. If they have issues, instead of searching for the information, they come straight to the forum and we play 20 questions before we even get anywhere to a starting point.

The first time I have had to post a question in a forum. Was two weeks ago, in diychatroom.com, regarding my Induction blower is starting to go out on my furnace. It was mainly as to where I could possibly find the part cheaper then what I have found it on amazon & coziparts.com.
 

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. . Please lets get real. . .:doh:
 

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    Win 8, (VM win7, XP, Vista)
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It's the playmobile generation and 8.1 suits them. But there are also still a lot of smart people around that know their stuff.

And btw - Android is not that easy. W8Phone is a lot easier.
 

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    Vista and Win7
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    2xHP, 2xGateway, 1xDell, 1xSony
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    5 SSDs and 12 HDs
It's the playmobile generation and 8.1 suits them. But there are also still a lot of smart people around that know their stuff.

And btw - Android is not that easy. W8Phone is a lot easier.
More like the reverse opposite. I know a lot of Android users and iOS users out there, that all agree that the W8 Phone OS is the worse idea ever devised. Same with incorporating a Touch Screen interface on non-touch capable devices.

Until Microsoft Sales & Marketing wakes up and stop trying to kill their company. MS will continue in the direction over the cliff.
 

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    Linux Mint 17.2
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    Laptop
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    Toshiba Satellite C850D-st3nx1
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    AMD E1-1200 APU with Radeon (tm) HD Graphics 1.40 GHZ
    Memory
    12GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    AMD Radeon™ HD 7310 Graphics
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    Realtek HD
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    LCD
    Screen Resolution
    1366 x 768
    Hard Drives
    Crucial M500 240GB SSD
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    Logitech M525
    Internet Speed
    45/6 - ATT U-Verse
    Browser
    Google Chrome
    Antivirus
    None needed. It is Linux.
    Other Info
    Arris NVG589 Gateway; Router - Cisco RV320; Switch - Netgear GS108 8-Port Switch & Trendnet TEG-S50g 5-Port Switch; Access Points - Engenius ECB350, Trendnet TEW-638APB; NAS - Lenovo ix2-4; Printer - Brother HL-2280DW; Air Print Server - Lantronix XPrintServer

    A/V UPS - Tripp-Lite Smart 1500LCD 1500 Va/900 W.
My feeling is that Win 8 and 8.1 revealed that many users are completely Windows illiterate despite the fact that they may have been using it for years. One small example, how many new Win 8 users don't know how to change the default program for opening a given file extension? They complain that they don't like the Metro app that opens to view photos but don't know how to change things to use the program they prefer.

My sister is one such user, she has been using Windows for many years (and DOS before that) yet still has trouble copying files from one folder to another on her computer.
 

My Computer

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  • OS
    W10 Pro (desktop), W10 (laptop), W10 Pro (tablet)
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    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Home built i7-8700K, Hp Envy x360 EVO Laptop, MS Surface Pro 7
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    3.7Ghz Core i7-8700K, 11th Gen Core i7-1165G7 4.7Ghz, 10th Gen Core™ i5-1035G4 1.1Ghz
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    ASUS TUF Z370-Pro Gaming, HP, MS
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    AMD Radeon RX580, Intel Iris X Graphics, Intel Iris Plus Graphics G4
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    ATI High Definition Audio (Built-in to mobo)
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    Dual Samsung U32J59 32 inch monitors, 13.3" display, 12.3" display
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    3840x2160 (Desktop), 1920x1080 (laptop), 2736x1824 Pro 7
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    500GB ssd boot drive with 2 & 10TB Data (Desktop), 512GB ssd (laptop), 128GB SSD (tablet)
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    Antec 100
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    IBM Model M - used continuously since 1986
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    Microsoft IntelliMouse
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    Retired in 2015 after working in the tech industry for 41 years. First 10 years as a Technician, the rest as a programmer/software engineer. After 1 year of retirement, I was bored so went back to work as a Robotic Process Automation Consultant. Retired for 3rd (and final) time in 2019.
Wasn't trying to insult anyone's intelligence by asking for help here. What I was getting at it it does seem some may have jumped to 8/8.1 simply because of Metro, tiles, whatever you want to call the interface. They may not have had much previous Windows experience and seem at a loss to dig deeper into the system.

Actually, a good thing for the forum but strikes me that GUI itself makes some less prone to "get under the hood". I appreciate the responses.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Acer V3 771G-6443
    CPU
    i5-3230m
    Motherboard
    Acer VA70_HC (U3E1)
    Memory
    8GB DDR3 PC3-12800 (800 MHz)
    Graphics Card(s)
    HD4000 + GeForce GT 730M
    Sound Card
    Realtek High Definition Audio
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17" Generic PnP Display on Intel HD Graphics 4000
    Screen Resolution
    1600x900 pixels
    Hard Drives
    Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250 GB
    ADATA SSD SP900 128GB
    PSU
    90 watt brick
    Mouse
    Bluetooth
    Antivirus
    Comodo
    Other Info
    Asus RT-AC56R dual-band WRT router (Merlin firmware). Intel 7260.HMWWB.R dual-band ac wireless adapter.
@popeye,

It is the opposite.

If you look at the poor sales, it is obvious many people are trying to stay away from win8x.

The metro nonsense is repelling people, not attracting them.

Inevitably, some people end up with it - through an error of omission or commission.

They are finding for the first time ,they have to fight with the OS. They never had to do that before, so they don't know how.

If you consider how few people are inflicted with 8x, this forum is remarkably busy. That tells you something.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
MS are aware of the problem. They have no intention of ditching the metro stuff. These big updates from 8.0 to 8.1 and the forthcoming 8.1 update are trying to disguise it.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    7/8/ubuntu/Linux Deepin
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Acer V3 771G-6443
    CPU
    i5-3230m
    Motherboard
    Acer VA70_HC (U3E1)
    Memory
    8GB DDR3 PC3-12800 (800 MHz)
    Graphics Card(s)
    HD4000 + GeForce GT 730M
    Sound Card
    Realtek High Definition Audio
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17" Generic PnP Display on Intel HD Graphics 4000
    Screen Resolution
    1600x900 pixels
    Hard Drives
    Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250 GB
    ADATA SSD SP900 128GB
    PSU
    90 watt brick
    Mouse
    Bluetooth
    Antivirus
    Comodo
    Other Info
    Asus RT-AC56R dual-band WRT router (Merlin firmware). Intel 7260.HMWWB.R dual-band ac wireless adapter.
My feeling is that Win 8 and 8.1 revealed that many users are completely Windows illiterate despite the fact that they may have been using it for years. One small example, how many new Win 8 users don't know how to change the default program for opening a given file extension? They complain that they don't like the Metro app that opens to view photos but don't know how to change things to use the program they prefer.

My sister is one such user, she has been using Windows for many years (and DOS before that) yet still has trouble copying files from one folder to another on her computer.

I know all kinds of people like this ,most family members ,some of them school teachers ,,some factory managers .and customers of mine ,lawyers,teachers, nurses ect ect , some have been using windows since the 386 days dos and win 3.1 .
I made 60$ the other night setting up 2 wifi routers and making recovers thumbdrive for 2 customers ,1 retired nurse 1 retired teacher ,was it lack of knowledge or just lazy
 

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  • OS
    win8.1.1 enterprise
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    PC/Desktop
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    Hinze57
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    AMD FX 6100 6core 3.30gHz
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    gigibyte ga-78lmy-s2p
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    4gig ddr3
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    Radon hd5000 Series
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    onboard realtek hd
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    19" viewsonic/ 22"Samsung
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    1680x1050
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    128gig ssd Kingston
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    Case
    micro
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    microsoft curve 200
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless M215
    Internet Speed
    high speed 20
    Browser
    ie 11
    Antivirus
    windows defender
    Other Info
    updated enterprise apr 2/14
Seems to me like a tricky question to bash 8/8.1. Most people come here and join to ask questions because their system is broke and they need it fixed then we hardly or never see them again. It's not really to learn the system. It so happens to be a forum about Windows 8/8.1. It’s the same on 7F or any other forum. 95% could care less how the thing works, nor are they interested in learning it deeply. They just want it fixed. It’s been no different for years.

If you’re referring to the younger generation they know more about computers and/or devices with diverse OSs on them than preceding generations. Why? #1 is because a lot have been taught in schools how to use them. #2 Because PCs, laptops, and devices have become more affordable and abundant. #3 Because they want to be mobile. They don’t want to be tied to a box or a landline wall phone we grew up with.

Come to think of it 4 out of my 6 kids don’t have a desk let alone a tower PC. They have laptops, pads, and phones. They’d rather sit at coffee, kitchen, or patio table to do their stuff. The other 2 have laptops and phones as well. 5 out of 6 of them use devices for more than consumption. It’s not very often that any of them come to me for help on fixing them. Why? Because they know there’s a wealth of info about them on the Internet or help files. None of them are enthusiastic about learning all about them deeply. They just want to configure them to their liking and move on. A lot of their friends are the same.

So therefore to answer your question > No. It has nothing to do with Android, 8/8.1, Windows, tiles, icons, etc. It has to do with the degree of enthusiasm of learning about a particular subject. 95% could care less about how OSs or computers work.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    8.1 Pro X64
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    PC/Desktop
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    Acer T690
    CPU
    Intel Pentium D Dual Core
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    Acer/Intel E946GZ
    Memory
    2GB (max upgrade)
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    Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 3000 - PCI Express x16
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    Integrated RealTek ALC888 high-definition audio with 7.1 channel audio support
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    Acer AL1917W A LCD
    Screen Resolution
    1440 X 900
    Hard Drives
    350 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10
    Thumb drives
    PSU
    Standard 250 watt
    Case
    Desktop 7.2" (183mm) W x 17.5" (445mm) L x 14.5"
    Cooling
    Dual case fans + CPU fan
    Keyboard
    Acer Windows PS/2
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    Wireless Microsoft Arc
    Internet Speed
    54mbp/s
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    IE11
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    Defender
    Other Info
    Office Pro 2013 / Nokia Lumia 1520 Windows Phone 8.1DP GDR1
Doing math with a calculator is easy.

But it is very good if you can do it with a pencil & paper.

I can still do a square root with pencil & paper.

What I'm saying is, it's good to know the basics about computers or anything.

Just my opinion. :)
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1.1 Pro with Media Center
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Gateway
    CPU
    AMD K140 Cores 2 Threads 2 Name AMD K140 Package Socket FT1 BGA Technology 40nm
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    Manufacturer Gateway Model SX2110G (P0)
    Memory
    Type DDR3 Size 8192 MBytes DRAM Frequency 532.3 MHz
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    ATI AMD Radeon HD 7310 Graphics
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    AMD High Definition Audio Device Realtek High Definition Audio USB Audio Device
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    Name 1950W on AMD Radeon HD 7310 Graphics Current Resolution 1366x768 pixels Work Resolution 1366x76
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    Hard Drives
    AMD K140
    Cores 2
    Threads 2
    Name AMD K140
    Package Socket FT1 BGA
    Technology 40nm
    Specification AMD E1-1200 APU with Radeon HD Graphics
    Family F
    Extended Family 14
    Model 2
    Extended Model 2
    Stepping 0
    Revision ON-C0
    Instruction
    Browser
    Opera 24.0
    Antivirus
    Avast Internet Security
95% could care less how the thing works, nor are they interested in learning it deeply. They just want it fixed. It’s been no different for years.


That is the problem. My wife does not even know how to fill gas into the car and even less how to change a tire. And she thinks she is a driver. When she is at the gas station by herself, she asks the guy at the next pump to fill her gas - and they do it, LOL. I would say: Lady you better walk. LOL
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Vista and Win7
    System Manufacturer/Model
    2xHP, 2xGateway, 1xDell, 1xSony
    Hard Drives
    5 SSDs and 12 HDs
I'm glad you find it amusing. I find your viewpoint the same.

Here’s a typical example in the screenshot below. A “New Posts” page I just brought up. A typical day on 8F. There are maybe 2 threads here of questions on learning to navigate the system or how to perform a particular task such as help with the Video & Music app and the Mail app. One from News thread. The others are about BSODs, peripherals, some kind broken system, etc.

People are smarter than we think at learning a new system and/or it’s UI. It makes no difference if they’re “jabbing” at tiles or at icons. It makes no difference if it’s on a Start Menu or Start Screen. They all open an app just as in the past. The Store apps are no more difficult to learn than Apple or Google apps. The Window key basically works the same. In fact it’s more useful than ever. The Desktop UI works the same other than it’s considered an app. The Control Panel is just the same other than additions or a few changes as in past OSs.

The only big difference is that it boots to the Start Screen (and for a very good reason), arrangement of tiles and columns within that, hot corners, Charms bar with added features, and the Switcher bar. How difficult is that to learn? Admittedly more than migrating from past OSs, but we’re not talking rocket science here either.

Oh! Can't find the Power Button? Push the physical one to boot off and shut down just as in past OSs until you learn the new placement of it.

Screenshot (72).png
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    8.1 Pro X64
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Acer T690
    CPU
    Intel Pentium D Dual Core
    Motherboard
    Acer/Intel E946GZ
    Memory
    2GB (max upgrade)
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 3000 - PCI Express x16
    Sound Card
    Integrated RealTek ALC888 high-definition audio with 7.1 channel audio support
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Acer AL1917W A LCD
    Screen Resolution
    1440 X 900
    Hard Drives
    350 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10
    Thumb drives
    PSU
    Standard 250 watt
    Case
    Desktop 7.2" (183mm) W x 17.5" (445mm) L x 14.5"
    Cooling
    Dual case fans + CPU fan
    Keyboard
    Acer Windows PS/2
    Mouse
    Wireless Microsoft Arc
    Internet Speed
    54mbp/s
    Browser
    IE11
    Antivirus
    Defender
    Other Info
    Office Pro 2013 / Nokia Lumia 1520 Windows Phone 8.1DP GDR1
Seems people have some very strong feelings about this. I wanted a discussion and different opinions, sure got that. Careful what you wish for. Again, thanks to all for the replies.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1 Pro 64-bit
    Computer type
    Laptop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Acer V3 771G-6443
    CPU
    i5-3230m
    Motherboard
    Acer VA70_HC (U3E1)
    Memory
    8GB DDR3 PC3-12800 (800 MHz)
    Graphics Card(s)
    HD4000 + GeForce GT 730M
    Sound Card
    Realtek High Definition Audio
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17" Generic PnP Display on Intel HD Graphics 4000
    Screen Resolution
    1600x900 pixels
    Hard Drives
    Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250 GB
    ADATA SSD SP900 128GB
    PSU
    90 watt brick
    Mouse
    Bluetooth
    Antivirus
    Comodo
    Other Info
    Asus RT-AC56R dual-band WRT router (Merlin firmware). Intel 7260.HMWWB.R dual-band ac wireless adapter.
I know people who say with Pride, "I don't even know how to turn a computer on."

From the mountain country of the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.

A lot of people here like that.

Then again there are those who took the time to learn.
Lots of them too.

The trend is, more are taking the time to learn.

Some are just intimidated by the technology.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 8.1.1 Pro with Media Center
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Gateway
    CPU
    AMD K140 Cores 2 Threads 2 Name AMD K140 Package Socket FT1 BGA Technology 40nm
    Motherboard
    Manufacturer Gateway Model SX2110G (P0)
    Memory
    Type DDR3 Size 8192 MBytes DRAM Frequency 532.3 MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    ATI AMD Radeon HD 7310 Graphics
    Sound Card
    AMD High Definition Audio Device Realtek High Definition Audio USB Audio Device
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Name 1950W on AMD Radeon HD 7310 Graphics Current Resolution 1366x768 pixels Work Resolution 1366x76
    Screen Resolution
    Current Resolution 1366x768 pixels Work Resolution 1366x768 pixels
    Hard Drives
    AMD K140
    Cores 2
    Threads 2
    Name AMD K140
    Package Socket FT1 BGA
    Technology 40nm
    Specification AMD E1-1200 APU with Radeon HD Graphics
    Family F
    Extended Family 14
    Model 2
    Extended Model 2
    Stepping 0
    Revision ON-C0
    Instruction
    Browser
    Opera 24.0
    Antivirus
    Avast Internet Security
95% could care less how the thing works, nor are they interested in learning it deeply. They just want it fixed. It’s been no different for years.





That is the problem. My wife does not even know how to fill gas into the car and even less how to change a tire. And she thinks she is a driver. When she is at the gas station by herself, she asks the guy at the next pump to fill her gas - and they do it, LOL. I would say: Lady you better walk. LOL


Sounds like you married a smart woman, whs. ;)


That's human nature. We learn a great deal about what we are passionate and interested in and the rest we learn just enough to get by.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    8.1 Pro X64
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    System Manufacturer/Model
    Acer T690
    CPU
    Intel Pentium D Dual Core
    Motherboard
    Acer/Intel E946GZ
    Memory
    2GB (max upgrade)
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 3000 - PCI Express x16
    Sound Card
    Integrated RealTek ALC888 high-definition audio with 7.1 channel audio support
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Acer AL1917W A LCD
    Screen Resolution
    1440 X 900
    Hard Drives
    350 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10
    Thumb drives
    PSU
    Standard 250 watt
    Case
    Desktop 7.2" (183mm) W x 17.5" (445mm) L x 14.5"
    Cooling
    Dual case fans + CPU fan
    Keyboard
    Acer Windows PS/2
    Mouse
    Wireless Microsoft Arc
    Internet Speed
    54mbp/s
    Browser
    IE11
    Antivirus
    Defender
    Other Info
    Office Pro 2013 / Nokia Lumia 1520 Windows Phone 8.1DP GDR1
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